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Hi folks, I find myself in need of some assistance. I'm trying to make a 1000 points list of Dark Angels and it doesn't seem to be coming together all that well. I'm trying to steer away from Deathwing only and Ravenwing only lists. I don't mind using either, but don't like restricting myself to one completely. I have myself Dark Vengeance and a whole load of space marines. I'm heading to GW tomorrow (I don't have a local one) and I'm hoping to get something to hopefully help me complete 1000 points worth of DA.

Are there any experienced DA players (or anyone, really.) who could possibly help me make a list? I'm hoping to use a power armour librarian with a force axe and bolt pistol (old model I painted up and am rather proud of and hope to use it) and that's just about the only restriction I have put on myself. I should mention that this is a casual setting. So fun lists over super competitive lists. That of course doesn't mean I'm hoping for a sub-par list, winning is part of the fun after all.

Well, adding in a Librarian on foot isn't the best sort of option. If he were on a bike that would be much more possible. But, with a footslogging HQ you don't get a bike Command Squad and at 1000pts you don't have the option of picking up the 200pt HQs that unlock Bikes or Terminators as troops.

You do have the option of a Command Squad with the Dakka Banner and put them in a Land Raider Crusader. Since the Hurricane Bolters are 'three twin linked Bolters fired as one weapon' and Bolters are the things that get affected by the Banner of Devestation, you get 12 Twin Linked Bolter shots per side.

Throw in a 5 man Ravenwing squad minimum and a simple Rhino filled with the Tactical squad from DV, then fill out the rest of the points on Mark V Mortis Dreads from IA-2 and Ravenwing Knights. You won't have many points, but it would work as a casual TAC list.

I'll agree with some of what Shark has said - you want to expand the Ravenwing squad from DV to 5 or 6 bikers, preferably with Meltaguns and either meltabombs or a combi-Melta on the sarge. A MM Attack Bike also works well.
Your troops can be filled with the DV Tac squad or more if you have the models. If possible get them a Rhino or Razorback (depending on if you combat-squad them) to make them more mobile.
I'd advise against using the terminators if you can fill the points with other things ("a whole load of space marines" doesn't give us much to go on).

Here are the parts I'd disagree on: If you want to use your Libby on foot then do so. You can quite happily put him with a Devastator unit (for Prescience and maybe a PFG), or put him with a combat squad in a Razorback (can't cast most things whilst embarked, but can disembark and Psychic Shriek stuff just fine).
Black Knights are one of our best units, so if you wanted to convert the librarian that came with DV (presumably your painted one isn't this?) onto a bike, you could run both in the same 1000pts fairly easily and unlock a RW command squad (mainly for an Apothecary. A PFG character also reduces the need to Jink). Without doing that, you can just take an ordinary Black Knight unit.
Land Raiders are a bit eggs-in-one-basket at that point level (especially if hiding a PFG behind them for extra troll power), but if you have one give it a try.

First, let me congratulate you on picking the very best of the Space Marine chapters. You are clearly a man of taste and refinement.

I would say your Librarian is a good start, as I have been using one on foot for the past few battles - pop him in with a Tactical Squad inside a Rhino or Razorback and scoot around looking for objectives.

For your other Troops slot, either another Tactical squad in a Rhino/Razorback or a small squad of Scouts that can Outflank the enemy. The Scouts will die in most games, but they can create a lot of hassle for your opponent before they do!

Maybe a Dreadnought, but at 1,000 points keep him cheap - again, in recent battles, I have had some joy with a Dreadnought that has no upgrades at all (100 points, just close combat weapon and Multi-melta).

Always try to get at least one Land Speeder in, and Deep Strike it. The standard fit of Heavy Bolter and Assault Cannon gives you a good choice of targets.

As someone mentioned, Black Knights are a nice choice, a small squad of three, again Outflanking, will give any opponent issues.

Finally, you need something big on your back line - either a Predator or Vindicator. You might just be able to squeeze in a Whirlwind too.

Do you have an idea of the sorts of armies you will generally be facing?

I usually play at least 1500 points, but the couple 1000 lists I've used for DA involve a bike command squad or at least a handful of black knights, as well as some regular bikes, then fill out the rest with tacticals and dev squads. I'm a bit reluctant to encourage terminators at that level, as while a squad of DW knights is nice to accompany bikes (use the teleport beacon on them turn 2 to get them right in the enemy's face), that's going to eat up a quarter of your points. I really dislike the standard terminators at that points level, as no storm shields means they'll get ripped by plasma, riptides, anything with AP 2 melee....

