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Just like the title says can I exchange it for a thunder hammer after i take TDA?

 Mordred wrote:
Just like the title says can I exchange it for a thunder hammer after i take TDA?

while there's no limitations against it, it makes no sense to replace his power maul (crozius is the exact same statline). I'm also a little confused why you would? It's his badge of office.

 ionusx wrote:

 Mordred wrote:
Just like the title says can I exchange it for a thunder hammer after i take TDA?

while there's no limitations against it, it makes no sense to replace his power maul (crozius is the exact same statline). I'm also a little confused why you would? It's his badge of office.

my fluff excuse is that its a special relic crozius that ruleswise functions as a thunderhammer. plan on putting him in with DW Knights and his 3 ap2 attacks would be nice in a challenge.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
so it will still look like a crozius just hit harder

Can anyone show me where a crozius is listed as a power maul.
I'm aware it has the same stats but have never seen it stated in any rules that they should be considered the same

 jokerkd wrote:
Can anyone show me where a crozius is listed as a power maul.
I'm aware it has the same stats but have never seen it stated in any rules that they should be considered the same

6th Edition FAQs converted the Crozius to a Power Maul.

But the codices since then have changed them to a weapon with its own name that just matches the Power Maul.

So, am i right in saying that the chaplain couldn't exchange his crozius for the hammer anyway?

For some reason I expected this to be an easy answer for someone but it's weird how something as simple and potentially common as this issue has us all unsure.

The problem is that is we have a weapon that is Crozius by name but is only a Power Weapon by effect and we don't know if that is enough to qualify for switching into a thunder hammer.

Agreed, it's not a "power weapon" regardless of it's stats so no swapping for a thunder hammer. You can still get a thunder hammer via swapping out his storm bolter, it is more expensive to do so though.

We have two questions that need to be answered here.

The 1st is the one most people have brought up. Does the option for an I.Chaplain in TDA to take weapons from the Terminator Weapons list permit it to replace is crozius for as thunder hammer. As many have pointed out the crozius is not in the list of power weapons in the BRB, nor is it described by the codex as a power weapon and to access the thunder hammer from this list you must replace a power weapon. RAW, it is no more a power weapon then a thunder hammer or power fist so no, you cannot exchange it for the thunder hammer from this list.

The 2nd is based on a potential over-site by GW. The I. Chaplain "May take items from the Melee Weapons, Ranged Weapons, Special Issue Wargear and/or Relics of Caliban lists". I see no reason why the I.Chaplain can't replace his melee weapon (a crozius is in the melee section of the codex's armory) for a thunder hammer from the Melee Weapons list. As it is written the option is not limited to models not in terminator armor nor would the upgrade to terminator armor require the corzius to still be present.

So yes, RAW I believe it is possible for a I.Chaplain in TDA to replace his Crozius with a thunder hammer. I'm just not sure its the RAI.

I'm going to have to say no on this one. As others have stated, nowhere is the crozius described as a "power weapon", and the rules for replacing weapons on a model in terminator armor specifically say that only a power weapon may be replaced.

For that matter, a standard I. chaplain, IMO, can't replace his crozius either. The rules for melee weapons say that he can replace his boltgun, bolt pistol, or "Melee weapon".... while a crozius is "technically" a melee weapon, it isn't listed under wargear list. Unless you have a weapon that's on the wargear list, or that it specifically says a weapon can be replaced, it can't be swapped out.

 kingbobbito wrote:
IFor that matter, a standard I. chaplain, IMO, can't replace his crozius either. The rules for melee weapons say that he can replace his boltgun, bolt pistol, or "Melee weapon".... while a crozius is "technically" a melee weapon, it isn't listed under wargear list. Unless you have a weapon that's on the wargear list, or that it specifically says a weapon can be replaced, it can't be swapped out.

What? The Crozious is listed right under bolt pistol in his wargear. Its also listed under "melee weapons" in the armory of the rock.

 DJGietzen wrote:
We have two questions that need to be answered here.

The 1st is the one most people have brought up. Does the option for an I.Chaplain in TDA to take weapons from the Terminator Weapons list permit it to replace is crozius for as thunder hammer. As many have pointed out the crozius is not in the list of power weapons in the BRB, nor is it described by the codex as a power weapon and to access the thunder hammer from this list you must replace a power weapon. RAW, it is no more a power weapon then a thunder hammer or power fist so no, you cannot exchange it for the thunder hammer from this list.

The 2nd is based on a potential over-site by GW. The I. Chaplain "May take items from the Melee Weapons, Ranged Weapons, Special Issue Wargear and/or Relics of Caliban lists". I see no reason why the I.Chaplain can't replace his melee weapon (a crozius is in the melee section of the codex's armory) for a thunder hammer from the Melee Weapons list. As it is written the option is not limited to models not in terminator armor nor would the upgrade to terminator armor require the corzius to still be present.

So yes, RAW I believe it is possible for a I.Chaplain in TDA to replace his Crozius with a thunder hammer. I'm just not sure its the RAI.

I am satisfied with this answer, I thank you good sir for your thorough response.

Question. Does a Chaplain in Terminator armour have access to the Melee Weapons list?

 Happyjew wrote:
Question. Does a Chaplain in Terminator armour have access to the Melee Weapons list?

Thats what I think the oversight is. I don't think they are intended to based on the way the TDA option is listed but nothing actually makes the two options mutually exclusive, so technically yes he does.

Ah why not just swap the crosious for the mace of redemption. Not as powerful as TH but its never let me down yet