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I wanted to check because I've heard people say Pink horrors get Flickering Fire free, but I believe that's from the Psychic Focus rule, as I can't see in the codex where it says they come with Flickering Fire automatically.

If I take a 10 man unit of Pink Horrors, I can generate either a Primaris and a Power from the Change or the Malefic disciplines, correct? But if I take a 11 man unit for ML 2, I can take a power of both or take three from Malefic or Change, right?

The get Flicker Fire from Chaos Focus for being a demon of tzeentch

They don't change mastery level ever. Increasing unit size only gives you extra warp charges. The only generate Flicker Fire and what ever power they roll.

 jreilly89 wrote:
I wanted to check because I've heard people say Pink horrors get Flickering Fire free, but I believe that's from the Psychic Focus rule, as I can't see in the codex where it says they come with Flickering Fire automatically.

If I take a 10 man unit of Pink Horrors, I can generate either a Primaris and a Power from the Change or the Malefic disciplines, correct? But if I take a 11 man unit for ML 2, I can take a power of both or take three from Malefic or Change, right?

Pink horrors get Flickering Fire because of the Chaos Psychic Focus rule

Ah, right on. Where is the Chaos Psychic Focus? Is that in the codex or the BRB?

Also, can a Pink Horrors unit use Possession to summon a Greater Daemon without having a Herald?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 CrownAxe wrote:
The get Flicker Fire from Chaos Focus for being a demon of tzeentch

They don't change mastery level ever. Increasing unit size only gives you extra warp charges. The only generate Flicker Fire and what ever power they roll.

So they only get Flickering Fire + a power whatever table they roll on?

They can also get the Primaris Power from whatever discipline they generate powers from through Psychic Focus, as long as they stick to one table.

So if you have a 10 man unit they get Flickering Fire from Chaos Focus anyway, then if you generate their power from Malefic they will also gain Summoning through Psychic Focus in addition to whatever power they roll.

^ is debatable. Some say Chaos Psychic focus cancels out regular psychic focus.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Most large tournaments play it that way anyways.

From page 22 of the rules

Psychic Focus
"If a psyker generates all of his powers from the same psychic discipline (even if he can only generate one power), that Psyker is said to have Psychic Focus, and gains that discipline's primaris power in addition to his other powers. If during the course of the game, that Psyker gains a psychic power from a different psychic discipline, he immediately loses Psychic Focus."

Chaos Psychic Focus
"If a Psyker has a mark of Chaos or is a daemon of a particular chaos god (see codex: Chaos Space Marines or Codex: Chaos Daemons), that model automatically knows the primaris power of the discipline that corresponds to their patron deity, in addition to any other powers it knows."

I hope that nobody minds me quoting the rules, it's pretty much what the OP asked for.
As for canceling out regular psychic focus, well, I am not 100% sure either way, you could argue it endlessly, but I'd play it that you get the Chaos primaris from your table and can roll on one other psychic table and swap it out for the primaris if you didn't like it, but you can't have the primaris for free as well as your roll.

 Registered Ork Offender wrote:
From page 22 of the rules

Psychic Focus
"If a psyker generates all of his powers from the same psychic discipline (even if he can only generate one power), that Psyker is said to have Psychic Focus, and gains that discipline's primaris power in addition to his other powers. If during the course of the game, that Psyker gains a psychic power from a different psychic discipline, he immediately loses Psychic Focus."

Chaos Psychic Focus
"If a Psyker has a mark of Chaos or is a daemon of a particular chaos god (see codex: Chaos Space Marines or Codex: Chaos Daemons), that model automatically knows the primaris power of the discipline that corresponds to their patron deity, in addition to any other powers it knows."

I hope that nobody minds me quoting the rules, it's pretty much what the OP asked for.
As for canceling out regular psychic focus, well, I am not 100% sure either way, you could argue it endlessly, but I'd play it that you get the Chaos primaris from your table and can roll on one other psychic table and swap it out for the primaris if you didn't like it, but you can't have the primaris for free as well as your roll.

That is excellent, thank you! Yeah, I'll play it as the Chaos Primaris and then one extra power, rather than trying to game the system and say I get the Primaris for free in addition to my normal roll.

