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They seem to be a bit of a mystery in the fluff as they have wickedly powerful old school pattern armor and gear. And apparently not much is known about their founding either.

Any speculation?

This is all you need to know.

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Minotaurs

 Otto Weston wrote:
This is all you need to know.

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Minotaurs

I'd trust this information more.

1d4chan can have some right rubbish on it, but that writeup seems spot on to me. Basically they get the coolest toys because they do what the rulers of the Imperium tell them to.

They're world eaters

They're buddies with the High Lords. That's why they get all the fanciest toys. It's simultaneously a reward for loyalty and proper equipment for destroying renegade chapters.

 Gravewalker wrote:
They seem to be a bit of a mystery in the fluff as they have wickedly powerful old school pattern armor and gear. And apparently not much is known about their founding either.

Any speculation?

Forgeworld adopted them as another special snowflake chapter, so they got fancy gear and a mysterioussssss heritage (because knowing your genetic heritage is so boring), and some kind of unique tie to the High Lords. I'm guessing FW had grand plans to make MkVIII kits but that got squashed by GW proper.

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:
I'm guessing FW had grand plans to make MkVIII kits but that got squashed by GW proper.

The way I heard it Forge World intended to but decided it wouldn't sell enough, which I could see being the case if they actually intended to release the so-called MkVIII shown in IA10 which I like to refer to as the 'anti-MkVIII'.

They're a case of, most likely, traitor gene stock which was initially unstable, but following some "reconstruction" they're now the High Lords attack dogs, and whose equipment is a combination of priority access to Martian industrial capacity, but also the spoils of those chapters they have destroyed. The Contemptors in particular are alluded to being traitors or other "undesirable" marines entombed within the dreadnought hull and have become very unstable, with the Minos using them more as shock weapons than the usual revered ancestor and preserver of legacy.

I view them as more a case of what the Imperium is capable of producing, should the highest authorities have an interest in it, in this case a chapter which fights far more like the legions of old; direct, uncompromising violence enacted with some of the finest technology in the universe. The "mystery" is pretty straightforwards at the end of the day, and, what I like it it's not "Deus Ex Machina" like the Sanguinor or the other tendencies of the snowflake chapters.

More or less, they're what happens when a Space Marine chapter has the full support of the Administratum/High Lords. Some theorize they come from the Geneseed of a Traitor Legion (likely the World Eaters), whereas some say the reason their history is kept hidden is because the High Lords tampered with geneseed to make a subservient chapter for their own uses.

In the end we might never know, but it's fun to guess.

 Darth Bob wrote:
More or less, they're what happens when a Space Marine chapter has the full support of the Administratum/High Lords. Some theorize they come from the Geneseed of a Traitor Legion (likely the World Eaters), whereas some say the reason their history is kept hidden is because the High Lords tampered with geneseed to make a subservient chapter for their own uses.

In the end we might never know, but it's fun to guess.

course it could also be possiable that their geneseed is kept hidden simply to stop them forging closer ties with their "brother chapters" it'd be sort of make life difficult for the high lords to use em whenever needed if they where say... attending the centennial feast of blades.

BrianDavion wrote:

 Darth Bob wrote:
More or less, they're what happens when a Space Marine chapter has the full support of the Administratum/High Lords. Some theorize they come from the Geneseed of a Traitor Legion (likely the World Eaters), whereas some say the reason their history is kept hidden is because the High Lords tampered with geneseed to make a subservient chapter for their own uses.

In the end we might never know, but it's fun to guess.

course it could also be possiable that their geneseed is kept hidden simply to stop them forging closer ties with their "brother chapters" it'd be sort of make life difficult for the high lords to use em whenever needed if they where say... attending the centennial feast of blades.

True, but that wouldn't explain why the information is kept from even Lord Inquisitors. Not to mention the fact that there's significant evidence that there's brainwashing and psycho-hypnotic conditioning going on with the Minotaurs, so they would only know what the High Lords want them to know, regardless.

 Gashrog wrote:

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:
I'm guessing FW had grand plans to make MkVIII kits but that got squashed by GW proper.

