Warhammer 40k Vs Mass Effect

Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:

No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.

If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

**Co'tor Shas**

Evident-Disaster wrote:
@thegreatchimp

I'm curious but what kind of punishment can an Astartes Armour take? I know there are weak points in the armour design, but from the fluff, it always indicates that their armour could withstand a lot of punishment, from shrugging off multitudes of projectiles to surviving impacts from incredible heights.

But in terms of projectile weapons, can they withstand sustained barrage from auto-guns? Or a large calibre sniper rifle? Like a .50 calibre or 20mm?

Mass Accelerators are intended to hit with as much force as a high calibre rifle in modern firepower, and they have near infinite ammunition or hundred to thousands of rounds thanks to integrated heat sinks or detachable ones. I'm just trying to figure out how much firepower it'd take to penetrate through armour like Ceremite and such.

As for other things, what is the firepower of a Tau Rail Gun? I mean did they ever actually specify in which level of speeds it was ever rated within either hypersonic or ultra-velocity?

They are often called hypersonic, and even with rail rifles you hear the "crack" after the thing hits it's target, but there isn't much in the way of specifics. But think about this, the broadsides weapon (the heavy rail rifle, which is weaker) has enough power to punch strait through a tank, pulling all the crew and loose object thought the several inch exit hole. All that was left of the crew was a servile meter length red stain. Railguns are weapons that often kill heavy tanks in a single shot, and can even take out the lighter titains with a lucky hit. And that's just the basic railgun, heavy railguns are dedicated anti-titian weapons, and excel at the role. The first time a tiger shark AX-1-0 was deployed, it brought down the titan's void shields with a missile barrage, and then killed it with a single shot.

**Co'tor Shas**

Asherian Command wrote:

The tau would be destroyed in the ship to ship combat. Remember the crusade against the tau? you know the patehtically small fleet that almost destroyed the tau?

And the small titan legion that almost wiped out the tau as well?

Yeah I remember that.

The tau are pathetic in the eyes of the imperium.

You appear to be thinking of the Damocles crusade, instead of the more recent taros campaign. During the taros campaign, the tau unveiled stuff like the tiger shark ax-1-0, with guns powerful enough to one-shot titans. And that was also when their new fleet was used, which are more than a match to the imperial vessels While the imperium lost 2 cruisers, a light cruiser and 8 escorts, the tau lost one carrier and 8 escorts.

Now the tau are still tiny to the imperium, but regularly defeat imperial forces much greater in size.

**Co'tor Shas**

Asherian Command wrote:
Co'tor Shas wrote:
Asherian Command wrote:

The tau would be destroyed in the ship to ship combat. Remember the crusade against the tau? you know the patehtically small fleet that almost destroyed the tau?

And the small titan legion that almost wiped out the tau as well?

Yeah I remember that.

The tau are pathetic in the eyes of the imperium.

You appear to be thinking of the Damocles crusade, instead of the more recent taros campaign. During the taros campaign, the tau unveiled stuff like the tiger shark ax-1-0, with guns powerful enough to one-shot titans. And that was also when their new fleet was used, which are more than a match to the imperial vessels While the imperium lost 2 cruisers, a light cruiser and 8 escorts, the tau lost one carrier and 8 escorts.

Now the tau are still tiny to the imperium, but regularly defeat imperial forces much greater in size.

Taros Campagin ugh. The one where it was only imperial guard and a small titan legion? Right?

Then the Ziest campagin where the space marines almost annihilated the Tau and reclaimed half the worlds the tau conquered.

Ah the zeist campaign, which was a diversion by shadowsun. She took the opportunity with the imperium distracted, to claim even more worlds. The reading in the tau codex is:

The space marines drive the tau from many worlds in the sector, and while losses are regrettable, the gains elsewhere are on such a scale that, even to the causality conscious tau, shadowsun's diversion seems not just acceptable, but shrewd.

And I'll remind you that during the Taros campaign, there were four companies of marines. And we have no record of the size of the titian legion in the Damocles crusade, only that it existed.

**Co'tor Shas**

Hoyt wrote:

The Tau carrier was in fact a Custodian-class Battleship (http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Custodian-class_Battleship), the most powerful vessel the Tau can field. It managed to destroy a Lunar-Class Cruiser, one of the most common Imperial warships (six hundred in service with the Imperium in the Segmentum Obscurus alone, probably more ships than the entire Tau navy has at it's disposal). Other than that ship(which isn't very impressive), Tau vessels are completely outmatched in space and would get slaughtered in open combat, against a proper Imperial fleet.