Hey I'm not trying to game the system - I was originally playing it that you couldn't get both the Chaos Focus and normal Psychic Focus. But then a lot of threads cropped up regarding Chaos Sorcerers who also get Chaos Focus but have to generate at least one power from their patrons discipline.

The issue there was whether the Chaos Focus power then counted for the required one to be generated from the patrons discipline, leaving you free to roll your powers on whichever tables you could pick from. The consensus seemed to be that the Chaos Focus power didn't count as being "generated" because you didn't roll for it, and you still had to roll for another power on the god-specific table to satisfy the rules requirement.

Applying this logic to the Daemons Codex would then mean that if the Chaos Focus power isn't being generated, and you roll for all your powers on one table (e.g. Malefic) you would then gain the Primaris for that discipline through Psychic Focus. I'm not 100% sure either but you can't play it one way for CSM and another for Daemons.

 Tonberry7 wrote:
Hey I'm not trying to game the system - I was originally playing it that you couldn't get both the Chaos Focus and normal Psychic Focus. But then a lot of threads cropped up regarding Chaos Sorcerers who also get Chaos Focus but have to generate at least one power from their patrons discipline.

The issue there was whether the Chaos Focus power then counted for the required one to be generated from the patrons discipline, leaving you free to roll your powers on whichever tables you could pick from. The consensus seemed to be that the Chaos Focus power didn't count as being "generated" because you didn't roll for it, and you still had to roll for another power on the god-specific table to satisfy the rules requirement.

Applying this logic to the Daemons Codex would then mean that if the Chaos Focus power isn't being generated, and you roll for all your powers on one table (e.g. Malefic) you would then gain the Primaris for that discipline through Psychic Focus. I'm not 100% sure either but you can't play it one way for CSM and another for Daemons.

Tonberry I'm not calling you out, I'm just saying, in my mind, it makes more sense to have less powers than more, you know? I understand your logic, but until an FAQ comes out, I'd rather err on the side of caution.

 Tonberry7 wrote:
Hey I'm not trying to game the system - I was originally playing it that you couldn't get both the Chaos Focus and normal Psychic Focus. But then a lot of threads cropped up regarding Chaos Sorcerers who also get Chaos Focus but have to generate at least one power from their patrons discipline.

The issue there was whether the Chaos Focus power then counted for the required one to be generated from the patrons discipline, leaving you free to roll your powers on whichever tables you could pick from. The consensus seemed to be that the Chaos Focus power didn't count as being "generated" because you didn't roll for it, and you still had to roll for another power on the god-specific table to satisfy the rules requirement.

Applying this logic to the Daemons Codex would then mean that if the Chaos Focus power isn't being generated, and you roll for all your powers on one table (e.g. Malefic) you would then gain the Primaris for that discipline through Psychic Focus. I'm not 100% sure either but you can't play it one way for CSM and another for Daemons.

Actually, Daemons do get to play it both ways...

Chaos Psychic Focus was meant to help out marked Chaos Sorcerers & DP's, who must always roll at least 1 power from their respective God's Psychic Lore (but can never take more than half their rolls from that Lore). Hence, for CSM's, it's 100% impossible to ever gain Psychic Focus with Marked models.
Thus, Chaos Psychic Focus gives them the added power to make-up for this gaff.

Chaos Daemons on the other hand, may choose to roll up to half their powers from their respective God's Psychic Lore, but are not outright forced to, unlike those poor CSM dudes.
The BRB still gives them the Chaos Psychic Focus, (likely because GW thought it would be silly for only one type of Chaos army to get it, but not the other), yet Daemons are still fully able to roll all of their powers from one of the basic BRB Lores and hence, will then trigger the Psychic Focus requirement.


Sure it's stupid, and an unfair advantage to Daemons, but it's only because GW screwed up first with the way Chaos Marines vs. Daemons generate their powers, and then yet again by putting a Band-Aid solution in the BRB which gave one side a double benefit.

Experiment 626 wrote:

 Tonberry7 wrote:
Hey I'm not trying to game the system - I was originally playing it that you couldn't get both the Chaos Focus and normal Psychic Focus. But then a lot of threads cropped up regarding Chaos Sorcerers who also get Chaos Focus but have to generate at least one power from their patrons discipline.

