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Just played a game with allied deamonkin and I must say - this is a strong book.
60 point axe that turns your daemon price into a blood thirstier when he dies! Also automatic turn 2 bloodthrister spawn, out of a random champion! Followed by an additional deamon price spawn after it in the same turn! Whats great about it is it's dang fun. Maybe a little cheesy that my allie spawned 700 points worth of deamons in the game but whats funny about that is it's still not even nearly as strong as Necron formations - thats what I'm concerned about.

Umm, are you playing it right? How are you managing to get 8 points out of two turns with allied units? What sort of list is this? And how do you manage to spawn a Bloodthirster AND a Prince when a) you can only have 8 points maximum at any time and b) Slaughtercult allows you to get a 'freebie' that doesn't exceed 4 points as your second choice. So that's not a summoning ability no matter how you cut it.

I don't play KhorneKin and haven't played anyone that does but I've given the codex a brief read and am wondering how you're managing that. If I'm missing something, I'd like to know.

I played against a friend the other day that's been playing daemons in tournaments for years. He normally uses kairos, horrors, screamers and plague drones but he decided to make a Demonkin list. I won 15-2, would've tabled him if I hadn't been playing my grav star so conservatively. He made a tournament style list from that book, it was just really weak. I'm not impressed and would much rather face Demonkin than anything out of the chaos daemons codex.

If you're getting a turn two bloodthirster you must be taking hideous casualties. Of course there are units where it is worth it (but probably not)

I think there are definate strengths but I don't see the blood host as that competitive. Good allied potential

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
Umm, are you playing it right? How are you managing to get 8 points out of two turns with allied units? What sort of list is this? And how do you manage to spawn a Bloodthirster AND a Prince when a) you can only have 8 points maximum at any time and b) Slaughtercult allows you to get a 'freebie' that doesn't exceed 4 points as your second choice. So that's not a summoning ability no matter how you cut it.

I don't play KhorneKin and haven't played anyone that does but I've given the codex a brief read and am wondering how you're managing that. If I'm missing something, I'd like to know.

No my friend was playing a 2k list next to mine.


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Captyn_Bob wrote:
If you're getting a turn two bloodthirster you must be taking hideous casualties. Of course there are units where it is worth it (but probably not)

I think there are definate strengths but I don't see the blood host as that competitive. Good allied potential

There was just a lot of death going on. kills losses and challanges on turn 2. Due to deepstrike suicide squads and such. My mistake in explaining though - required blood points were acquired turn 2 - couldn't actually be spent till turn 3.


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 Toofast wrote:
I played against a friend the other day that's been playing daemons in tournaments for years. He normally uses kairos, horrors, screamers and plague drones but he decided to make a Demonkin list. I won 15-2, would've tabled him if I hadn't been playing my grav star so conservatively. He made a tournament style list from that book, it was just really weak. I'm not impressed and would much rather face Demonkin than anything out of the chaos daemons codex.

To be fair, was it a draigo star? Daemons got no answer for that nonsense!

 Xenomancers wrote:

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
Umm, are you playing it right? How are you managing to get 8 points out of two turns with allied units? What sort of list is this? And how do you manage to spawn a Bloodthirster AND a Prince when a) you can only have 8 points maximum at any time and b) Slaughtercult allows you to get a 'freebie' that doesn't exceed 4 points as your second choice. So that's not a summoning ability no matter how you cut it.

I don't play KhorneKin and haven't played anyone that does but I've given the codex a brief read and am wondering how you're managing that. If I'm missing something, I'd like to know.

No my friend was playing a 2k list next to mine.

Right but your missing the part of Shark's post about not being able to summon a Bloodthirster and Daemon Prince in the same turn. If you use your Blood Tithe points to summon a unit (#'s 5-8) then you can only choose non summoning tithes (#'s 1-4) as the free one.

Also you don't get Blood points just by any unit dying, one of the units with the Blood for the Blood God! rule needs to destroy it for it to award a point, so if your ally kills anything your army gets nothing. The casualties must be made by your own units.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Toofast wrote:
I played against a friend the other day that's been playing daemons in tournaments for years. He normally uses kairos, horrors, screamers and plague drones but he decided to make a Demonkin list. I won 15-2, would've tabled him if I hadn't been playing my grav star so conservatively. He made a tournament style list from that book, it was just really weak. I'm not impressed and would much rather face Demonkin than anything out of the chaos daemons codex.

What did he field? Was it daemon heavy? (since he is a daemon player i guess so) This codex looks a lot more like a CSM codex rather than a daemon one, the lack of multiple heralds, gifts and such makes it worst than the daemon codex.

No it wasn't draigo, it was my standard SW tournament list.
Rune priest, TDA, lvl2
3x GH squads, 2 melta, WG combi melta
Stormfang, meltas, Lascannon
tigurius
5 tac marines, melta
sternguard, 2 melta, 3 combi melta
3 grav cents, hurricane bolters, omni scope
Everything in drop pods. Rune priest, tigurius and grav cents deployed in a ruin, their pod drops empty turn 4 for linebreaker or an objective. I forget what all was in his list but I don't see how chaos marines would've helped him out much.

