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So I know the serpent is better than the falcon, but I am wanting to try out the cloudstrike formation just to screw with people and have some fun. Here's what it looks like right now.

CAD:
Autarch - bike, lance, mask
5 scat bikes
10 guardians - star cannon
10 guardians - star cannon
6 dire avengers - w/exarch (twin-linked gun)
3x falcons - starcannons and holo fields
fire prism - holo fields

Aspect host
5 dragons - exarch pike
5 dragons - exarch pike
5 spiders - exarch twin-linked gun & power blades

LoW:
Knight - 2x scatter lasers and 2x wraith cannons

So the 2 units of dragons and the unit of dire avengers go in the falcons. Autarch is there for reserve manipulation, so I just need a 2+ for my falcons to come in turn 2. I wanted my favorite unit of 5 dark reapers in the aspect host, but I was wanting to run the fire prism (that'd be my first choice to ditch (that and the spiders). So a pretty mobile list. Not a terrible beta-ish strike with 10 melta shots and 12 shuriken shots. My real questions is do I have enough on the table to last turn 1. Lots of squishy 5+ saves and no psychics to back them up. If I switched the prism & spiders for the reapers I think I could squeeze a farseer in there to be a buffer for the army.

Thoughts guys? I have a tourney a week from Saturday that I'm prepping for. Thanks!

My gut feeling is this list has so much "not going for it" that it is hard to know where to start, and I am a big fan of falcons.

SYNERGY.

This list lacks it. Perhaps you have built the best one shot murder anti tank alpha strike system eldar have in the game - great to kill wraithknights or super heavies. But then what? Where is the synergy between this single purpose core and the rest of the list? How do you handle tryanids? Or 70 orks in trukks? Or 9 razor backs?

To be honest this list looks like a cloud strike squadron with "whatever you have in the cupboard" along for the ride. We can't all be millionaires and I'm not being cynical at all but is that what this list is? "Make and mend" plus a cloudstrike? There is nothing wrong with that (I am being sincere!) But equally then this post has little scope to aid you.

If you say "this is what I have help me make a 1850 list from it" then that is a different proposition.

If this is a "want to take cloudstrike how best to fit it into 1850 tourney" then I can sort of offer advice.

Take one squad of fire dragons only. Then leave the other falcons empty gove them all bright lances. I would doubt that this squadron plus the dragons couldn't "delete" about 4 to 6 hull points a turn. If you think you need 7+ hull points deleted per turn take 2 squads of dragons.

Take a max squad of warp spiders - maybe even two. Put the autarch in there somewhere with a jump generator. Place them on the board. Put them in front of any of the flanking you do. They mix well with jet bikes. Very well.

Drop all the dire avengers/guardians for scat bikes.

Get WK but hold him in reserve if they got grav.

Get a crimson hunter.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
PS if you absolutely HAVE to have star canon for dual purpose strategies, don't take them. In fact take NO UPGRADES on the turret keep the shuriken canon then upgrade the hull mointed shuriken canon. That gives you 8 shots per falcon - 24 for the squad- not a bad little investment for 10 extra points each.

It'll acheive whatever the star canon was meant to for a fraction of the cost and massivley bump versatility.

you lack AA, give the falcons EMLs so you have some skyfire. Take bikes instead of guardians. Use DAs as bubble wrap, drop one squad of fire dragons and get another of DAs maybe. Or fire prisms in a group of 3 they can be deadly. Put in those dark reapers in the aspect host. I might recommend serpents for the DAs tho they're just nice extra fire support. A farseer on bike would be beautiful.

Nalydyn : I hope I am wrong but those are all pretty bad suggestions :-/ even 3 EMLS will still take 2 turns of shooting just to have a chance of killing a flier. If they take two you are screwed, and it wastes the falcons pulse laser - which is pretty awesome as a gun. What is he bubble wrapping if he takes jetbikes as troops? How are Night Spinners (in a group of 3) not almost twice as good as fire prisms? why does he need 3 fire prisms when he has 10 fire dragons and a wraithknight?

Castellan Alaric : I forgot to mention you need to stop "upgrading" eldar stuff so much. You will save a TONNE of points. eldar are usually more than awesome with virtually no upgrades. The only upgrades I often take are exarchs, (for the formation buff) underslung shuriken canon, and jetbikes/jumppacks/wings/ weapons for characters

I appreciate the comments guys, really good stuff. I am painting my Eldar army as Yme-Loc, and they are a very heavy tank craftworld, so I was hoping to use all my grav tanks in one game. I only have 5 spiders...and I do have dark reapers, but my unit of 5 with starshot in the aspect host is 180 points so I was trying to use some other units that don't see that light of day that much. They are BOSS though, so they'll probably find their way back in.