The Tau won the Taros campaign because of poor choices on the Imperium's part, nothing more. The only reason their hasn't been a proper crusade mounted against the Tau is because the other threats the Imperium face are far greater than a tiny Xeno empire taking some border worlds.

Though by Mass Effect standards the Tau would crush the Reapers, nevermind the Citadel races.

That's because the tau are tiny compared to the imperium. A "proper" imperial fleet is probably 3x the size of a tau one with some ships that the tau have no equivalent for.. But that's not what I'm talking about, I'm talking about equivalent ships. Tau cruisers are a match for imperial cruisers, that sort of thing.

I'm not arguing that the tau can stand against the might of the imperium, far from it (I even say they can't in my original post), I'm simply disagreeing that the tau are as outmatched as asherian makes them out to be.

**Co'tor Shas**

Hoyt wrote:
Co'tor Shas wrote:
Hoyt wrote:

The Tau carrier was in fact a Custodian-class Battleship (http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Custodian-class_Battleship), the most powerful vessel the Tau can field. It managed to destroy a Lunar-Class Cruiser, one of the most common Imperial warships (six hundred in service with the Imperium in the Segmentum Obscurus alone, probably more ships than the entire Tau navy has at it's disposal). Other than that ship(which isn't very impressive), Tau vessels are completely outmatched in space and would get slaughtered in open combat, against a proper Imperial fleet.

The Tau won the Taros campaign because of poor choices on the Imperium's part, nothing more. The only reason their hasn't been a proper crusade mounted against the Tau is because the other threats the Imperium face are far greater than a tiny Xeno empire taking some border worlds.

Though by Mass Effect standards the Tau would crush the Reapers, nevermind the Citadel races.

That's because the tau are tiny compared to the imperium. A "proper" imperial fleet is probably 3x the size of a tau one with some ships that the tau have no equivalent for.. But that's not what I'm talking about, I'm talking about equivalent ships. Tau cruisers are a match for imperial cruisers, that sort of thing.

I'm not arguing that the tau can stand against the might of the imperium, far from it (I even say they can't in my original post), I'm simply disagreeing that the tau are as outmatched as asherian makes them out to be.

Most Tau ships cannot match the Imperial equivalent though, the only known ship is the Custodian-class Battleship, which is a match for one of the weakest Imperial cruisers, the Lunar-Class.

And where do you get that information, may I ask?

**Co'tor Shas**

Asherian Command wrote:
Co'tor Shas wrote:
Hoyt wrote:
Co'tor Shas wrote:
Hoyt wrote:

The Tau carrier was in fact a Custodian-class Battleship (http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Custodian-class_Battleship), the most powerful vessel the Tau can field. It managed to destroy a Lunar-Class Cruiser, one of the most common Imperial warships (six hundred in service with the Imperium in the Segmentum Obscurus alone, probably more ships than the entire Tau navy has at it's disposal). Other than that ship(which isn't very impressive), Tau vessels are completely outmatched in space and would get slaughtered in open combat, against a proper Imperial fleet.

The Tau won the Taros campaign because of poor choices on the Imperium's part, nothing more. The only reason their hasn't been a proper crusade mounted against the Tau is because the other threats the Imperium face are far greater than a tiny Xeno empire taking some border worlds.

Though by Mass Effect standards the Tau would crush the Reapers, nevermind the Citadel races.

That's because the tau are tiny compared to the imperium. A "proper" imperial fleet is probably 3x the size of a tau one with some ships that the tau have no equivalent for.. But that's not what I'm talking about, I'm talking about equivalent ships. Tau cruisers are a match for imperial cruisers, that sort of thing.

I'm not arguing that the tau can stand against the might of the imperium, far from it (I even say they can't in my original post), I'm simply disagreeing that the tau are as outmatched as asherian makes them out to be.

Most Tau ships cannot match the Imperial equivalent though, the only known ship is the Custodian-class Battleship, which is a match for one of the weakest Imperial cruisers, the Lunar-Class.

And where do you get that information, may I ask?

Thats from battlefleet gothic.

I'm talking about the specifics that the custodian is only equal to a luner. I have the taros campaign book and it says that the battleship was, in fact, perceived to be the main threat to the imperial fleet, and was specifically the main focus of the imperial fleet until it was eventually destroyed.

