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2015/04/19 15:45:07
Subject: Skitarii Vanguard and Ranger Special Weapon Loadouts
I've been playing a couple of games recently with my new Skitarii models, nothing too big only 500pts, and have settled on the Loadouts that I think I am going to stick with going forward. My Vanguard really benefited from the Plasma Caliver. But I haven't been having as much luck with the Rangers as I thought I would. They seem very situational, but that could just been the match up, space marines and the such made their saving throws most of the time. The extra hits from Rad really did a number on people.
What have you guys been running?
2015/04/26 03:33:38
Subject: Skitarii Vanguard and Ranger Special Weapon Loadouts
My 2,000 point list has 6 Vanguard Squads and 6 Onager in squads of 3. I feel like the two unit types have good synergy together. The Onager in my list are all kitted with the Cognis Stubbed and the Anti-air Array. Statistically the array grants one of the most potent statistical kills against nearly everything. Even with it firing at BS 1 against ground targets, most of the shots are twin linked. And if there are air targets or flying monstrous creatures, you'll knock their block off.
I rely on my Vanguard to handle the dirty work. Their short gun range only really matters on turn 1, so you get to save your +3BS doctrine until turn 2. Plasma Calivers are excellent.....absolutely excellent. I field 3 squads with 3 Calivers in each. Every squad also gets the Omnispex. The other 3 squads have 3 arc rifles in each. I also give each Alpha a taser goad and Arc pistol. My warlord Alpha gets the special taser.
Having the Onager in squads of 3 really makes them hard targets. Having a 4+ invulnerable save on an entire vehicle squad is impressive. "Oh you rolled a penetrating hit, go home!"
The army as a whole definitely has a lot of gaps and vulnerabilities. It's not the new best thing, but it's quirky and it's fun. I get to have an entire squad for the cost my opponent is basically obligated to take an HQ choice. I can't see his chapter master surviving against a vanguard squad at full strength. They would shoot his Richard off.
It's also highly hilarious to have your squads swarm in for thr assault, and hosing them with fire first. Then in the next phase when you are locked up and cant shoot anyways adding +2 or +3 weapon skill to your whole army, while subtracting 1 from their toughness. If your vanguard are locked in combat, your Onager won't mind the BS penalty of the doctrine, because they are already snap firing.
2015/04/26 07:46:46
Subject: Re:Skitarii Vanguard and Ranger Special Weapon Loadouts
My thoughts on the subject as of now are thus;
*Plasma Cavalier: this weapon seems destined for vanguard units. The short range matches the vanguard weapons. The vanguards also do pretty well targeting the MCs and GMC that a plasma cavalier will probably end up shooting at. I am not 100% certain that plasma cavaliers are a good value in the first place but this seems to be the unit of choice.
*Arc Rifles: IMO this is the best special weapon option. This option also works well on both units. Rangers have move through cover to help get the arc rifles in range and LoS to the target vehicle while vanguard are cheaper and thus can afford to loose bodies getting the weapon there. Overall I like the vanguard rules better so vanguard are my unit of choice.
*Transuranic Arquebus: This weapon is a bad joke. Cool model but the rules make no sense. It has a 60" range but can only be taken 2 to a unit of 5 guys with at best 30" weapons. The profile is either 1 AP3 wound on a 4+ shot or 1 AP3 glance a AV11 60% of the time. As an anti MC weapon it is extremely pricey for a mediocre weapon and for an anti armour role it is a joke. The only unit I would even give this to is rangers and only because it seems fluffy and the model looks cool. Perhaps in 8th edition this weapon will make sense?
Interestingly I find the best weapon between all of the ones listed in my post is the Radium Carbines on the Vanguard. Those weapons can tackle MCs and infantry with about the same ease. Units of 10 vanguard with these are pretty good actually.
2015/04/26 20:35:05
Subject: Skitarii Vanguard and Ranger Special Weapon Loadouts
Psykostevo wrote: The army as a whole definitely has a lot of gaps and vulnerabilities. It's not the new best thing, but it's quirky and it's fun. I get to have an entire squad for the cost my opponent is basically obligated to take an HQ choice. I can't see his chapter master surviving against a vanguard squad at full strength. They would shoot his Richard off.
Math Time!
Using the popular "Smashbane" style build, of a Bike+Gorgon's Chain+Artificer Armor, for a T5/4W/2+/3++/5+++ model with EW.
We'll assume a fully equipped Vanguard squad, of 10 men with 3x Plasma Calivers.
Radium Carbines first:
Spoiler:
21 shots @ BS4, 14 hits, ~2.34 wounds (S3 vs T5); however, since it's wounding on 6's each one double-wounds, for ~4.68 wounds
4.68 wounds vs 2+/5+++, is ~0.52 unsaved wounds.
If you use the Doctrina Imperative to gain +3BS, however, things do change:
21 shots @ BS7, 14 initial hits, ~2.33 hits from BS7 re-roll; ~2.73 initial wounds, which will all need to be 6's thus pumping it to ~5.46 wounds
5.46 wounds vs 2+/5+++ is ~0.61 unsaved wounds
So Rad-Carbines are actually not that great versus the Smashbane-style CM build. Note that a model with Shield Eternal doesn't have the 5+ FNP (Iron Hands Chapter Tactic is 6+ FNP, while the Gorgon's Chain provides +1 to FNP).
Note that for the more Codex-compliant version (or if you take a wound off previously*), it's ~0.78 unsaved wounds for BS4 shooting, and ~0.91 unsaved for BS7.
Now the Plasma Calivers:
Spoiler:
9 shots @ BS4, 6 hits, 5 wounds
5 wounds vs 3++/5+++, is ~1.11 unsaved wounds
9 shots @ BS7 is 6 initial hits, along with 1 more from the BS7 re-roll; so ~5.83 wounds
~5.83 wounds vs 3++/5+++ is ~1.3 unsaved wounds
If you've already removed FNP, or you're fighting non-Clan Raukaan SM, then the results are actually ~1.67 unsaved @ BS4, and ~1.94 unsaved @ BS7
So all told, you'll remove roughly 1.63-2.85 wounds from a Smashbane style CM.
Which isn't too bad actually; that's very nearly killing the model. I do think, however, that murderizing tooled up characters (like a Smashbane) isn't the greatest application of the Triple Caliver Vanguard squad. Generally, you'll want to point it at 2+ save infantry, or at T6 MCs, as such tend to be vaporized.
As an example, Triple Caliver Vanguard are capable of killing a Dreadknight in a single round of shooting. Riptides and Wraithknights are... problematic, as the former can gain a 3++/5+ FNP, and also has 5 Wounds, while the latter (at present, at least...) has T8 and 6 Wounds. Neither one will particularly be bothered by said Vanguard squad... unfortunately.