At the Iron Halo GT I ran a unit of wraithguard with scythes and a unit of dragons, which was great, but the guard are about 75 points more expensive so I figured another unit of dragons which would be just as good for damage and just as a general threat. The dire avengers are there to take out a infantry threat. Not a big enough unit to reliably destroy a unit, but they can damage one for sure.

I would throw more jetbikes into the list but in the list is all I have (5). I have a farseer on a bike, but I wanted the Autarch for the reserve rolls (2+ on turn 2 is nice). If I drop the guardians to rangers and lose a unit of dragons I think I can squeeze my 5 dark reapers into the aspect host for BS5 missiles everywhere.

-If I had a crimson hunter I'd field it, but I do not.
-My only Autarch is on a bike with the lance/mask combo.
-My thinking with the 2 dragons + falcons is that the falcons (switched for lances) could kill an armored unit by themselves and then each dragon unit could kill an armored or elite target at BS5 and then the dire avengers could annoy something before eating it.

I have scorpions (5 w/exarch - claw), 5 wraithguard, 2 vypers, 2 war walkers, 10 dire avengers, 20 guardians (2 platforms), 2 foot seers, 1 foot lock, 1 jetseer, 5 scat bikes, 1 bike autarch, 12 dragons (2 pike exarch's), 5 spiders (exarch), 5 reapers (exarch), 10 rangers, 1 WK, fire prism, falcon, 2 serpents (proxy as falcon for this list) and I'm pretty sure that's it. Oh I have Fuegan too if that helps lol

Any other suggestions are most welcome! Thanks guys.

Its not a bad list at all really. I faced a guy on Nick Rose's ATC team that used cloudstrike with all 3 filled with fire dragons. Just try and give the falcons as much ap2 as possible. That list had quite the volley. SInce its all one unit giving that unit fortune is fabulous. Same goes with invis and shrouding.

The fire dragons (If you use warhost) then give the fire dragons a 30 inch threat range. And Overall you are putting out about 30, twin linked or BS5 shots that are high strength and low AP. You can balance this with the (Cheap) mass fire that are scatterbikes.

Thanks Lord, I was shooting for a kind of beta strike. I'd love to get some psychic shenanigans in there (I love invis from telepathy and fortune from fate) but I don't know what to drop to keep the autarch there for reserve rolls and fire power. I wish I had more scat bikes, they would synergize perfectly here. 2 units of 5 would be epic. Alas, I have only 5 so that'll have to do. If I could fit in a farseer (foot or bike) and a warlock, do you think it'd be worth it? I could probably squeeze 140 points for a spear seer on foot and a warlock upgrade for a unit, one of the guardian squads probably.

2 farseers would rock, but then I'd lose my autarch (as I don't have enough for the warhost.

Being a squadron has it's down side re: target selection.

Which is why it can be hard to play. Once the target is dead it doesn't pay to being paying to shoot it.

Don't get me wrong having basically 4 anti tank units deep strike in will be instant death to imperial guard or even smurfs with demi company free razor backs everywhere.

But it is very list situational and eldar have so much D available it seems odd to go " high ap plinking " when you can just "D" them.


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I want to reiterate something I said breifly at the start: I really like falcons. People don't understand them. That is why people don't know what they are.

They are gun ships.

I took 3 to a 1500 tourney list back in 6th edition and they were amazing. I was shocked.

Their strength is that they can sit back and saturate a target to death. I gave mine bright lances and they were awesome at it. 9 str 8 ap 2 shots per turn means something dies. If you compare that to 3 fire prisms you get one miss two hits maybe one or two pens. Falcons will give you about 4 or 5 pens vs anything not AV14. And they are almost the same vs AV14. Yes they lack blast template mode but they get 9 shots. All ap2 str8!

I guess what I am suggesting is to flank with them. Keeping them at range with no cargo works: Dump them in a corner of your opponents deployment zone and give him no way to focus his defence. He will struggle to dig through 9 hull points

youre right I wrote that while kinda tired. Keep the falcons ground I recommend bright lance since it's a universal threat just like pulse laser. I still think you need AA, maybe the dire avengers should get a wave serpent with EML. if you're sticking with guardians may as well get an aegis for them to hide behind and it would give you an AA squad. If you give em an EML in one squad and a starcanon in the other you can deal with multiple threats while covering half your backline in bodies in cover that can dakka anything that threatens to kill your AA/termy killing blob in close range. 4 TL shots will even hit something on the ground so against non-flyer lists you can still put some hurt on medium vehicles.

