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I recently bought a job lot of bikes from ebay to add to my small collection of bikes. Based on the models I have (30 bikes and 3 attack bikes), I have created this list which I have tried to make as competitive as possible. I sent the list into Lawrence at Tabletop Tactics (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cofBH22Xhos However, you need to be a member to view). He misread my email slightly but more or less agreed that the list was, indeed, very competitive. I would like to hear what the dakka community think of the list.

Clan Raukaan 1850

HQ
Chapter master, bike, artificer armour, thunder hammer, lightning claw, gorgon's chain 260

Elites
Command squad, bike, 4 storm shields, 4 grav guns, apothecary 240
Command squad, bike, 4 storm shields, 4 grav guns, apothecary 240
Command squad, bike, 4 storm shields, thunder hammer, 2 power fists apothecary 260

Troops
5 bikes, 2 melta guns, melta bombs 130
5 bikes, 2 melta guns, melta bombs 130

Fast Attack
3 Attack bikes, 3 Multi-melta 150

Libraius Conclave
Librarian, bike, lvl 2 110
Librarian, bike, lvl 2 110
Librarian, bike, lvl 2 110
Librarian, bike, lvl 2 110


The units roles are pretty straight-forward. The librarians will choose powers and join units depending on the opponent's list.
Against hordes, I will choose from pyromancy and sanctic to get the nova powers and Gate of Infinity.
Against other lists, I will try to get invisibility and endurance to keep the units alive.
Against knights or av 14 heavy lists, I will try for hammerhand on the CC command squad
Against flying monstrous creature spam, I will try for prescience and perfect timing.

The biggest weakness is that it has no answer to flyers other than prescienced attack bike multi-meltas and trying for objuration mechanium.


What are your thoughts?

I was thinking of a similar list, but with stormwing formation. 3 elite bikes running around with storm shields and 4+ FNP would be hard to bring down. But of course hordes and a lot of objective secure units could be a challenge. I still think its competitive. Just not sure of the conclave. Like I said I would go with stormwing.

sorry to say it, nothing personal, but boring, boring, boring.
these lists IMHO are just plain silly, but I assume you are just putting something as competitive as possible and not trying to have a good game versus someone. If you enjoy playing it, good for you. I certainly wouldn't and I can't imagine many enjoying playing against it.

Thanks for the honest feedback. I'm very new to the game and wanted to make the best list I could with the models I have.

I hadn't really considered that no one would want to play me!

jonny123 wrote:
Thanks for the honest feedback. I'm very new to the game and wanted to make the best list I could with the models I have.

I hadn't really considered that no one would want to play me!

I think my comments yesterday were out of line. It's your game and you should be able to play it how you want without judgement from others. A lot depends on where you play. Some stores/circle of friends are very competitive and this list would fit right in. However, if you are playing in a fairly casual group this list might seem obnoxious to them so you really have to figure out the local "meta" in which you plan to play. It would be similar to an Eldar playing a jetbike army with scatterbikes everywhere, and spending the remaining points are multiple wraithknights.
It's a strong list that is relying on "spam", which as a new player who may not know, means taking the best items in a list and using a crap ton of it.

It definitely looks like a list where those three command squads are gonna have to win you the game. I can see what bullyboy is talking about and how some people may not want to play against you but that totally depends on how your gaming group plays the game. You can still have a fun game if both players have competitive lists and want to win, it's just the attitude. For example, I play orks and would totally play against your army because grav doesn't do a alot to me But a casual marine player who maybe isn't running the newest stuff like the battle company or the skyhammer might get a bit frustrated. Anyways it looks like a cool list, but be careful when positioning your command squads because if you lose even 1 squad turn 1 its basically the game. You lose a significant amount of damage each time a squad, or hell, even a model dies.

I completely agree with what you are saying, Zavvy; any losses, even just a model, will greatly affect the list, especially if the apothecary can be sniped out.

Also, i agree that the grav guns are ineffective aganist hordes but have you ever faced psykers using the pyromancy powers o the other nova power? They seem like they could be very effective against hordes.

You have very very few "boots on the ground" here and zero anti air. Additionally you have the one 2+ chapter master but very few other "tanks". I think any list with volume of fire will give you significant challenges as you just don't have the wound pool, even with t5 3+, 3++, FNP, and jink, to sustain any kind of losses. As stated above this or leaves you very vunerable to a bad roll as every model you loose, particularly the apothecaries, takes your damage potential down, and possibly your survivability down.

I think in major tournaments you will find limited success against MSU armies. Something that I can think would be a really bad match up would be canopteck harvest spam. Those wraiths could tarpit your deathstar and grav guns meanwhile securing objectives because of superior model count. A lot of the new space marine Demi company lists with free transports will give you problems just based on the number of threats you'll have to deal with.