EDIT: by standard terminators I mean the DV ones


Automatically Appended Next Post:

MongooseMatt wrote:
You are clearly a man of taste and refinement.

Sums up about 90% of DA players

MongooseMatt wrote:
First, let me congratulate you on picking the very best of the Space Marine chapters. You are clearly a man of taste and refinement.

I would say your Librarian is a good start, as I have been using one on foot for the past few battles - pop him in with a Tactical Squad inside a Rhino or Razorback and scoot around looking for objectives.

For your other Troops slot, either another Tactical squad in a Rhino/Razorback or a small squad of Scouts that can Outflank the enemy. The Scouts will die in most games, but they can create a lot of hassle for your opponent before they do!

Maybe a Dreadnought, but at 1,000 points keep him cheap - again, in recent battles, I have had some joy with a Dreadnought that has no upgrades at all (100 points, just close combat weapon and Multi-melta).

Always try to get at least one Land Speeder in, and Deep Strike it. The standard fit of Heavy Bolter and Assault Cannon gives you a good choice of targets.

As someone mentioned, Black Knights are a nice choice, a small squad of three, again Outflanking, will give any opponent issues.

Finally, you need something big on your back line - either a Predator or Vindicator. You might just be able to squeeze in a Whirlwind too.

Do you have an idea of the sorts of armies you will generally be facing?

When you say a Land Speeder, are you talking about a Land Speeder Vengeance or a regular Land Speeder? If it's the latter, I wasn't aware Dark Angels could use Land Speeders. I didn't seem them in the codex. Also, so far I have been facing Daemons, Space Wolves, and Black Templars. Once I get more comfortable I plan on playing with people at my local game shop so who knows what armies I'll face.

To address everyone else, I definitely plan on picking up some Black Knights. It seems pretty unanimous that Black Knights are a must have. I would like to keep my Librarian on foot (doesn't mean he wouldn't go in a Razorback or something, because he certainly will) because I'm picky and like my old model. So that's just stubbornness on my part but it seems like that's okay for the most part. I would likely pass on the Land Raider because I don't have one and would rather not buy one. I have a devastator squad I can certainly use but I want to try my luck with a tank, a Predator in this case. I know it can get blown up with one lucky shot but I just want to give it a whirl (and it helps that I already own one).

I like the suggestions MongooseMatt made the most because I have all the models (excluding the Knights) he suggested. That's not to say I'm not open to more suggestions, it just means that if nothing else comes up I'll likely go with MongooseMatt's word.

 PaulTheFirewoodSalesman wrote:
When you say a Land Speeder, are you talking about a Land Speeder Vengeance or a regular Land Speeder? If it's the latter, I wasn't aware Dark Angels could use Land Speeders. I didn't seem them in the codex.

We very definitely can - Ravenwing Support Squadrons are 1-5 ordinary Land Speeders in a single unit, and we can also 'attach' (not truly attached, just bought as part of that FoC slot) a single Land Speeder to a full Ravenwing Attack Squadron. For weapon loadout, I like dual MultiMelta's, giving them a similar role to MM Attack Bikes, or HB/AC because I'm a traditionalist at heart.
{Edit} Also, don't get a LS Vengeance - it's a terrible vehicle. The Darkshroud has some uses though. {/Edit}

if you're just wanting to add fun units to your existing DV models, I would look at something like this...

Librarian, ML 2 100
Tac sqd, plasma, plasma cannon 170
Add razorback w TL lascannons 75
scouts, ML, snipers, cloaks 85
5 DW terminators, assault cannon, chainfist 245
Dreadnought, assault cannon, hvy flamer 130
3 Ravenwing bikes, 2 plasma guns 110
Landspeeder typhoon, MM 85

so would need to pick up scouts, landspeeder typhoon, dreadnought.

this i not super competitive, so as you understand that.

It sounds like you have bikes and tacs.

I'd suggest more bikes or something to make either better.

Basically supporting sugggestions for Command Squad with Banner of Deviation and apothocary for troops, or the Black Knights.

