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Hey Dakka-ites,

Looking for feedback and improvements on this list. It's meant to be my core 1K list that gets built on as I go. I have other units but this is how I want to start off the army really. It's got some speed, some heavy hit, and some bodies, without being a master of any of those styles.

Let me know what you think, I'm interested in opinions of TWEAKS, I'm not looking to totally trash the structure though I can swap a few things out.

HQ
Farseer-Singing Spear

Troops
11 Guardian Defenders, Warlock, Bright Lance Platform
11 Guardian Defenders, Warlock, Starcannon Platform
3 Jetbikes, 1 Scatter Laser

Elites
5 Wraithblades (twin swords)
Wave Serpent, TL Scatter Laser

Fast Attack
6 Swooping Hawks, Exarch, Sunrifle, Power Weapon

Heavy Support
2 War Walkers, Scatter Laser and Bright Lance (both walkers)

Rounds out to exactly 1000.

Essentially, one of the guardian squads, farseer, and walkers form a firebase. The hawks jump in to drop grenades and generally make a mobile nuisance of themselves with that Sunrifle, and if needed jump into close combat. The wraithblades go make a mess up close and the second guardian squad scoots and shoots. Jetbikes are for harrassment or last minute grabs.

What do you think? What would you change, what would you drop?

And thank you in advance!

-SCP

Wraith blades aren't great. They're even worse in a serpent. It's not an assault transport, so a turn 3 charge is the earliest you'll get in, and that's unlikely. Guard are far superior in every way. And only 10 points more for 5 D cannons.

The war walkers seem confused as to their role. Scatter lasers and bright lances often want different targets. Personally I'd pick a role and stick to it. In this list I'd go dual lances. I'd also probably split them into single units. It means the enemy can't target one unit and get both. I'd then swap the guardians bright lance and go for both with starcannons.

Ditch the power weapon on the hawks. That gets you the points to upgrade blades to guard. The hawks don't want combat, ever. Unless it's with a vehicle that can't hit back. They're terrible at combat. And will die if the enemy coughs.

The bikes aren't going to be doing much narrating with a 12" range and only one with a laser. But they'll be useful as objective grabbers.

How do you intend to deal with fliers? And what's the farseers job?

Shadow Captain Proteus wrote:
3 Jetbikes, 1 Scatter Laser

Find points for the full 3 Scat upgrades. Maybe from losing the Wraithblades. To make those work will be tough (Warlord traits and such).

Shadow Captain Proteus wrote:

Elites
5 Wraithblades (twin swords)
Wave Serpent, TL Scatter Laser

Khane's Wrath is right about these. What other models you got?

Shadow Captain Proteus wrote:
Fast Attack
6 Swooping Hawks, Exarch, Sunrifle, Power Weapon

Khane's Wrath is right here too. Exarch not needed, and sissy STR with a power toy is meh. Play these *really* fast guys as though they'll never soil their gloves with filthy h2h.

Shadow Captain Proteus wrote:
Heavy Support
2 War Walkers, Scatter Laser and Bright Lance (both walkers)

Codex hang over, eh? I did the same thing. Switch to dual BLs on one walker, dual Scats on the other, and always split walkers up as small groups, and Outflank.

Okay, I'll try and answer in one shot.

The farseer is backup only. He was a fluffier choice than the Autarch, and can back up the walkers and guardians in the back with psychic powers, and if things get too dense, throw his toothpick.

Blades...well, hmm. 1 Do they REALLY suck? I was looking at them as toughies, but okay. 2. I have Striking Scorpions and Dire Avengers, but was trying not to go too aspect heavy. Also have a wraithlord, ranger squad, and reapers. I figured these were a better choice than storm guardians.

Agreed on the Hawks, so I'll keep them mobile and shooty.

And yes, my walkers are a carry over. Havent really changed them much.

May help to know that my local meta doesnt use many FMC's or Knights/Titans. Almost everyone plays "3rd ed" style armies.

I could figure all the other tweaks but I guess my question is: If I drop the blades, what can I swap them with for CC? I don't want an army that can only pull triggers. Looks from my end like all I have is the Scorpions, which would render the WS useless, or Dire Avengers, which are a bit more of a tactical unit anyway.

Thanks so far,

-SCP

Shadow Captain Proteus wrote:
Blades...well, hmm. 1 Do they REALLY suck? I was looking at them as toughies, but okay.

