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Hey guys, building my first warhammer army and was wondering how solid the following list is as an army? I havnt bought anything yet so if things need changed it's no problem.

HQ
Interrogator-Chaplain
Auspex
Crozius
Bolt pistol
115 points
(don't know what i should build or even if IC is my best choice? I also have a Captain if that's better?)

Elites
DWTS
5x Thunder hammers and storm shields
250 points

DWTS
5x Storm bolters and power fists
200 points

Dreadnought
Multi melta
Storm bolter
Drop pod
135 points

Troops
Tactical Squad
9x marines and sargeant w/ chainsword and bolt pistol
Flamer
missile launcher
Rhino
195 points

Tactical Squad
9x marines and sargeant w/ chainsword and bolt pistol
Flamer
missile launcher
Rhino
195 points

Fast attack
Ravenwing bike squad
Ravenwing attack bike
2x bikers
Ravenwing sargeant
(Don't really know what to put on these?)
120 points

Ravenwing land speeder
Same as before, don't know how to build
50 points

Heavy support
Devastator squad
2 Lascannon
Heavy bolter
Plasma cannon
Chainsword and plasma pistol
150 points

So that totals 1410, please let me know if this is a horrible army or what to swap?

Oh, keeping in mind the local metagame is VERY shooty.

Thanks a lot in advance.

Firstly, welcome to Dakka and 40k!

The Interrogator is a solid choice for a HQ - Captain statline with force-multiplier effect, but he wants to be with a melee unit - that looks to be the TH/SS terminators, so he'd benefit from Terminator Armour so he can deep strike with them. Alternatively, a bike will allow him to catch up with them after they's teleported, and move about to where he's needed.

Remember that you can mix-and-match shooty terminators and melee terminators in the same unit, so don't be afraid to try two units of half-and-half. It also means we can take a heavy weapon in an 'assault terminators' unit. The shooty termis almost certainly want some sort of heavy (anything but a PC in my opinion).
Note those termis are going to get shot the turn they arrive if you DS them, but without a Raider it's difficult to walk them up the board (it works against certain armies.

The drop-dread looks good, consider an underslung heavy flamer (as long as you hit the melta target with the flame template, you can potentially cover some infantry with it too).

The tacticals look fine, though I'd be tempted to leave the ML at home.

With the bike squad, go with either Melta or Grav - the Scout move makes Melta good, but Grav means not getting quite so close (you want them to survive until at least turn 2 for the teleport homers). You can combine the RW bike squad and the Speeder into a Ravenwing Attack Squadron formation, doubling the range of their teleport homers.

The Speeder is very versatile, so if you feel confident enough try and magnetize the weapon options. Otherwise, one of the following:
HB & Typhoon, Double Multi Melta, HB & AC, HF & MM of HF & AC.

Now I'm going to trot out my standard advice on devastator squads:
Always try and harmonise all the weapons - decide what you want to kill and equip the unit to suit. Having 4x of the same weapon will always cause the most damage to your desired target, though some hybridization is allowable, ML & Las for example isn't a horrible combo.
In a packed dev squad (5 guys, 4 heavy weaps) every casualty after the first is going to be expensive, and an opponent afraid of the firepower will target such a vulnerable squad before your tacs. They're also going to be trying to keep out of 12" range, and the sarge will want to be using his signum, so I'd drop the plasma pistol (maybe move it to one of the tac squads).

Hope that helps!

Thanks very much for the feedback and thanks for the welcome!
I'd love to take some heavy weapons but the term squad i already own is from the battle of black reach so only plain termies from that i'm afraid!

How do i go about getting a chaplain on a bike? i think i'll use term armour on him though.

I think i'll try grav on the bikes thanks!

Just 8 bolters and a flamer you think? for the tacticals that is.

There are a lot of Tau/Necron/White scar players in my local so that's what the lascannons and plasma was for with the heavy bolter to shred the odd melee unit or at least drop some damage.
Can devestators have standard boltguns?