Also remember the Ziest campagin was considered a success the whole idea that shadow sun out witted Cato Scarius who is hundreds of years older than her is hilarious though.

Also the ziest campagin thing to quote the wiki

By this time, the Ultramarines were no longer the only Space Marine forces in the assault. Forces from the Night Watch, Halo Dragons, Silver Skulls, Sable Swords, Crimson Fists, Iron Lords, Aurora Chapter, Eagle Warriors and the Knights of the Raven, as well as many others, had all joined the Ultramarines in the attack on Augura. Despite the advanced technology, Battlesuits and weaponry, the Tau had no hope for defeating such a huge combined force of Space Marines. Augura's fortresses, shipyards and weapons factories were destroyed and the Tau expansion ended with the Tau falling back to protect more secure territory.[1]
Unfortunately, though the Space Marines had won the war, it was not possible to sanction a thrust into Tau held space as the individual Space Marine forces were required elsewhere in the galaxy and it was only reluctantly that Sicarius gave control of the defence back to the planetary governors.[1]

The Ziest sector was very important and was a tactical victory. The tau took planets no doubt but they were not very important nor where they forgeworlds who often blow themselves up so the tau can't get their technology.

It's what it says in the book, blame the authors not me. To quote.

The anticipated counter-attack from the imperium fell upon the Zeist sector, and this too was part of Shadowsun's plan. As a diversion, this far-flung system was scarified for the Greater Good of the Third Sphere Expansion. While many seeded colonies fell to the elite forces of the imperium - their vaunted Space Marines - the effort tied down the majority of the Imperium's rapid strike forces and allowed the main Tau assaults to scythe deeply into more desirable neighboring star systems. The worlds of the Imperium toppled on after another before the precision onslaught.

Edit: also, I note that lexicanum seems to only use SM codex as a source, where as the tau codex is the only place where this info is.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Hoyt wrote:

The Battle for the Taros System, the Custodian-Class shipA'Rho managed to destroy a Lunar-Class Cruiser while suffering extensive damage, then Admiral Kotto's battlecruiser finished it off. It's the only known deployment of the Custodian class, the most powerful tau ship.

Also this; http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Lar%27shi_Class_Cruiser

During that conflict, the Tau had been shown first-hand where the Kor'vattra was lacking, and attempted to design a ship that could match the Imperium's Lunar Class Cruiser. Although the resulting vessel was still no match for a comparable Imperial warship, the vessel that resulted was nonetheless a credible ship of the line.

You mean a completely different (now obsolete) ship? Their fleet was originally much weaker than the imperium's (I even said as much), but the new fleet is a match.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Peregrine wrote:
Hoyt wrote:
Most Tau ships cannot match the Imperial equivalent though, the only known ship is the Custodian-class Battleship, which is a match for one of the weakest Imperial cruisers, the Lunar-Class.

1) The Custodian class is primarily a carrier, not a true battleship, even if BFG calls it a battleship for rules/size purposes.

Yep, tau don't actually have a battleship, nor are they likely to get one, as BFG isn't being made anymore.

edit: And it should be noted, IA3 even calls it a"carrier

**Co'tor Shas**

Hoyt wrote:

You mean a completely different (now obsolete) ship? Their fleet was originally much weaker than the imperium's (I even said as much), but the new fleet is a match.

That class was born out lessons learned in the Damacles crusade and failed to match a Light Cruiser. Can't find anymore info on any new ships the tau have developed, probably because BFG isn't being made anymore.

Read the taros campaign then. First edition mind you, they, and the epic rules, were cut out of the new one.

**Co'tor Shas**

Asherian Command wrote:
Edit: also, I note that lexicanum seems to only use SM codex as a source, where as the tau codex is the only place where this info is.

So it is techinically propaganda or is it truth?

Remember unreliable narrator.

No, It's just that the wiki hasn't been updated yet.

Edit: also, looking over IA3, it specifically says it the largest ship "yet encountered", leading for the possibility of new ships (and this is the tau, so that's pretty normal). Not useful on a the basis of comparison, but important nevertheless.

**Co'tor Shas**

Sort of but sort of not. They had existed for a while, but this was the first time they were seen in significant numbers, other than just individual ships. I'll have to look into it more

**Co'tor Shas**

Aww, but Love arguing about tau.