 Toofast wrote:
I forget what all was in his list but I don't see how chaos marines would've helped him out much.

I'm not saying that it would helped him, but the codex daemons allows him to field a much better army, due to the table of the gods, multiple heralds, cheap AP2 weapons and multiple gifts.

If you plan on fielding a heavy daemon Daemonkin you will probably do a lot better playing codex daemons and sticking to only khorne units. The codex overall rules allows it to work far better than Daemonkin. The blood points sound nice but you lose way to much using Daemonkin instead of Daemons.

That is why I asked if he fielded daemon heavy, if he used mainly CSM which have terrible armywide rules and replace them with the blood table buffs with only a few daemons it would've probably worked better.

 Ignatius wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
Umm, are you playing it right? How are you managing to get 8 points out of two turns with allied units? What sort of list is this? And how do you manage to spawn a Bloodthirster AND a Prince when a) you can only have 8 points maximum at any time and b) Slaughtercult allows you to get a 'freebie' that doesn't exceed 4 points as your second choice. So that's not a summoning ability no matter how you cut it.

I don't play KhorneKin and haven't played anyone that does but I've given the codex a brief read and am wondering how you're managing that. If I'm missing something, I'd like to know.

No my friend was playing a 2k list next to mine.

Right but your missing the part of Shark's post about not being able to summon a Bloodthirster and Daemon Prince in the same turn. If you use your Blood Tithe points to summon a unit (#'s 5-8) then you can only choose non summoning tithes (#'s 1-4) as the free one.

Ahh he did not read that very well then - Really thats the reason I thought it was so strong. Cause he was getting a bloodthirstier and daemon prince at the same time. I'll let him know about that. Was his first game with them.

 Xenomancers wrote:

 Ignatius wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
Umm, are you playing it right? How are you managing to get 8 points out of two turns with allied units? What sort of list is this? And how do you manage to spawn a Bloodthirster AND a Prince when a) you can only have 8 points maximum at any time and b) Slaughtercult allows you to get a 'freebie' that doesn't exceed 4 points as your second choice. So that's not a summoning ability no matter how you cut it.

I don't play KhorneKin and haven't played anyone that does but I've given the codex a brief read and am wondering how you're managing that. If I'm missing something, I'd like to know.

No my friend was playing a 2k list next to mine.

Right but your missing the part of Shark's post about not being able to summon a Bloodthirster and Daemon Prince in the same turn. If you use your Blood Tithe points to summon a unit (#'s 5-8) then you can only choose non summoning tithes (#'s 1-4) as the free one.

Ahh he did not read that very well then - Really thats the reason I thought it was so strong. Cause he was getting a bloodthirstier and daemon prince at the same time. I'll let him know about that. Was his first game with them.

Don't get too hard on him, it's a one off statement that is easy-ish to miss. There are always a few hiccups when you try and learn a new army.

As a DE player, I find it more than a little aggravating that my Power from Pain rule was streamlined from a casualty-counting mechanic, to a dull, flavourless rule that just counts the turn number,

Well, ok, maybe counting casualties was too much work. Oh, Daemonkin have been given a really interesting mechanic built entirely around casualties inflicted (or, to put it another way, pain inflicted). Sigh.

Anyway, the book feels pretty strong and it's nice to see Khorne get some love. I just wish it didn't feel like they've stolen my army's special rule...

The book is strong. But it requires some practice as simple BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD rush, albeit appealing, won't cut it. Luckilly, you've got enough speed, easy access to effective msu and hard-hitters.

I think that decurion-style formations are the way to go. You can allready create an effective 1k point list out of it and get formation bonuses - free second summon/buff and +1 BT point each turn. It might be worth the loss of obsec as your stuff is quite choppy while not too durable.

I think that summoning Daemon princes is more effective than summoning bloodthirsters as DP can go without wings and be able to do stuff next turn. They'd be a fire magnet emidiately. The only problem is to actually pass ld to create them. So, it's a gamble.

Relics are outstanding. Other than fnp 3+ armor that's overpriced, all has it's uses.

 koooaei wrote:

Relics are outstanding. Other than fnp 3+ armor that's overpriced, all has it's uses.

Actually I think the weapons are terrible, goredrinker might be the only one ok. The BT one sounds cool, but I've never been a fan of letting my warlord die, and even then who knows how much will the BT last with those self inflicted wounds.

The 3+ armor with EW and IWND I think is great for a DP, and solely for it. Just like whenever you take a Termie Lord and pay him a sigil you pay twice the invul, same happens here where you are paying twice for the 3+ on a lord, but on a DP that lacks the 3+ it is great to have for just a few points more IWND and EW

 Lord Yayula wrote:

 koooaei wrote:

Relics are outstanding. Other than fnp 3+ armor that's overpriced, all has it's uses.

Actually I think the weapons are terrible, goredrinker might be the only one ok. The BT one sounds cool, but I've never been a fan of letting my warlord die, and even then who knows how much will the BT last with those self inflicted wounds.

