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Dakkites,

I know this isnt a netlist, I was trying to make something different.

LORDS
- Tyrant, General, Armour of Destiny, Other Tricksters Shard, Sword of Striking, Ironfist (293)

HEROES
- Bruiser, Battle Standard Bearer, Tailsman of Preservation, Enchanted Sheild ORRune Maw (188/198)
- Firebelly, Level 2 (Lore of Fire), Hellheart, Ironfist (208)
- Firebelly, Level 2 (Lore of Fire), Dispel Scroll, Ruby Ring, Ironfist (208)

CORE
- Ogre Bulls (10), Ironfists, Full Command, Look Out Gnoblar (355)
- Ogre Ironguts (3), Musicain (139)
- Ogre Ironguts (3), Musicain (139)
- Gnoblars (10), Trappers (50)

SPECIAL
- Leadbelchers (5), Musicain (225)
- Leadbelchers (5), Musicain (225)
- Sabre Tusk (21)
- Sabre Tusk (21)

RARE
- Ironblaster (170)
- Ironblaster (170)

2392/2400

Bulls have the General and BSB, Rank (4x3), Firebellies jump in a leadbelcher unit each (3x2). Bunker up, Ranged assalt until they get close.

I am starting to really like fire lore as well, mainly because of fireball and with 3 sources plus the funky d3 to casting if you get one off (probably the ring, people will think its just d6str4) you should compensate for lvl 2's from that. Plus the hellheart to pop to get other wizards espically lvl 4's

. Dbl ironblaster and ledbleachers are always good, plus the dual sabertusks as chaff/redirectors/warmachine hunters, triple bulls as annoyance.

Characters also look good, runemaw could work as you are one main unit but combat is where things will be decided there so I would say stick with your magic item set up.

MarkyMark: I dont really wanna loose my big unit to magic, even more so now as I am already down to only lvl 2's. You really think his magic items will save him? When the unit hits combat I have NO IDEA how it will do, however I am not optamistitic sadly, the only buff I could have would be flaming sword so even with that how well would thoose bulls and heroes do?

I'm not confident. You dont have enough guts to make a difference, but you've got leadbelchers. And the advantage of having a list people are unfamiliar with.

I like it, but I see one flaw. Ld. A single D&D could cost you dearly.

thedarkavenger: Should I swap the bulls and guts around? So a block of 9 guts with 2 smaller bull units? Would I get more milage out of that list?

 therealsuperman wrote:
thedarkavenger: Should I swap the bulls and guts around? So a block of 9 guts with 2 smaller bull units? Would I get more milage out of that list?

Wholly matchup dependent.

I'd say the guts personally as WoC are still rampant.

thedarkavenger, 6+ parry sounds worse than a +2 Strength, and the addded bonus of magic standard, Razor or something to maximise combat output?

 therealsuperman wrote:
thedarkavenger: Should I swap the bulls and guts around? So a block of 9 guts with 2 smaller bull units? Would I get more milage out of that list?

I thought the bullstar + min guts was part of the difference of the list? Gutstar + min bulls is pretty run of the mill, though I'll give you credit that you have a few other Less Obvious things happening (tyrant without a slaughtermaster, deathstar without gut magic, two big units of belchers, zero mournfang with zero d-hide banners).

I actually run the bullstar in my ogres, and let my guts run free to beat stuff up without babysitting characters. But I think to have the bullstar work - without buffs especially - you need the characters to kill stuff and absorb damage for the wee ogres surrounding them. To that end I'd likely swap the tyrant's TOTS for giantbreaker and the BSB's enchanted shield for maybe a great weapon? Together they present a wall of T5 with 4+ wards, I feel like they need some teeth too - or go the opposite and give somebody the stubborn crown? If they aren't going to kill their way clear, they better hold until help (min guts?) can do it for them.

The points you need are in that trapper upgrade. What a ridiculously expensive option, even if it's easy to nab 25 points of knights/warriors/whatever with dangerous tests

- Salvage

BossSalvage: Yeah it was part of the original design, but if its not effective lets loose it I thought mini gut darts would be effective and the defensive side of the bulls with the parry would be good, but I can switch them over no worries. Gnoblars will get dropped because they were filling points

How about MR in the unit then instead of rune maw? if its purple sun you are dicked anyway but seeing as it doesnt target you dont think rune maw would help. Most other things you will be half decent against (final trans only on 6's and dwellers is 33% of the units).

I always talk from my prespective, so against me rune maw wouldnt bother me as from either daemons or warriors I dont run much offensive magic against blocks so YMMV.

I would combine the guts into a unit of 6 with bellower and banner. 3 man ironguts are too prone to getting panicked.

They can also actually take on a combat block. The enemy also has to kill 6 models to get points instead of only 3.

Might try having all units as 6 men units..... feasable?