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Made in gb
Humorless Arbite





Hull

Recently read the 'First Heretic' in the HH series and I was wondering about a couple things -

The Gal Vorbak could switch between Human Form and Corrupted Form, subsequent Possessed Marines can't.
Mentally, the Gal Vorbak switched between Human dominant or possessed Daemon dominant similar to how their bodies switched.
I'm wondering whether the subsequent possessed marines can as well or if they're permanently melded mentally as they are physically.

Also when a Human or Marine or Primarch ascends into a Daemon Prince or Primarch, are they really just possessed? Do they have a Daemon in their mind too?

Lastly, considering the Word Bearers believe that the Chaos Gods are divine, Daemons are holy and that Possessed Marines are sanctified, why aren't all the Word Bearers possessed?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/04/12 17:23:46


   
Made in us
Roarin' Runtherd





Oh boy then, lets see....
1. I believe the subsequent/current possessed marines can NOT switch, and are premenantly melded physically and mentally (with the deamon likely having a more dominant role)
Im not sure why the originals were able to switch, but seeing as how they were I think it isn't out of question that newer ones could possibly be able to as well, just not all of them

2.A daemon prince/primarch are not possessed, instead of a daemon being mended into them they are pretty much turned into a daemon of sorts. The two downfalls are that they now longer can be in the material realm for the same reasons as any daemon, and they are just as much servants to the chaos gods as any other daemon. So there is no daemon involved, but a lot of free will is lost

3.All Word Bearers wouldn't be possessed for the same reasons all Catholics are not saints or cardinals. The common marines are the choir boys, hoping one day to please their leaders and gods enough to rise in the ranks. In other words, they wouldn't be "worthy" of such sanctification yet

Now you probably shouldn't quote me on any of this, but I hope it helps!



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Made in gb
Humorless Arbite





Hull

Okay thanks for the responses -
Further question:

Could a Possessed Marine ascend into a Daemon prince? If so, would he still be mentally bound with the original Daemon?

   
Made in us
Master Shaper




Gargant Hunting

Fulcrum was possessed by a greater daemon, then regained free will, and ascended to daemonhood, so it is possible. There probably wouldn't be a link between the prince and the daemon though

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/04/12 20:15:40


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Made in us
Member of the Malleus






 Otto Weston wrote:
Recently read the 'First Heretic' in the HH series and I was wondering about a couple things -
The Gal Vorbak could switch between Human Form and Corrupted Form, subsequent Possessed Marines can't.
Also when a Human or Marine or Primarch ascends into a Daemon Prince or Primarch, are they really just possessed? Do they have a Daemon in their mind too?



1. I think the Gal Vorbak could change because, being the first, the possession was mutual, and the daemons and astartes were on a more equal footing in a symbiosis of sorts. Later possessed are just brutally being used as vessels for daemons. While they allow themselves to initially be possessed, they give up all control to the daemon and therefore, it’s much less mutual.

2. As far as I can tell, becoming a daemon involves the soul being pumped full of warp essence by a power of the warp. So for Fulgrim to become a daemon Primarch Slanessh basically had to give him a lot of essence as power. This power destroyed his mortal form and made him a being of pure spirit and will. The process would be similar for anyone ascending to princedom. If a possessed were to ascend the marine should would be empowered not the daemon. Which leads me to believe possessed rarely ascend, as they are not powerful enough in will or fortitude to accomplish the glories for the chaos gods required to ascend, without the aid of a daemon


 Otto Weston wrote:
Okay thanks for the responses -
Further question:
Would a Possessed Marine ascend into a Daemon prince? If so, would he still be mentally bound with the original Daemon?

Apart from the answer given above, if a daemon curried favor with a power, he would just be promoted or given more power ( a greater piece of the god’s will). So if the possessed was worthy of daemon princedom, he would have to do something significant enough, without the daemons help, to gain the god’s attention. Otherwise the God would just promote the Daemon as the mortal was just a tool and a shell for the daemon to act through.

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