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As title says. It'd be cool to have a bunch of master-crafted krak nades across the list.

They have a weapon profile. They're listed alongside everything else in the weapon profile appendix. Grenades have additional special rules per the BRB, but they're otherwise used and described as regular weapons.

It actually depends on the grenade in question.

For example, Krak grenades are a ranged weapon (technically), thus they are eligible to be chosen.
Meltabombs are only weapon when in melee with an MC or vehicle, so they would not be eligible.

That said, I don't think it is intended as they are listed as Special Issue Wargear, not weapons, in the codex.

Master crafted applies to ANY to-hit rolls, not just shooting/thrown. So Krak grenades and melta bombs would gain the reroll, since you still roll to hit when assaulting a vehicle.

Most grenades are weapons, so strictly speaking, yes.

 Happyjew wrote:
That said, I don't think it is intended as they are listed as Special Issue Wargear, not weapons, in the codex.

The Dark Eldar Phantasm Grenade Launcher is listed in Arcane Wargear, and Flesh Hooks and Spine Banks (IIRC) are listed in the Tyranid wargear list equivalent. Hunter-killer missiles are listed under vehicle equipment.

Equipment including weapons that a unit is armed with are listed under the heading "Wargear:"

Are they not weapons for that reason?

Most people I know in person play it grenades are grenades, which we kind of separate from "weapons" like bolters or chainswords. We don't let people swap out having grenades on a Captain for a relic weapon, as an example. HIWPI is no. I feel like the intention is whenever a rule refers to a weapon, it's talking about a shooting weapon or melee weapon, while grenades are their own separate category.

On this particular issue, I wouldn't stop you if you were dead set on doing it, but mostly because I feel like it'd be a waste and so I'm okay with you doing things that are sub-optimal.

I think RAI no, probably not meant to be.

RAW sure, grenades are clearly listed as a subheading in the Weapons section of the BRB, making them (grenade) weapons.

 SRSFACE wrote:
Most people I know in person play it grenades are grenades, which we kind of separate from "weapons" like bolters or chainswords. We don't let people swap out having grenades on a Captain for a relic weapon, as an example. HIWPI is no. I feel like the intention is whenever a rule refers to a weapon, it's talking about a shooting weapon or melee weapon, while grenades are their own separate category.

On this particular issue, I wouldn't stop you if you were dead set on doing it, but mostly because I feel like it'd be a waste and so I'm okay with you doing things that are sub-optimal.

Taking into considerataion that Salamanders have twin-linked flamers and Vulkan makes all melta twin-linked, there's not much else to master craft. Even Vulkan himself allready has a master-crafted spear and linked (chapter tactics) flamer. So, i thought why not master-craft nades instead of a sword? It might probably be more useful.

Master-crafted melta-bombs, mmm? Haven't thought bout that. What's the general concensus on this?

SRSFACE wrote:Most people I know in person play it grenades are grenades, which we kind of separate from "weapons" like bolters or chainswords. We don't let people swap out having grenades on a Captain for a relic weapon, as an example. HIWPI is no. I feel like the intention is whenever a rule refers to a weapon, it's talking about a shooting weapon or melee weapon, while grenades are their own separate category.

On this particular issue, I wouldn't stop you if you were dead set on doing it, but mostly because I feel like it'd be a waste and so I'm okay with you doing things that are sub-optimal.

Harial89 wrote:I think RAI no, probably not meant to be.

RAW sure, grenades are clearly listed as a subheading in the Weapons section of the BRB, making them (grenade) weapons.

I am inclined to agree with both of these statements.

 koooaei wrote:


Taking into considerataion that Salamanders have twin-linked flamers and Vulkan makes all melta twin-linked, there's not much else to master craft. Even Vulkan himself allready has a master-crafted spear and linked (chapter tactics) flamer. So, i thought why not master-craft nades instead of a sword? It might probably be more useful.

Master-crafted melta-bombs, mmm? Haven't thought bout that. What's the general concensus on this?

Master-Craft specifically for Vulkan He'Stan or for units in general? He'Stan ends up master-crafting his bolt pistol which doesn't really accomplish much but it's not like he needs to actively attack with his grenades so there's not much point in master-crafting those either. At least with the pistol, you've got that 8.5" to 12" zone the pistol can hit his heavy flamer can't!

There's a lot of things to master craft for your average every-day Sgt. Their bolter or a bolt pistol immediately come to mind. A captain can master-craft whatever beatstick weapon you give him, a Librarian can do their force weapon. List goes on.

 SRSFACE wrote:
We don't let people swap out having grenades on a Captain for a relic weapon, as an example.

I get what you're saying - if we treat grenades as being weapons like bolt pistols or chainswords, then they're legitimate choices for being swapped out for relic weapons (as the only requirement is that you swap out a "weapon"). This seems wrong, as there are no other examples of that sort of swap in the SM codex. However, I think it's more likely that this is an oversight in the relic weapons entry than proof that GW's RAI is Grenades ≠ Weapons.

I'm fairly interested in sussing out the answer, since mastercrafted meltabombs are pretty good for their price.

Yes.

It just means they work much better now.

*Cough Warhammer 40k Space Marine game, It's a joke.*

RAW is that they can be master crafted,

I believe RAI to be this as well now, as they used to put a specific line in the rules about not being able to master craft grenades.

quite likely this was removed on purpose.

its not over powered,and its 200% the cost of the melta bomb, so you pay for it out the nose, dont see why anyone would have a problem with it.

 easysauce wrote:
its not over powered

I agree, which is part of the reason why I think it should be "a thing"

 easysauce wrote:
,and its 200% the cost of the melta bomb

Where are you getting that from?

Don't grenades specifically say they can't be master crafted?

 Jimsolo wrote:
Don't grenades specifically say they can't be master crafted?

They used to, not anymore though, which is actually making me think its fine to do so. I mean, there are in fact different grades of ammo/ordnance. I think it would make sense to have higher end grenades when possible.

On a side note, it makes me think of the nerf foot ball grenades from the movie "three Kings" lol. Salamanders get to put that perfect spiral on their nade toss.

 DanielBeaver wrote:

 easysauce wrote:
its not over powered

I agree, which is part of the reason why I think it should be "a thing"

 easysauce wrote:
,and its 200% the cost of the melta bomb

Where are you getting that from?

melta bomms are generally 5 pts,

master craft is generally 5 pts,

10 pts is 2 times 5 pts, hence 200% (or twice) the cost of meltabombs.

RAW its ok to master craft them now.

RAI, its ok to master craft them now.

doesnt break any of the rules of cool, or rules of fun, and its not OP, so while some people might incorrectly remember the old rule that disallowed it, it doesnt apply anymore and is likely a deliberate change by GW as they dont see MC'd grenades as OP in the current state of the game where the little troop guys actually NEED more help against huge stuff like super heavies

@easy:
- I was under the impression that Master Crafted was free for 1 weapon on every Salamanders character?
G

Grenades are weapons. Salamander characters can have one master-crafted grenade along with the others of its grenade type.

Also, if you master-craft, say, a combi-plasma, does it get both the bolter and the plasma part mastercrafted?

 koooaei wrote:
Also, if you master-craft, say, a combi-plasma, does it get both the bolter and the plasma part mastercrafted?

Yes.

 doktor_g wrote:
@easy:
- I was under the impression that Master Crafted was free for 1 weapon on every Salamanders character?
G

its free for them yes. generally it costs others something to do it.