Thank you so much for all the input, guys. It has helped a tremendous amount and I think I made a decent list with minimal purchases. Here's what I've drawn up:

HQ:
Librarian
- Force Axe
- Bolt Pistol
- ML 2

Elites:
Dreadnought
- Multi-Melta
- Power Fist
- Drop Pod

Troops:
Tactical Marines x10
- Plasma Gun
- Plasma Cannon
- Veteran Sgt. with Chainsword and Plasma Pistol
- Rhino

Tactical Marines x5
- Meltagun
- Sgt. with Boltgun and Bolt Pistol
- Razorback

Scouts x5
- All with Snipers
- All with Camo Cloaks

Fast Attack:

Ravenwing Black Knights x3
- Huntmaster with Corvus Hammer

Ravenwing Support Squadron (Landspeeder) x1
- Assault Cannon
- Heavy Bolter

Heavy Support:
Predator
- Autocannon
- Lascannon sponsons

I feel the list seems fairly obvious but here's the quick rundown: Landspeeder will get DS'd into the fray and the Librarian will pair up with the 5 man tac squad in the Razorback. Brings me to 996 points.

I like to run an Azreal tri-wing list, but generally run at 1850 or 2000 pts, it might be harder to pull off at 1000.

Libby on bike or chappy on bike with 3+ invuln (chappy sometimes gets the mace of redemption for S7 AP3 love, if I have points)
2 full RW attack squadrons full of melta with missile +melta LS and melta Attack Bike (Never take land speeder squadrons!) RW AS gives the LS scout also! These are alpha strike squads, scout them forward, melta bad stuff, drop DW near them on turn 1 to keep them alive.
6+ RW BK's with 2 GL's. (Dont forge they have 4attacks on the charge S5 rending and hit and run) Keep these guys in cover as much as possible to not need jink.
1 or 2 DW term squads with assault cannons (DW Knights tend to die without doint anything unless they have a land raider transport.)
I dont recommend standard dreadnoughts, but mortis and contemptor mortis with Autocannons or Las Cannons are normally worth it (or kheres assault cannons for contemptor! But kheres are kinda OP cheese.)
Tac's and scouts as desired. At 2k points I generally run 4 to 6 troops, but with azzy I get DW and RW troops.
Devestators can be nice but always get a full squad then combat squad them into 2 rhino's.
Land Raiders with a bike techmarine with the bubble invuln hiding behind them is always strong.
A lot of people like the dakka banner, but IMO its too many points for something you should already be able to handle (horde's.)
Plasma weapons blow up my own dudes better than they do other dudes, including the vengence (in 30% of my games, it melts itself. Stupid 2HP with gets hot!)
Darkshroud is pretty decent. It has a 2+ jink save and can tank some shots...unless it ignores cover. Then it dies like a chump.
DA aircraft are poor. Id recommend allying in a stormstrike formation (2 stormtalons and a stormraven for about 440 points.) if you want air power.

Dont forget that with Deathwing assault we can deploy nothing and still have models on the board at the end of turn one. This is particularly useful against drop pod lists. If DP list guy goes first, then you have nothing for him to drop on. If you go first drop your termies about 12 inches from your board edge so that when things come on from reserve in turn 2 they can shoot the crap out of them. And dont forget that all RW units can outflank.(correction, RW LS squadrons cannot outflank but can deepstrike)

Looks like a solid list to me. There are a few things I'd suggest, but these are just preference:

Try and get the points to upgrade the Dread with a HF on the Fist and possibly an Assault Cannon in place of the MM. This loses some power in pure anti-tank, but makes it a hell of a lot more versatile against all infantry target types and light vehicles. This in turn makes it a lot more useful tactically as the enemy won't know where it's going (whereas with just the Melta, they can be certain you'll be going for their biggest tanks and plan accordingly)

I'd drop under ML2 on the Libby, I really don't see the +1 WC that useful for the cost, nor the other benefits. You'll only really be casting one power a turn most times anyway, and d6+1 WC should typically be enough for that.

So I played me first 2 games with this list against Tzeentch Daemons. I lost both but the second game in particular was close and quite fun. First game was a game of very bad rolls on my part and wasn't very enjoyable because of it.

Main thing I noticed was that my Librarian was pretty useless. My opponent, who's my brother, had so many warp charges that I couldn't really do anything. In a future scenario where this might happen, is there an HQ that I should take (for roughly the same points, preferably) over the Librarian?

 Paradigm wrote:
Looks like a solid list to me. There are a few things I'd suggest, but these are just preference:

Try and get the points to upgrade the Dread with a HF on the Fist and possibly an Assault Cannon in place of the MM. This loses some power in pure anti-tank, but makes it a hell of a lot more versatile against all infantry target types and light vehicles. This in turn makes it a lot more useful tactically as the enemy won't know where it's going (whereas with just the Melta, they can be certain you'll be going for their biggest tanks and plan accordingly)

I'd drop under ML2 on the Libby, I really don't see the +1 WC that useful for the cost, nor the other benefits. You'll only really be casting one power a turn most times anyway, and d6+1 WC should typically be enough for that.