The way I heard it Forge World intended to but decided it wouldn't sell enough, which I could see being the case if they actually intended to release the so-called MkVIII shown in IA10 which I like to refer to as the 'anti-MkVIII'.

Bah!

Forgeworld should pay more attention to what their customers REALLY want!

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/440418.page

 Alpharius wrote:

 Gashrog wrote:

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:
I'm guessing FW had grand plans to make MkVIII kits but that got squashed by GW proper.

The way I heard it Forge World intended to but decided it wouldn't sell enough, which I could see being the case if they actually intended to release the so-called MkVIII shown in IA10 which I like to refer to as the 'anti-MkVIII'.

Bah!

Forgeworld should pay more attention to what their customers REALLY want!

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/440418.page

That first piece of art has always been one of my favorites. I would kill for a kit of those.

 Alpharius wrote:

 Gashrog wrote:

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:
I'm guessing FW had grand plans to make MkVIII kits but that got squashed by GW proper.

The way I heard it Forge World intended to but decided it wouldn't sell enough, which I could see being the case if they actually intended to release the so-called MkVIII shown in IA10 which I like to refer to as the 'anti-MkVIII'.

Bah!

Forgeworld should pay more attention to what their customers REALLY want!

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/440418.page

Haha. I've got a ton of spare Beakies and MK VI legs and collared torsos since I don't use them. My buddy keeps bugging me to give them to him, but my first inclination (other than to become a monk and leave the situation, but every dark tunnel has a light of hope) is that I could probably sell them on Ebay for a fair clip, lol.

I'd probably use the collared Mk VIII torsos if they'd fit the normal heads. They only work with bare heads (which again I don't use) and the one Sergeant head (which I use on heavy weapons Marines).

Which MkVIII in IA10 are you talking about? I don't remember that one. The was a MkVIII Minotaur in IA12, but it was normal; just had the Champion-style two-layer shoulderpads.

I'm one of those beakies-only guys. I have to purchase a lot of them on ebay every time I get a new box of marines. Only my HQ models are allowed to have different helmets! I do love the oversized lower arm armor in that sketch, though. I'd use that if it existed.

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:

Which MkVIII in IA10 are you talking about? I don't remember that one. The was a MkVIII Minotaur in IA12, but it was normal; just had the Champion-style two-layer shoulderpads.

Line drawing in the section on power armour marks. It was straight up Mk7 in every way except for having the Company Champion Torso and shoulderpads, which is just frickin bizarre given that the original Mk8 model used the regular Mk7 plastic shoulderpads unlike the rest of the armour variants.. I'd forgotten about the Minotaur in IA12 which at least has the ankle nubs, but swaps the Mk8 armoured gutbox for the variant Mk6 cabling which Forge World always uses on their FRICKIN MK7 ART.

 j31c3n wrote:
I'm one of those beakies-only guys. I have to purchase a lot of them on ebay every time I get a new box of marines. Only my HQ models are allowed to have different helmets! I do love the oversized lower arm armor in that sketch, though. I'd use that if it existed.

I love the Space Hounskull Bascinets as well. It's a shame Chaos Space Marine kits don't come with them. They also make sense as a helmet design, given they'd drive projectiles and blades away from the center of the face with minimal damage.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Gashrog wrote:

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:

Which MkVIII in IA10 are you talking about? I don't remember that one. The was a MkVIII Minotaur in IA12, but it was normal; just had the Champion-style two-layer shoulderpads.

Line drawing in the section on power armour marks. It was straight up Mk7 in every way except for having the Company Champion Torso and shoulderpads, which is just frickin bizarre given that the original Mk8 model used the regular Mk7 plastic shoulderpads unlike the rest of the armour variants.. I'd forgotten about the Minotaur in IA12 which at least has the ankle nubs, but swaps the Mk8 armoured gutbox for the variant Mk6 cabling which Forge World always uses on their FRICKIN MK7 ART.

You got a link to a pic?

Well, to be fair, the original two Mk8 models came out when that was the only kind of shoulder pad being used, as the old RTB-01 ones wouldn't fit on that generation of plastic arm.