Thanks again for all the advice, i appreciate it!

RockRobot wrote:
I'd love to take some heavy weapons but the term squad i already own is from the battle of black reach so only plain termies from that i'm afraid!

Should be a fairly easy arm-swap if you do decide to do it.

RockRobot wrote:
How do i go about getting a chaplain on a bike? i think i'll use term armour on him though.

Not sure if a Chaplain on a bike is still in print, so you'd have to convert one (the Interrogator Chaplain model comes apart at the waist I believe). But the chaplain in termi armour is a fantastic model.

RockRobot wrote:
Just 8 bolters and a flamer you think? for the tacticals that is.

Generally tacticals will be moving forward to claim objectives and get within double-shot range with their bolters, so a heavy weapon just slows them down. You want them to be able to survive being shot at, which means more bodies than just combat-squadding down to 5.

RockRobot wrote:
There are a lot of Tau/Necron/White scar players in my local so that's what the lascannons and plasma was for with the heavy bolter to shred the odd melee unit or at least drop some damage.

I'd go for Las against the Necrons if they bring anything with Quantum Shielding, getting that penetrating hit is vital. Las will also instant-death Broadsides against Tau. Against WS, not sure what I'd go for to be honest.

RockRobot wrote:
Can devestators have standard boltguns?

Yes, absolutely, you don't have to upgrade all 4 of them, and even if you do you can add 5 more boltgun-wielding marines to the unit.

 Quanar wrote:

RockRobot wrote:
I'd love to take some heavy weapons but the term squad i already own is from the battle of black reach so only plain termies from that i'm afraid!

Should be a fairly easy arm-swap if you do decide to do it.

RockRobot wrote:
How do i go about getting a chaplain on a bike? i think i'll use term armour on him though.

Not sure if a Chaplain on a bike is still in print, so you'd have to convert one (the Interrogator Chaplain model comes apart at the waist I believe). But the chaplain in termi armour is a fantastic model.

RockRobot wrote:
Just 8 bolters and a flamer you think? for the tacticals that is.

Generally tacticals will be moving forward to claim objectives and get within double-shot range with their bolters, so a heavy weapon just slows them down. You want them to be able to survive being shot at, which means more bodies than just combat-squadding down to 5.

RockRobot wrote:
There are a lot of Tau/Necron/White scar players in my local so that's what the lascannons and plasma was for with the heavy bolter to shred the odd melee unit or at least drop some damage.

I'd go for Las against the Necrons if they bring anything with Quantum Shielding, getting that penetrating hit is vital. Las will also instant-death Broadsides against Tau. Against WS, not sure what I'd go for to be honest.

RockRobot wrote:
Can devestators have standard boltguns?

Yes, absolutely, you don't have to upgrade all 4 of them, and even if you do you can add 5 more boltgun-wielding marines to the unit.

Perfect! laaaaast question sorry, do the intero chaplains not come with terminator armour? or it a completely different model? Sorry for the noob questions.

RockRobot wrote:

 Quanar wrote:

RockRobot wrote:
I'd love to take some heavy weapons but the term squad i already own is from the battle of black reach so only plain termies from that i'm afraid!

Should be a fairly easy arm-swap if you do decide to do it.

RockRobot wrote:
How do i go about getting a chaplain on a bike? i think i'll use term armour on him though.

Not sure if a Chaplain on a bike is still in print, so you'd have to convert one (the Interrogator Chaplain model comes apart at the waist I believe). But the chaplain in termi armour is a fantastic model.

RockRobot wrote:
Just 8 bolters and a flamer you think? for the tacticals that is.

Generally tacticals will be moving forward to claim objectives and get within double-shot range with their bolters, so a heavy weapon just slows them down. You want them to be able to survive being shot at, which means more bodies than just combat-squadding down to 5.

RockRobot wrote:
There are a lot of Tau/Necron/White scar players in my local so that's what the lascannons and plasma was for with the heavy bolter to shred the odd melee unit or at least drop some damage.