It's not that they suck so much as the mechanism to get them into h2h is really tough.

Turn 1. Move your Wave Serpent into the enemy. Hope to survive it getting shot.
Turn 2. Disembark and whistle Dixie as they can't assault that turn. Hope to survive it getting shot.
Turn 3. Now they go eat.

Of course, it's not always that way. Are there lotsa bikes in your 3e sort of meta? Maybe they'll charge in. Maybe TH/SS termies?

Allying with Dark Eldar and using a WWP is an option but radically different and, you know, needing some Dark Eldar. :(

Better played Wraithblades are a full 10, with heavy farseer support, Invis, Fortune, the works. A truly nasty Deathstar.

Shadow Captain Proteus wrote:
2. I have Striking Scorpions and Dire Avengers, but was trying not to go too aspect heavy. Also have a wraithlord, ranger squad, and reapers. I figured these were a better choice than storm guardians.

Reapers came up pretty good in this book, but if you're staying away from Aspect, and not using the Aspect Host formation ....

Shadow Captain Proteus wrote:
I could figure all the other tweaks but I guess my question is: If I drop the blades, what can I swap them with for CC? I don't want an army that can only pull triggers. Looks from my end like all I have is the Scorpions, which would render the WS useless, or Dire Avengers, which are a bit more of a tactical unit anyway.
Thanks so far,
-SCP

The thing is, unless you run the WBlades as above, they're a 2nd half piece. A lot of points to eat only one or two units by game's end.

Perhaps the WBs *and* Infiltrating Scorpions?

Anyway you slice it, elves are not h2h badasses (I don't own banshees so this can be a point of contention). This is a shooty book. They haven't been h2h badasses since 4e Rending went away and Harlies cried without needing to act.

If you want good h2h, get a WraithKnight, Glaive & Shimmer Shield. See if your local meta is okay with the GargCreature and Destroyer rules. He's fun.

Okay, after reading over the suggestions, I actually came up with a completely different tactic that I don't see much. Want to try it.

I noticed after reading through the codex that basically all shuriken weapons have the Bladestorm rule. Granted, I won't be counting on it as a one trick pony, but I've thrown as many varieties of frisbee into this list as I dare. It also remedies the wraithblades with another unit-Dire Avengers. I also didn't want to do one of the jetbike/d weapon spam lists I see so much of. I wanna make a real ulthwe styled list here, or at least in the main.

What do you guys think of THIS?

HQ Farseer
Singing Spear

TROOPS
10 Guardian Defenders, warlock, starcannon
10 Guardian Defenders, warlock, bright lance
3 jetbikes, 3 Shuriken Cannons
10 Dire Avengers, Exarch w/diresword and pistol
Wave Serpent, TL scatter laser

FAST ATTACK
6 Swooping Hawks, exarch with sunrifle

HEAVY SUPPORT
War Walker, Bright Lance, Scatter Laser
War Walker, Bright Lance, Scatter Laser

Total: 1002 Points

I know I should probably switch the weapons on the war walkers, but that approach has always worked for me and given the list some redundancy, though I will split them up at least at this points level.

Essentially, the farseer and guardian units stick together to shoot the b'jesus out of anything close and render it into small bits of cat food. The Avengers zoom up in their wagon, dismount, have a spectacular turn of shooting (backed up, or softened up by the Hawks or Jetbikes) and then if needed, get in close and put that diresword to use. The walkers and the brightlance platform for turn one, maybe turn two go after any armor or fliers.

I have all the models for this, and am already painting them up as fast as I can, I hope to get this on a board in the next few weeks.

It might not be a tournament list, but what do you think of this one?

-SCP

You do know that Scatter Lasers no longer have Laser Lock right? There's really no reason to put both those weapons on the same War Walker. At least consider putting 2 Brightlances on 1 and 2 Scatter lasers on the other. That way you have one War Walker for shooting heavy armor and the other for shooting light armor or infantry.

Classic Ulthwe had a lot of help from Dark Reapers due to their proximity to the Eye of Terror. So if I were going with a themed Ulthwe army, I'd swap the Swooping Hawks for Dark Reapers. That way you only have 1 aspect in the army outside of Dark Reaper, just like the classic Ulthwe Strike Force lists. It also helps that Dark Reapers are really strong this edition.