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Hey all,

Making a list and was wondering - what would be better Emperors champion or captain wit AA Grav pistol and burning blade

Captain Pros
Grav Pistol - Concussion on charge to hit first.
+1 Attack, +1 Wound +1 BS
+1 Strength of weapon plus Blind
Any Chapter

Captain Cons
40 Points more

Champ Pros
Cheaper
ID on 6 in challenge
Fearless
Master crafted wep

The chosen one will go in a drop pod with Honour guard


Any ideas?

im not too bothers with taking Black Templars as chapter tactic so still a bit unsure as 40 points is a lot @ 1500 haha (~3% lol)



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After doing that its pretty clear its the captain haha

the captain is mathematically better but it'd often be quite close, any time the captain wiffs his grav pistol shot or doesn't kill him in one round and the EC will either kill him or leave him close to death

Why go with grav + BB? Shield Eternal and TH or Relic Blade is usually pretty good anyway. Unless it's not viable due to modelling, I'd take the SE every time.

Grav is to get concussion - burning blade as its Awsome!!

Ended up going with captain last night - worked well will try the Emp Champ next time to see if its any better.

If you wanted fluff, I'd have said EC, but in terms of gameplay, the EC is a niche character. He has one role, and he does it exceptionally well at it, but in any other situation the Captain is the better choice.

However, for a nice choppy Str 6 Ap 2 at I 5, the EC can be very handy indeed.

 Selym wrote:
If you wanted fluff, I'd have said EC, but in terms of gameplay, the EC is a niche character. He has one role, and he does it exceptionally well at it, but in any other situation the Captain is the better choice.

However, for a nice choppy Str 6 Ap 2 at I 5, the EC can be very handy indeed.

Honor Guard Champion and EC can exchange who is forced into a challenge. Normally I'd nominate the EC and let the HG Champion smash things with a WS5 thunder hammer.

True indeed. Be sure to stick them into a Land Raider for a (albeit expensive) battering ram.


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That said, I have found use in hiding him in a large crusader squad, from a LR Crusader. it's surprising how many people are ill prepared to face that many attacks (bolt pistols and Crusader guns included).

 Selym wrote:
True indeed. Be sure to stick them into a Land Raider for a (albeit expensive) battering ram.


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That said, I have found use in hiding him in a large crusader squad, from a LR Crusader. it's surprising how many people are ill prepared to face that many attacks (bolt pistols and Crusader guns included).

I believe you meant to type Spartan Assault Tank.

That too

Emperor's champ, all the way honestly. Particularly if you roll on the Black Templar warlord table. Getting +1ws and attack (even if it's only a 1/3 chance with your reroll) turns him into a bit of a monster. Even without it, a str6 ap2 init5 ws6 weapon that rerolls to hit in challenges and IDs on a 6 to wound is pretty heinous.

 th3maninblak wrote:
Emperor's champ, all the way honestly. Particularly if you roll on the Black Templar warlord table. Getting +1ws and attack (even if it's only a 1/3 chance with your reroll) turns him into a bit of a monster. Even without it, a str6 ap2 init5 ws6 weapon that rerolls to hit in challenges and IDs on a 6 to wound is pretty heinous.

I do manage to make Marine players almost cry when I use mine, dude's ruthless

i used the captain last week (sorry bussy weekend couldnt reply haha) and he worked out well but went up against a Ork boss - did 3 wounds (2 being 6's) and he failed one save - meaning if i had taken the EC he would be dead haha

should have another game this week so will replace the captain for EC and see how it rolls - im using the skyhammer force as a formation so turn one i drop pod in the devs assault marines (2x 10 man) and the honourguard and EC - the opponent was to busy worrying about the turn 1 charge to realise the honourguard were there realy and in his turn didnt even shoot them haha

Be careful with the EC - properly dedicated melee stuff will give him a pounding, but on the right targets he's amazeballs at leading the charge.


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And sweeping.

Lots of sweeping.

 Selym wrote:

 th3maninblak wrote:
Emperor's champ, all the way honestly. Particularly if you roll on the Black Templar warlord table. Getting +1ws and attack (even if it's only a 1/3 chance with your reroll) turns him into a bit of a monster. Even without it, a str6 ap2 init5 ws6 weapon that rerolls to hit in challenges and IDs on a 6 to wound is pretty heinous.

I do manage to make Marine players almost cry when I use mine, dude's ruthless

I am having a hard time see how this is all that good though. I mean maybe its just me, but if my opponent brought a bunch of uber-expensive cc- oriented troops and then stuck them in an equally expensive Land Raiders its just going to be even more sad for my opponent when I shoot them off the board and completely avoid them in cc.

This is coming from a Space Marine player BTW.

AV 14 doesn't scare me, and neither does an artificer captain with a fancy sword.

It's in how you play it, and how your opponent is playing it. I go with two Land Raiders with a melee unit inside it, and other fast-moving things to make sure that something gets through.

In case the Land Raider dies, the Black Templars at least have a reliable run move to help them get closer, and once they start assaulting they speed up more.

The EC isn't particularly scary on his own, or as a dedicated melee character, but that's where target selection is needed. I've gotten quite good at creating the circumstances required to make the EC look like a monster, by having him chew through large numbers of points in a game. Backed up with a Crusader Squad seems to be one of the better ways to do this.

Results of combat with the unit:
-Rarely takes out a unit in one assault phase, causing the opponents shooting phase to do nothing to him
-If he can sweep, he will, as he has I5 and +D3 to the break test thingy
-The Crusaders' weight of attacks (melee + pistols) and expendable bodies helps get a fair amount of damage in
-The unit does not worry if the only viable unit to assault is a vehicle, due to having lots of krak grenades (also, take a hidden powerfist, and a meltabomb for more punch)
-If the EC's opponent has worse than a 4++, puts points into having a 2+ or 3+ armour save, I5 or lower, and has less that Str 8, he's very likely to win

 Selym wrote:
It's in how you play it, and how your opponent is playing it. I go with two Land Raiders with a melee unit inside it, and other fast-moving things to make sure that something gets through.

In case the Land Raider dies, the Black Templars at least have a reliable run move to help them get closer, and once they start assaulting they speed up more.

The EC isn't particularly scary on his own, or as a dedicated melee character, but that's where target selection is needed. I've gotten quite good at creating the circumstances required to make the EC look like a monster, by having him chew through large numbers of points in a game. Backed up with a Crusader Squad seems to be one of the better ways to do this.

Results of combat with the unit:
-Rarely takes out a unit in one assault phase, causing the opponents shooting phase to do nothing to him
-If he can sweep, he will, as he has I5 and +D3 to the break test thingy
-The Crusaders' weight of attacks (melee + pistols) and expendable bodies helps get a fair amount of damage in
-The unit does not worry if the only viable unit to assault is a vehicle, due to having lots of krak grenades (also, take a hidden powerfist, and a meltabomb for more punch)
-If the EC's opponent has worse than a 4++, puts points into having a 2+ or 3+ armour save, I5 or lower, and has less that Str 8, he's very likely to win

What are you using as your fast moving units?
CC scouts in land speeders could work, or assault marines with jump packs.

If you had enough alternative threats I guess Vanguard vets with some power weapons could serve a suitable fast cc unit to synergize with.

Screening Scouts and the odd Assault Marine unit.

Ever heard of "defence in depth"? I do that on the advance.


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I also have Drop-Podding Grav Devastators.

It's funny.