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Are we close to just allowing everything?



When will I get to use my Revenant Titan?

Technically you could be using it this whole time. Bring it in a 1500 point game. Forge the narrative.

Well of course it is an almost ubiquitous limitation to non-codex LOW.


But yes......forge the narrative.

"My Revenant Titan is standing on this skyshield while invisible blasting Space Marines because Eldrad says so"

Sounds like something Eldrad would do.

No, I don't think we're getting closer to getting rid of "no LoW" house rules. The same people that hated them back when Escalation was released still hate them now that they're part of the standard FOC.

 Peregrine wrote:
No, I don't think we're getting closer to getting rid of "no LoW" house rules. The same people that hated them back when Escalation was released still hate them now that they're part of the standard FOC.

But for real though, dis post.

 Peregrine wrote:
No, I don't think we're getting closer to getting rid of "no LoW" house rules. The same people that hated them back when Escalation was released still hate them now that they're part of the standard FOC.

Undoubtedly.

It isn't like people who wanted to play a platoon level game are any more excited to play with giant robots and superheavies just because they are in the core rulebooks now.


People need to stop thinking of 40K as this simple ecosystem where every does (and should) like the same things about the game. It's never going to happen.

I'm still against SH/GC being included in normal games if 40k, and that is incredibly unlikely to ever change. I had to play a game, 3 on 3, 1000pts each, and one guy brought a Lord of skulls. At that point it was too late to say no, we were running out of time to get started, so my side planned on staying the fetch away from it, and focusing on the rest of the force. What should have been a fun game turned pretty gak, as that guy was effectively out of the game, pretty much all game. I hate writing lists to combat certain things, and if someone wants to play something like that, I'm not going to have fun against it.

So no, I don't think we are any closer to it in normal games

The resistance level to forge world, superheavies and LoW didn't really last long in our local scene, tbh. Basically, some people don't have them, and players compensate in some way that makes it so the game isn't lopsided. It's pretty rare to see someone say, 'No, I don't want to play against your revenant titan' in my meta.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 statu wrote:
I'm still against SH/GC being included in normal games if 40k, and that is incredibly unlikely to ever change. I had to play a game, 3 on 3, 1000pts each, and one guy brought a Lord of skulls. At that point it was too late to say no, we were running out of time to get started, so my side planned on staying the fetch away from it, and focusing on the rest of the force. What should have been a fun game turned pretty gak, as that guy was effectively out of the game, pretty much all game. I hate writing lists to combat certain things, and if someone wants to play something like that, I'm not going to have fun against it.

So no, I don't think we are any closer to it in normal games

Well sure, if all your points go into 1 model that's silly. Buy if it were 1:1 with 3000pts each, the lord of skulls is just a way of eating up a bunch of points and fielding 1 cool model.

 statu wrote:
I'm still against SH/GC being included in normal games if 40k, and that is incredibly unlikely to ever change. I had to play a game, 3 on 3, 1000pts each, and one guy brought a Lord of skulls. At that point it was too late to say no, we were running out of time to get started, so my side planned on staying the fetch away from it, and focusing on the rest of the force. What should have been a fun game turned pretty gak, as that guy was effectively out of the game, pretty much all game. I hate writing lists to combat certain things, and if someone wants to play something like that, I'm not going to have fun against it.

So no, I don't think we are any closer to it in normal games

except this isn't a problem with super heavies, rather this is an inherant flaw of being over reliant on any high priced death star. a 10 man GK Paladin formation with a grand master leading them clocks in at like 800 or so points. and could likewise basicly be avoided. but no one would say that unit doesn't belong in 40k.

 Talys wrote:
The resistance level to forge world, superheavies and LoW didn't really last long in our local scene, tbh. Basically, some people don't have them, and players compensate in some way that makes it so the game isn't lopsided. It's pretty rare to see someone say, 'No, I don't want to play against your revenant titan' in my meta.