Just some thoughts.

Thanks for the comment Epartalis. The army is small and there is no AA. However, my ability to tank wounds will come from the librarians who can roll for invisibility, shrouding or endurance.

And high volume of fire would be a problem but with lucky rolls for my psychic support the army will be tougher than it first seems.

As i mentioned in my original comment, I was just trying to make the best list I could with the models I have (30 bikes and 3 attack bikes).

I do not think that the list is unbeatable but it is strong and will create an unusual challenge for opponents.

Just because you took the grav guns doesn't mean you can't just use your bike mounted Twin Linked Bolters. The list is very fast, and you have the option of playing keep away with your units and just pinging away with those until its safe to charge in and finish things off.

Big cheese, if I play keep away, i'm probably going to be out of range with my guns even if I use the bolters. However, with the CM tanking and invisibility on a squad, I should be able to concentrate fire on specific units. Also, a prescienced orbital bombardment is not a bad trick to have up my sleeve.

I do wonder how I will combat flyers. I have thought about the FW Helios defence platform. I could swap out the attack bikes for 2 units of 3 of these. Or, alternatively, I could swap the attack bikes for a mortis dreadnought with lascannons for roughly the same cost.

The problem with the hyperios platforms is that it takes a huge chunk out of my ability to take out ground vehicles and infantry. However, provides 4 shots from two separate units.

The problem with the single mortis dreadnought is that it is likely to get targeted straightaway and taken out before it is any use.

Any other AA suggestions??

No AA suggestions for this army?

Your command squads are so durable that flyers don't really present all that much threat except in the absolute extremes.

If you're desperate for anti-air you could consider Red Hunter chapter tactics for sky fire for one turn... would cost a lot of your feel no pain though so probably wouldn't be worth it

I wouldn't bother with the powerfists and thunder hammer but would go for another 4 grav guns since you have your beatstick chapter master and will rarely need much more combat power than that. That saves you 20 points.

The last option I would consider would be to swap the librarian formation, the attack bikes and 1 storm shield per unit for the tyrannic war veteran formation (the one with a command squad and 5 storm talons) for a bit more variety and air supremacy. your librarians are mainly boosting your command squad's killing power because its not that worth casting defensive spells on your command squads. Say you get invisibility, thats nice but only really works on single deathstars since with multiple command squad 'stars' the opponent can just focus on bringing down the other stars. If you're going for offensive power the storm talons bring 5 assault cannons and 5 sky hammer missiles with strafing run on anti-flyer platforms. Just an idea

I'd actually consider this list more of a biker themed list than a tourney list.
Since you have the models go ahead and try some games, thats the best way to find out its weaknesses.

As for local players I don't see why anyone wouldn't play you, there are a lot more 'not nice' lists out there.

-Demons/CSM with Belakor, Fateweaver, grimoire D-Thirster, Heldrake
-Green tide
-Scatterbikes + Wraithknights
-Double demi-company
-Tau castle
-Tau + demons
-5 Flyrants + mucalid spores
-Skyhammer
-5 Knights
-Mechanicus grav spam

Choasmarauder, how do you think my list would fare against some of the lists which you have mentioned?

So, I've played a few friendly games againts friends. A Tau gunline for a relic game; Space wolves; and a devastator heavy Space marine list.

The list obliterated the Tau and the Space Wolves easily. However, the devastator heavy SM list had too much fire power and, as we were playing the length of the table, I couldn't get into range quickly enough and he was able to target my apothecaries with his plasma blasts.

Still messing about with the psychic powers to get a fun and useful mix of abilities which is not just try as hard as I can for invisibility.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
I have also been tempted to change the chapter tactics to White Scars. Obviously the CM would have to be changed. He would lose the lightning claw and Gorgon's chain and have them replaced by the shield eternal which would save me 10 points.

I would then take one of the grav command squads and give 3 of them power swords/storm shields instead of the grav/storm shield combo and give the other veteran a pair of lightning claws. I really fancy beating face in combat and hit-and-running all over the board.

Does anyone have any experience of White Scars who could help? One thing I am concerned about is that with all those power weapons and powerfists in each squad I may obliterate the enemy unit before I get a chance to hit and run??

Surprised this list did well against Tau.

Yeah, he had 3 riptides and missile sides focused his fire on my Command squads which tanked loads of wounds. The CM was awesome. Then, before he knew it, I was all over his units and mauled them with grav and in combat.

Yeah I don't think riptide spam really works that well .He should have gone for FW dakka.