I'd go for Las against the Necrons if they bring anything with Quantum Shielding, getting that penetrating hit is vital. Las will also instant-death Broadsides against Tau. Against WS, not sure what I'd go for to be honest.

RockRobot wrote:
Can devestators have standard boltguns?

Yes, absolutely, you don't have to upgrade all 4 of them, and even if you do you can add 5 more boltgun-wielding marines to the unit.

Perfect! laaaaast question sorry, do the intero chaplains not come with terminator armour? or it a completely different model? Sorry for the noob questions.

chaplains buy into terminator armor they dont natively just come with it.

No sorry, i think you misunderstood what i meant!
I was meaning does the model come with the armour in the box or is it a different model you need to buy?

Nice code lyoko DP!

Here's the terminator chaplain I bet he's talking about. http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Space-Marine-Terminator-Chaplain;jsessionid=37259A3EA4AE53E2B6AFFA7AD647B616?_requestid=4586355

The list looks well-rounded. IMO the best unit for Dark Angels though is the Black Knights. If you run them with the Darkshroud, they get 2+ rerollable jink save. This also makes running them with an Interrogator-Chaplain on a bike much more functional.

You have plenty of options since you've designed a combined arms detachment. Take a look at the formations and you could also come up with ways to maximize use of the formation benefits (ie Landspeeder Support Formation, Lions Blade or Battle Demi Company). Welcome to the game and good luck!

Yep, the model Murdoc linked in the one I meant. It's perfect to represent an Int Chap in Termi Armour.

Generally, there aren't any models that have the option for terminator armour or a bike in the same box as the power-armoured model - there wouldn't be any/much duplication of parts, so combining them into one kit would be wasteful. Just take the linked model and maybe add something spare from a Dark Angel sprue (but you don't even need that). There's nothing stopping you using a normal chaplain model for an Int chap, or vice versa.

Also agreed that Black Knights are probably the best unit in the 'dex, so when/if you're expanding to 2000 I'd definitely get some.

 Quanar wrote:
Yep, the model Murdoc linked in the one I meant. It's perfect to represent an Int Chap in Termi Armour.

Generally, there aren't any models that have the option for terminator armour or a bike in the same box as the power-armoured model - there wouldn't be any/much duplication of parts, so combining them into one kit would be wasteful. Just take the linked model and maybe add something spare from a Dark Angel sprue (but you don't even need that). There's nothing stopping you using a normal chaplain model for an Int chap, or vice versa.

Also agreed that Black Knights are probably the best unit in the 'dex, so when/if you're expanding to 2000 I'd definitely get some.

id also look into getting a source of anti-air currently our options are shockingly grim ill go over them here in brief:

- ally in a flakk truck or fighter (kind of expensive points wise but potentially offers the most functionality (under most circumstances), this is one a lot of people go for because its universally allowed in any format tournament or otherwise)

- aegis defense line with quad autocannon (basically forces you to take devestators or tactical marines, (or asmodai oddly enough), and is the most affordable option, but your basically hoping a plane comes into range of their guns and you only needed a single turn to kill it, because if theres more than 1 at a time your in trouble.

- land raider excelsior/rhino primaris ( most expensive option, costs 200 bucks through ebay unless you go to warhammer world in nottingham UK in person and buy the bloody thing, forces you to take a CAD to field it, but it means any models you want can shoot at planes, has amazing synergy with deepstrike units cause of reserves shennanigans, and you can give deathwing knights hit n run, it was made for us and is pretty busted if you tailor your army around bringing one)

-contempor mortis dreadnaught ( the contempor is rather awful as a model when you consider for 15 points more you can get the next option, however it is fluffy we dark angels have a cache of relic dreadnaughts the contempor being amongst them, its also the most universally accepted of the forgeworld models dark angels can bring)