The OG Mk IV ones did too http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a118/Gagoc/Sources/GW_Mk4s.jpg

Mk IV has always been a mystery to me why it's so popular. The duck-face helmet always turned me off.

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:
Well, to be fair, the original two Mk8 models came out when that was the only kind of shoulder pad being used, as the old RTB-01 ones wouldn't fit on that generation of plastic arm.

The OG Mk IV ones did too http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a118/Gagoc/Sources/GW_Mk4s.jpg

Mk IV has always been a mystery to me why it's so popular. The duck-face helmet always turned me off.

Do you live near a nuclear testing site? Maximus Helms look nothing like duck bills.

I think he's referring to their odd tiny vox grills. They look like puckered "duckface" lips.

The original Mk8 didn't have plastic arms, just the pad:
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2850/10247892535_a39d276c5e_o.jpg

It was the only one of the first generation variants to do that, the rest had cast-on pads:
http://www.solegends.com/citcat1991a/cat1991ap007smarmourvariants-00.htm

 Wyzilla wrote:

You got a link to a pic?

This is the Minotaur from IA12
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/7/74/Minotaurs_Tact._Marine.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20130625231434

The line drawing lacked the ankle nubs and the torso was literally a drawing of the company champion torso:
http://www.bitzbox.co.uk/product_info.php/space-marine-command-squad-company-champion-body-front-p-558
with a normal belt buckle in lieu of the arches and loincloth.

 Gashrog wrote:
The original Mk8 didn't have plastic arms, just the pad:
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2850/10247892535_a39d276c5e_o.jpg

It was the only one of the first generation variants to do that, the rest had cast-on pads:
http://www.solegends.com/citcat1991a/cat1991ap007smarmourvariants-00.htm

 Wyzilla wrote:

You got a link to a pic?

This is the Minotaur from IA12
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/7/74/Minotaurs_Tact._Marine.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20130625231434

The line drawing lacked the ankle nubs and the torso was literally a drawing of the company champion torso:
http://www.bitzbox.co.uk/product_info.php/space-marine-command-squad-company-champion-body-front-p-558
with a normal belt buckle in lieu of the arches and loincloth.

I don't think that's actually a part of Errant Armor, but rather artificer armor/general space marine bling. I always though it was more of an honorary thing, like wearing the broken armor of your old Sergeant or some dead hero of the Chapter. But I do understand your view on it, it's ugly. I wish GW or FW would start producing these kits, maybe even make them new units because of the power fists, but it'd be nice to see the "true" Errant Armor be given a model.

Thuffering thuccotash!






This one gets a pass for basically being a proto-MkVII helmet, since the MkVII helmet was an improved version of the MkIV helmet, I'm guessing they were trying to show the transition.

I still really don't see the similarity. To me it just looks like a dude with a really big chin, especially the old metal models.

Sorry, but how does that look like a duck, exactly? I must be missing something.


Does anyone know if they've ever utilized the big Power Fist gauntlets from that old sketch in any other pieces of art with Mk VIII?

The modern ones are kinda ducklike, the original style (with the metal shoulderpads) are more like parakeets.

 Darth Bob wrote:
Sorry, but how does that look like a duck, exactly? I must be missing something.


Does anyone know if they've ever utilized the big Power Fist gauntlets from that old sketch in any other pieces of art with Mk VIII?

I can't even recall any real artwork of Errant Armor. All that ever seems to show up is the gorget and nothing else. And honestly, the gorget alone doesn't constitute a whole new model of power armor- even older models of power armor could have a gorget mounted.

 Darth Bob wrote:
Sorry, but how does that look like a duck, exactly? I must be missing something.

It appears so. But the flattened duck bill is as plain as day, and always has been. Especially in the original models.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Gashrog wrote:
The modern ones are kinda ducklike, the original style (with the metal shoulderpads) are more like parakeets.

I will have to admit to not being an ornithologist. Daffy Duck was just always the most immediate reference for that helmet.

There's definitely some parakeet action going on here:



But, to be fair, they aren't the only Marines designed after cartoon birds.

I have to admit, the helmet does look like the beak of a parakeet, especially the nostrils.