Well sure, if all your points go into 1 model that's silly. Buy if it were 1:1 with 3000pts each, the lord of skulls is just a way of eating up a bunch of points and fielding 1 cool model.

only no one is playing 3k point games. The problem is eldar titans in 1500. Those almost killed w40k here in 6th ed, if escalation wasn't put on the same level as FW. And speaking of FW you can go from spain to estonia checking store after store, and the acceptance for FW does not seem to rise, neither do they seem to me many events that accept LoW stuff. In fact outside of UK and scandinavia in europe, FW is not much played.

Makumba wrote:

 Talys wrote:
The resistance level to forge world, superheavies and LoW didn't really last long in our local scene, tbh. Basically, some people don't have them, and players compensate in some way that makes it so the game isn't lopsided. It's pretty rare to see someone say, 'No, I don't want to play against your revenant titan' in my meta.

Well sure, if all your points go into 1 model that's silly. Buy if it were 1:1 with 3000pts each, the lord of skulls is just a way of eating up a bunch of points and fielding 1 cool model.

only no one is playing 3k point games. The problem is eldar titans in 1500. Those almost killed w40k here in 6th ed, if escalation wasn't put on the same level as FW. And speaking of FW you can go from spain to estonia checking store after store, and the acceptance for FW does not seem to rise, neither do they seem to me many events that accept LoW stuff. In fact outside of UK and scandinavia in europe, FW is not much played.

sure but a lot of that is due more to cost then any hatred of it. I was at my local GW today and saw a Horus heresy game going

I've actually become kind of accepting of Forgeworld stuff, to an extent. I played against a Siege Vanguard list last night, with some special rules, and an extra objective that he had to get. It was pretty neat, but didn't really help him in the game at all.

Superheavies, not so much, but if I know ahead of time if they're bringing one, I can cope with it. I would be perfectly okay with Super heavies if GW put restrictions on what points values you can bring them, how many per list, ext. Add in Fantasy restrictions on list building, already!

.

Escalation is dead and buried. As of 7th, super heavies, gargantuans and lords of war were allowed in any game with the only restrictions being the optional FOC. What's more, the penalties for taking them were erased too.

The big boys and Strength D are core rules now, full stop. Excluding them is an optional house rule, not the official rules as written.

Jefffar wrote:
Escalation is dead and buried. As of 7th, super heavies, gargantuans and lords of war were allowed in any game with the only restrictions being the optional FOC. What's more, the penalties for taking them were erased too.

The big boys and Strength D are core rules now, full stop. Excluding them is an optional house rule, not the official rules as written.

pretty much this. the people who say that kinda stuff only belongs in apoclypse have kinda missed something.


Apoc doesn't exist anymore. seems pretty clear to me GW's folded it into the main stream game

What, so we're now forced to play Apocalypse? GW can't tell any of us what to do with the models we buy. All that forcing bigger units into the game (and diluting the value of every other model) has done has forced people to leave and profits to continue to abate.

People don't like playing super heavies because they have been playing a large-scale skirmish game these past five editions, not a 28mm scale Epic. GW wants to force sales, so they say "everything is legal! Forge the narrative!" and completely let go on the steering wheel just so they can get more sales. It has nothing to do with improving the game, it is only about you opening your wallet more and more to make up for those who have left.

Now don't get any of this wrong, I'm not going to argue or be antagonistic to anyone who has these models, I'm just going to politely decline them and say I'm more interested in the skirmish game. And that is what people will keep doing if they signed up for what 40k was only a few years ago. It's either that or quit. I'm glad you all like the big models, really, I have no problem with it. But I want those models in Epic where they worked rather than inflating he rest of the game.

Honestly, in 8th edition, if they set in the rules of Escalation (i.e. 1 additional victory point for every 3 Hull points/wounds dealt to a super heavy) then I think it would be a bit fair both ways.

 krodarklorr wrote:
Honestly, in 8th edition, if they set in the rules of Escalation (i.e. 1 additional victory point for every 3 Hull points/wounds dealt to a super heavy) then I think it would be a bit fair both ways.

except hull point for hull point some current vehicles are tougher then many super heavies. the land raider come to mind (it'd actually be a vehicle that'd work very well converted to a super heavy)