- deredeo dreadnaught (the 185-220 point lovin machine, a relic elite slot dreadnaught with the autocannons that bring all the convent sisters round the table, hes got the flexibility of the flakk trucks from the guard or the other marines, a better autocannon that the aegis line or any allied in flakk gun, and he has armament rules that let him still be useful against ground targets, hes also got a sweet missle for polishing off wounded av 10's for pennies on the dollar, please note that this like the contempor is forgeworld and some people wont like you with one)


bad ideas that people mistake as solutions:

nephilim: the ne-fail-im is incapable of today needs for a plane, hes pretty flimsy and his armaments basically rely on him shooting the enemy before they shoot at him, this always isnt possible, if he has dominion over the skies he wont be productive really. hes a gamble and one your likely to lose. though he is affordable

dark talon: hes a bomber ment to hit ground targets, the hurrican bolters are meant for cleaning up chaffe like gretchin and rippers, dont both trying to use them to crack the thick plates of a storm wolf or a razorwing.

Perfect guys, thanks a lot for all the help.
I think i'm just on the finishing touches now and i'll buy the rest of the models soon. I'll be sure to keep you updated!
Using battlescribe pro for my army list and i cant find formations in the datafile i'm using...

Sheesh, that anti air sure is expensive.
Can regular units shoot aerial units or is it dedicated surface to air weapons only? Funny you should say that as i was tempted to get a Talon...

 RockRobot wrote:
Can regular units shoot aerial units or is it dedicated surface to air weapons only? Funny you should say that as i was tempted to get a Talon...

Regular units can shoot at Flyers, but only as Snapshots (hitting on 6's), Librarians with Prescience can help out there, as can Black Knights (twin-linked), but neither is stellar.

A Talon isn't bad, but it's for shooting at ground targets rather than dealing with planes.

 RockRobot wrote:
Perfect guys, thanks a lot for all the help.
I think i'm just on the finishing touches now and i'll buy the rest of the models soon. I'll be sure to keep you updated!
Using battlescribe pro for my army list and i cant find formations in the datafile i'm using...

Sheesh, that anti air sure is expensive.
Can regular units shoot aerial units or is it dedicated surface to air weapons only? Funny you should say that as i was tempted to get a Talon...

you can find cheaper copies of the deredeo and contempor on ebay for relatively cheap. i got a derdeo with missles and autocannon for like 75 bucks canadian. these are lets not cut the mustard fine here not the forgeworld official model they are phonies but if your playing friendly games the contempor or the deredeo arent that bad as copies and the visual downgrade on the model isnt awful, it wll require extra effort on your part to fix up the model and overcome the lower quality materials used to make the model such as brittle loose odds and ends or bend flexible pieces but beyond that the model is fully functional.

also the aegis isnt that expensive, its like what 45? for the aegis line and then you just need to frankenstein four autocannons onto some kind of object that can pass for a gun platform or automated turret, such as making a square box from a razorback chassis turret section, some cardboard, and then making some way to attach the autocannons. nice n simple no real leaps in technology here. all in all youd probably spend about as much on a quad gun chest high wall set than you would on the counterfeit dreads

You want to make sure to run some good detachments or formations (take a look at the back of your codex) the extra rules they give are key - especially with dark angels since some of them work together.

It looks like you have a good start to a lion's blade detachment (the main one described at the start of the army building section). To get the best bang for your buck with this detachment you want to go with 2 demi companies to get the pile of free rhinos and razorbacks.

But - if you just take 1 demi company that will leave you with some points to take some auxiliary formations with your deathwing/ravenwing models.

The main bonus The Lion's Blade Detachment gives you is army-wide regular ballistic skill overwatch. Even against shooty armies this is useful since eventually your opponents will want to assault you with something.