The 3+ armor with EW and IWND I think is great for a DP, and solely for it. Just like whenever you take a Termie Lord and pay him a sigil you pay twice the invul, same happens here where you are paying twice for the 3+ on a lord, but on a DP that lacks the 3+ it is great to have for just a few points more IWND and EW

It's not just letting your warlord die. It has a potential to summon 2 thirsters as the relics get passed on to a daemon prince that you have good chances of summoning instead of your lord when he gets in a difficult situation - and he does as khornates don't have enough staying power to last forever. So, he turns into a DP and as he's removed, you get a Thirster and, if passed ascendency sucksessfully, a daemon prince with an Axe. If the daemon prince dies, he summons another thirster. Not bad for just a couple points above an ap2 id-on-a-6 weapon, eh.

Sorry, where's the Daemon Prince coming from?

From dark apotheosis in bloodtithe table.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, yes, the armor with fnp and Eternal warrior might be good if you take a daemon prince as your warlord as he has to buy 3+ armor anywayz.

And the anti-caster rune is a steal for 15 pts.

I played against someone using the new rulebook and I think it is by far the strongest way to play Khorne units.

The new BloodThirster is amazing. I had an Ironclad dreadnought locked in combat on turn 3 and that thirster charged it and knocked off 24 hull points. 24!

It seemed tricky to keep track of all the different bonuses floating around the army, but once you play through it a few times I think it will become easier.

The problem with using the Blood Tithe is that the Bloodthirster will not get to charge. So he doesnt come in until you get 8 points. then when he does he comes in flying. So you have to wait next turn to land him, and you cant charge that turn. Then you have to charge on the 3rd turn.

So you would have to get 8 points by turn 2 in order to charge by turn 5. Really not effective.

 Icculus wrote:
I played against someone using the new rulebook and I think it is by far the strongest way to play Khorne units.

The new BloodThirster is amazing. I had an Ironclad dreadnought locked in combat on turn 3 and that thirster charged it and knocked off 24 hull points. 24!

It seemed tricky to keep track of all the different bonuses floating around the army, but once you play through it a few times I think it will become easier.

The problem with using the Blood Tithe is that the Bloodthirster will not get to charge. So he doesnt come in until you get 8 points. then when he does he comes in flying. So you have to wait next turn to land him, and you cant charge that turn. Then you have to charge on the 3rd turn.

So you would have to get 8 points by turn 2 in order to charge by turn 5. Really not effective.

Not certain but I don't think he comes in flying.

 Xenomancers wrote:

 Icculus wrote:
I played against someone using the new rulebook and I think it is by far the strongest way to play Khorne units.

The new BloodThirster is amazing. I had an Ironclad dreadnought locked in combat on turn 3 and that thirster charged it and knocked off 24 hull points. 24!

It seemed tricky to keep track of all the different bonuses floating around the army, but once you play through it a few times I think it will become easier.

The problem with using the Blood Tithe is that the Bloodthirster will not get to charge. So he doesnt come in until you get 8 points. then when he does he comes in flying. So you have to wait next turn to land him, and you cant charge that turn. Then you have to charge on the 3rd turn.

So you would have to get 8 points by turn 2 in order to charge by turn 5. Really not effective.

Not certain but I don't think he comes in flying.

It does, since it arrives via Deep Strike, in 7th edition they made changes to FMC so that when they arrive via DS they MUST do so by flying. However there are lots of threads spawning regarding the wording on the BT table. RAW it seems like the BT arrives before movement phase so you could change to ground mode on the movement phase but I personally think that is stretching the rules so that the 8 point BT seems a little more appealing

 Lord Yayula wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

 Icculus wrote:
I played against someone using the new rulebook and I think it is by far the strongest way to play Khorne units.

The new BloodThirster is amazing. I had an Ironclad dreadnought locked in combat on turn 3 and that thirster charged it and knocked off 24 hull points. 24!

It seemed tricky to keep track of all the different bonuses floating around the army, but once you play through it a few times I think it will become easier.

The problem with using the Blood Tithe is that the Bloodthirster will not get to charge. So he doesnt come in until you get 8 points. then when he does he comes in flying. So you have to wait next turn to land him, and you cant charge that turn. Then you have to charge on the 3rd turn.

So you would have to get 8 points by turn 2 in order to charge by turn 5. Really not effective.

Not certain but I don't think he comes in flying.

It does, since it arrives via Deep Strike, in 7th edition they made changes to FMC so that when they arrive via DS they MUST do so by flying. However there are lots of threads spawning regarding the wording on the BT table. RAW it seems like the BT arrives before movement phase so you could change to ground mode on the movement phase but I personally think that is stretching the rules so that the 8 point BT seems a little more appealing

Actually - that's exactly the way the group ruled it on the board, now that I recall it correctly. How is that stretching the rules? If you declare what flight mode you are in during the movement phase and the BT is spawned before the movement phase - that seems pretty clear cut to me. I agree though that's probably not what they intended, I also doubt they intended for the BT to come in flying in the first place ether though.

It also just seems a bit weird if it's stuck in flight mode when it's summoned

It means you have a melee monster, but all he can do for two entire turns is hit something with his liquorice whip.