The issue there was whether the Chaos Focus power then counted for the required one to be generated from the patrons discipline, leaving you free to roll your powers on whichever tables you could pick from. The consensus seemed to be that the Chaos Focus power didn't count as being "generated" because you didn't roll for it, and you still had to roll for another power on the god-specific table to satisfy the rules requirement.

Applying this logic to the Daemons Codex would then mean that if the Chaos Focus power isn't being generated, and you roll for all your powers on one table (e.g. Malefic) you would then gain the Primaris for that discipline through Psychic Focus. I'm not 100% sure either but you can't play it one way for CSM and another for Daemons.

Actually, Daemons do get to play it both ways...

Chaos Psychic Focus was meant to help out marked Chaos Sorcerers & DP's, who must always roll at least 1 power from their respective God's Psychic Lore (but can never take more than half their rolls from that Lore). Hence, for CSM's, it's 100% impossible to ever gain Psychic Focus with Marked models.
Thus, Chaos Psychic Focus gives them the added power to make-up for this gaff.

Chaos Daemons on the other hand, may choose to roll up to half their powers from their respective God's Psychic Lore, but are not outright forced to, unlike those poor CSM dudes.
The BRB still gives them the Chaos Psychic Focus, (likely because GW thought it would be silly for only one type of Chaos army to get it, but not the other), yet Daemons are still fully able to roll all of their powers from one of the basic BRB Lores and hence, will then trigger the Psychic Focus requirement.


Sure it's stupid, and an unfair advantage to Daemons, but it's only because GW screwed up first with the way Chaos Marines vs. Daemons generate their powers, and then yet again by putting a Band-Aid solution in the BRB which gave one side a double benefit.

Umm yeah this is how I said it probably works in the first place. You can't play it different ways for the different codexes though, either the Chaos Focus power counts as a generated power or it doesn't. If it doesn't (and this is how I play it now) then Daemons can get Chaos Focus and Psychic Focus Primaris powers.

a lot of players will argue that "If during the course of the game, that Psyker gains a psychic power from a different psychic discipline, he immediately loses Psychic Focus" means that when a psyker automatically knows the primaris power of the discipline that corresponds to their patron deity they will have, during the course of the game, gained a psychic power. Thus not being able have their cake and eat it too.

 DJGietzen wrote:
a lot of players will argue that "If during the course of the game, that Psyker gains a psychic power from a different psychic discipline, he immediately loses Psychic Focus" means that when a psyker automatically knows the primaris power of the discipline that corresponds to their patron deity they will have, during the course of the game, gained a psychic power. Thus not being able have their cake and eat it too.

Except you do not gain the power associated with Chaos Psychic Focus "during the course of the game" so they can know Chaos Psychic Focus and Psychic Focus.

 Tonberry7 wrote:
Umm yeah this is how I said it probably works in the first place. You can't play it different ways for the different codexes though, either the Chaos Focus power counts as a generated power or it doesn't. If it doesn't (and this is how I play it now) then Daemons can get Chaos Focus and Psychic Focus Primaris powers.

Chaos Psychic Focus is never generated, as there are two specific ways the BRB shows us how to Generate Psychic powers.

You play it correctly that Daemons can get Chaos Psychic Focus and Psychic Focus.

I don't know. If he does not generate all of his powers from the same discipline you don't get PF..

If some powers are not generated (randomly, or [emitted data]), then it's impossible for all of his powers to be generated from the same discipline. 'All of his powers' maybe include; all known powers.

If a Psyker generates all of his powers from the same psychic discipline (even if
he can only generate one power), that Psyker is said to have Psychic Focus, and
gains that discipline’s primaris power in addition to his other powers.

I don't know if they missed something in the 'generating' section, or didn't explain what they meant very well. I have no idea what they intended between PF and Chaos rule.

If you do not generate A power,but generate others from the same discipline, you HAVe *generated* all of your powers from one discipline.

Difference between the act of generating being the condition, vs the end condition of only *lknowing* from one discipline.