I'll definitely try this instead. In the game I just mentioned, an extra Warp Charge did nothing for me and I was hoping that the Dreadnought wasn't pure anti-tank.

I hope will be helpful, the idea is to have two units in aip surgery and good mobility using all units of dark revenge
Librarian (drop pod)
+ combi-flamer
= 75
Belial
= 190

5 Tactical Space Marines
+ combi-flamer
+ flamer
= 85
• Drop Pod
= 35

5 Deathwing Terminators
+ heavy flamer
= 230

3 Ravenwing Bikers
+ 2× meltagun
= 100
1 Land Speeder
+ multi-melta
= 60
3 Ravenwing Bikers
+ 2× meltagun
= 100

Mark V Mortis Pattern Dreadnought (can fire AA)
+ 2 twin-linked autocannons
= 125

1.000 points

Maxmaino wrote:
snip

Problem with your list is that 1) it's not Battleforged and 2) your units are so tiny that you lose any amount of models and you're taking Leadership tests across the board. Sure that is mitigated by the Librarian and Terminators with Fearless, but doesn't help the Bikes one bit. You have the pieces of a good Dark Angel list there, covering all the bases, bust just not enough models.

list looks pretty good although I wouldn't lose the MM on the Dread (unless you add one to your landspeeder). You need a solid AT choice in the list and the dread in a pod can get close enough to be deadly. I do agree with the Hvy Flamer upgrade though. In all reality, the assault cannon is probably better on the dread and the MM on the landspeeder (although I know the "old" DA fluff used speeders with HB/Ass cannon).
As for the Librarian, he's a solid choice but facing Tzeentch you definitely need some backup. You could add a Culexus assassin or decide to add to your force by adding a sqd of Grey Knight terminators (maybe led by a Librarian). Somehting to think about for later.

 SharkoutofWata wrote:

Maxmaino wrote:
snip

Problem with your list is that 1) it's not Battleforged and 2) your units are so tiny that you lose any amount of models and you're taking Leadership tests across the board. Sure that is mitigated by the Librarian and Terminators with Fearless, but doesn't help the Bikes one bit. You have the pieces of a good Dark Angel list there, covering all the bases, bust just not enough models.

Belial makes terminator troops, so the list has two mandatory troop.
The list have few models, but the tactical squad with the Librarian and terminator are relentless. Bike and land spedder if used well give mobility and a good versatility in the maelstrom, more PA probabily dont change the situation, starting whit the model in the Dark Vengeance box this list is
an economical solution that can be done by investing more or less 100€

Hello all!

I'm back at it again but this time working on 1500 points. I was thinking about adding the Dark Vengeance Terminator squad, maybe replacing the 5 man tac squad with a command squad, and spending the rest on upgrades for existing units. Thoughts?

My thoughts are that you should wait until the new Codex drops.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
My thoughts are that you should wait until the new Codex drops.

Are Dark Angels getting a new codex? I thought it was just Space Marines. I haven't been keeping up with the rumors all too well.

PaulTheFirewoodSalesman wrote:So I played me first 2 games with this list against Tzeentch Daemons. I lost both but the second game in particular was close and quite fun. First game was a game of very bad rolls on my part and wasn't very enjoyable because of it.

Main thing I noticed was that my Librarian was pretty useless. My opponent, who's my brother, had so many warp charges that I couldn't really do anything. In a future scenario where this might happen, is there an HQ that I should take (for roughly the same points, preferably) over the Librarian?

If you want a better Psyker, try Ezekiel. He is ML3 and costs 145 points. He has one set power (Mind Worm) that isn't too bad, and he is a cool looking model! Of course, it is very hard to compete with Tzeentch daemons in the Psychic phase unless you're Grey Knights!

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:My thoughts are that you should wait until the new Codex drops.

I second this. I'm looking forward to the new codex myself so I can use my Unforgiven again!

Wait till the new one comes out. It should be right after the SM book comes. It may change the entire dynamic or it may just introduce random fluff with a few minor rule changes. We'll see.

Good Evening ladies and gentlemen, I'm back at it for Dark Angels. What's everyone thoughts on the new codex so far and what you think decent 1000 and 1500 lists look like? I have a few things in mind (basically just Black Knights for days) but would love to hear what others have brewing.

I love the new book and have very minor complaints (mostly regarding the Ravenwing formation and the need for an FAQ). Oh, and I'm still sore about losing our banners but realize that some of them couldn't exist (BoD) with full BS. Otherwise, I can't complain at all