Using Battlescribe (free army builder) I came up with something using your models:

1500 Points:

The Lion's Blade Detachment

(725) Battle Demi Company

145 - Company master with Artificer armor, storm shield, lion's roar (sits in and tanks for dev squad)

80 - Assault squad with 2 flamers

150 - Dev squad with 4 lascannons

135 - Tactical squad with meltagun and razorback

130 - Tactical squad with flamer and razorback

85 - Tactical squad with missile launcher (sits on backfield objective)

(595) Deathwing Redemption Force (choose turn 2,3,4 to arrive by deepstrike)

145 - HQ - Interrogator Chaplain with Auspex and Mace of Redemption (+3 Str Ap3, blind, concussive, attacks at initiative)

230 - 5 terminators, 3 with TH/SS (I like putting TH/SS on my sergeants so they are good in challenges)

220 - 5 terminators, 2 with TH/SS

(180) Ravenwing Attack Squadron (if landspeeder hits something, the bikes get +1 ballistic skill against it)

115 - Ravenwing bike squad with 2x grav and combi grav

75 - Landspeeder with typhoon launcher




Automatically Appended Next Post:
You might want to put termy armor on the chaplain to deepstrike with the terminators but you get the idea - use the formations.

 chaosmarauder wrote:
You want to make sure to run some good detachments or formations (take a look at the back of your codex) the extra rules they give are key - especially with dark angels since some of them work together.

It looks like you have a good start to a lion's blade detachment (the main one described at the start of the army building section). To get the best bang for your buck with this detachment you want to go with 2 demi companies to get the pile of free rhinos and razorbacks.

But - if you just take 1 demi company that will leave you with some points to take some auxiliary formations with your deathwing/ravenwing models.

The main bonus The Lion's Blade Detachment gives you is army-wide regular ballistic skill overwatch. Even against shooty armies this is useful since eventually your opponents will want to assault you with something.

Using Battlescribe (free army builder) I came up with something using your models:

1500 Points:

The Lion's Blade Detachment

(725) Battle Demi Company

145 - Company master with Artificer armor, storm shield, lion's roar (sits in and tanks for dev squad)

80 - Assault squad with 2 flamers

150 - Dev squad with 4 lascannons

135 - Tactical squad with meltagun and razorback

130 - Tactical squad with flamer and razorback

85 - Tactical squad with missile launcher (sits on backfield objective)

(595) Deathwing Redemption Force (choose turn 2,3,4 to arrive by deepstrike)

145 - HQ - Interrogator Chaplain with Auspex and Mace of Redemption (+3 Str Ap3, blind, concussive, attacks at initiative)

230 - 5 terminators, 3 with TH/SS (I like putting TH/SS on my sergeants so they are good in challenges)

220 - 5 terminators, 2 with TH/SS

(180) Ravenwing Attack Squadron (if landspeeder hits something, the bikes get +1 ballistic skill against it)

115 - Ravenwing bike squad with 2x grav and combi grav

75 - Landspeeder with typhoon launcher




Automatically Appended Next Post:
You might want to put termy armor on the chaplain to deepstrike with the terminators but you get the idea - use the formations.

oh look its mr flavour of the month lions blade/gladius ho hum here to ruin the CAD DA players fun. the lions blade isnt a table threat and deepstriking nators arent a threat and with the new tau coming and the inevetable price drop on broadsides your going to see this whole formation become absolutely worthless in the face of massed missleside spam. and their ridiculously undercosted walkers of death justice greater good..death

the lions blade is also hopelessly linear and leaves no room for surprisingly the enemy, i know exactly what your bringing and exactly what you can glue on to it to pretend that your competent at army building.

the day people get beyond lions blade as a build army by numbers way of not actually putting effort into things the better,

and deathwing terminators shouldnt be deepstriking without heavy weapons thats the long and the short of the debate here, they simply wont live long enough to be productive and see CC their far too flimsy; unless your dropping them in when you were already winning anyway.

I disagree - I think if you want to build a fun/fluffy greenwing + deathwing + ravenwing list then the lions blade is a good way to go

Is it competative? no - in that case I would tell you to never take deathwing or greenwing - take a ravenwing strike force with as many black knights as you can stuff into it and then add space wolf TWC priests to taste

But it is pretty neat to get 3 to hit overwatch army wide with lions blade, even on deathwing - I think in friendly games this will do nicely

And seriously - you are saying go CAD is original? Thats been out for years