If you get your falcons low enough on a flying stand you can possibly get a cover save from the aegis/gaurdians. You can DS them as well if your opponent doesn't have melta vets or something. If he does DA would be a bad bad idea since that's 400+ pts plus whatever is inside.

DSing them with dark reapers might be interesting actually. If your opponent doesn't put much on one side of the board you could put them in a flanking position with dark reapers for extra fire support with similar str to your pulse laser, or barrages of AP3 to wreck any MEQ trying to sneak up on you. Fire dragons in another one could take care of TEQ, the DAs in another for anti infantry. Would be really wonky but it could let you deal with virtually any threat. You might need more dakka then just a few DA shots though, but short of committing your falcons to firing at things I don't see much of a solution.

I would totally recommend 3 fire dragon squads though that would be a devastating DS, drop down right next to a land raider and pop it open then kill the termies inside, or shoot a bunch of russes in the butt with melta and then use the longer range of falcons to kill another target. 9 str 8 ap2 atks will usually be overkill but there are lots of wraithlords in the meta, and riptides, anything necron(reducing res rolls is always good)

I have determined in the national GT meta (and in my local meta) in order for an Eldar list to be viable for 1st it needs to be able to null deploy. Of course you wont always Null deploy, but the option needs to be there. Otherwise a Skyhammer will end the game by killing your wraithknights/bikes/whatever they feel like. CLoudstrike is great for this, because it can deploy on the table as a great fire platform/transport, or be a droppod like unit.

Grav cannot hurt buildings, so if they dont have melta in their skyhammer just deploy a bunker with something inside.


I really like the synergy between cloudstrike, scatter bikes, and seer council. If the opponent doesnt have ignores cover and you go first, most of your army has a 2+ cover save. Sprinkle with your playstyle.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Here is a 2k list I made using CLoudstrike for the ITC format. Its meant to be able to survive a skyhammer drop, as well as have an awesome alpha, or beta, strike as needs be.

It also has some impressive Maelstrom objective control and an awesome survivable star for the relic, or any emperor will objective that is hotly contested. And if you have never faced a seer council before. -4ld dominate on a green tide is something to giggle about. Not to mention invis, eldritch storm, effective psychic shriek, and great deny.

Admittedly, the list has a weakness in killpoints against some cron lists. 24 Wraiths would not be fun to face.

2k:

Farseer-100

19 Guardians-171
3x 3 man scatterbike squads= 81 x3
1 3 man bike squad- 51

3x Falcons with BL and Pulse lasers- 390

Aspect host formation:
2x 5 man fire dragon squads-240
6 man warp spider squad- 124

Seer Council Formation:
2x Farseer skyrunners and 7 Warlocks- 580

Bunker with comms relay and escape hatch- 100







Optimally everyone will be able to deploy on the board. If the opponent has a skyhammer/alpha drop with only grav, then only the guardians and farseer will deploy in the bunker. Worst case scenario, a skyhammer melta bomb kills the bunker in the assault phase and they leave the escape hatch. If they have melta, I need the guardians to bubble wrap the bunker with at least 12 inches, and the warp spiders deploy in it. These are of course, if I go 2nd. If I go first, I will deploy everything and hope they dont sieze, psychic powers should be able to save me.

Against everything else, between the council and the amount of firepower I have, I think I have a solid all comer list.


P.S. I am not worried in the least about Flyers. Their damage inflicted on me is minimal with shrouding. My ground control is absolute.

Awesome list Lord, the one flyer I'd be worried about is the heldrake, which negates cover. I kind of just ignore it and shoot as much scatter lasers at it to kill it. Maybe ~2 turns of my scat pack plus my WK. I'm just going to try out my first iteration and see how it does. I have ALWAYS loved the falcon, but when laser lock went away everybody threw in the towel and ignores it. I want to give the tank it's chance. Might not be the best idea, but I think it'll have serious teeth with all the s8ap2, with 3 lances in there as well.

Thanks fellas I'm going to try to get a game in this weekend and when I do I'll post up a batrep for y'all!

Cloudstrike is a ridiculously good foirmation, and Eldar have some of the best units to exploit what is essentially a 3 drop pod no scatter strike. It is way better in this edition than the last codex.

Definitely, I'm going to run it next game I play. I've also decided to use the leftovers of my unpainted/primed stuff towards a corsair force. I will eventually maybe run my falcon deep strike as all of my proposed Void Dragons. While the Corsair Prince's deep strike ability rocks, no scatter deep strike is just gravy. Also with some void storm squads paired with aspect host fire dragons could be an unbelievable amount of melta arriving turn 2 for a beta strike. Just need to figure out how to survive turn 1

Thanks LC I'll post up a batrep of my next game.