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I'm an American (no, that's not the topic of conversation). I've started watching the BPL over the last couple seasons, and against my better judgment, I'm starting to actually enjoy it. However, I don't have a favorite club. I was thinking of Bournemouth, just because of the story of how they finally made it to the BPL.
For someone who hasn't grownup in the culture of football, how should I choose a club to support?
Depends if you just want to focus on the Premiership. Bournemouth have only just come up and, while they're doing well now, they're the sort of team who may find it difficult to stay up and are likely to be relegated within the next few seasons. If you're prepared to back your team through thick and thin then go for it, but in a couple of seasons you could be watching a league game against Accrington Stanley.
If you're after a team that's likely to stay in the Premiership then there's a number of good contenders.
Manchester United are one of the worlds biggest teams and the most successful ever in the PL, but they are also passionately disliked by many fans.
Manchester City have a very fine history and very passionate fans. Money has bought them their current success which other fans dislike but the City fans don't care about as they are no longer the lesser of the two Manchester teams.
Chelsea have been the hobby of one man for a while now. That man is very rich. As a team they demand success and hard work. If you're not good enough, you're out.
Arsenal have played some of the most beautiful football in England over the years thanks to the vision of their manager, who is the current longest serving in the league. That vision however is double-edged as there's rarely a plan B. Also they keep a tight control of their money, so they are financially sound but often find themselves one or two players short of a trophy winning side.
Liverpool has an incredibly rich history, most notably in Europe. Their identity is strong, even when they aren't playing too well, with icons like Anfield, the Kop and You'll Never Walk Alone making them stand out.
Everton, the blue side of Liverpool, is a solid club, although other than that I've little to recommend them for.
Tottenham Hotspur are the nearly team. They always seem to be on the brink of something big and then always find a way to cock it up. If you want a team to tear your hair out to then these are your guys.
I'd say these are the teams you can bank on being in the top division for a long time. Others like Leicester and Watford are playing very well right now, but whether they can maintain that to found some form of Premiership dynasty is another matter. One thing you may wish to consider is if whether you are likely to visit the UK at some point. If so then it'll probably be to London, so by supporting one of those teams you may one day get the chance to watch them live. Those would be Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs, West Ham or Palace, with Watford on the outskirts..
Or you could ignore all that and support the mightiest team in the country, the sexiest football, the most intelligent manager. A bastion of a football ground and a fanbase that strikes terror into the hearts of visiting teams.
The mighty, glamorous, beautiful, Stoke City!
The question you need to ask yourself is, Can they do it on a wet and windy night in Stoke, if the answer is yes, congratulations you now support Stoke City, if the answer is no you're probably looking at a team/player in La Liga.
My dad wasn't really a football man so I think I started following the same team as my older brother.
And once you decide you can't change your mind, these are not franchises! No shame in supporting a team that doesn't achieve much (see Stoke Supporters above) but it is a life long association so you can't change your mind because your team turned gak (Man U fans take note). This will just allow you to take part in the true national sport, which is grumbling.
Up the Arse!
How do you promote your Hobby? - Legoburner "I run some crappy wargaming website "
As much as an underdog like Bournemouth strikes my fancy, it might be folly to support a club that may not be long for the BPL. It's a practical choice, really: they don't televise Champion's League stuff over here unless you pay for a Premium channel, and that ain't gonna happen! Arsenal sounds like it could be a contender. I mean, I'm a yank and their club logo is a cannon!
While I'm here, what's the deal with UEFA? Why do some BPL clubs participate and some don't?
While I'm here, what's the deal with UEFA? Why do some BPL clubs participate and some don't?
The UEFA Champions League is an additional, and separate, competition from the various national leagues.
To try to do a quick tl;dr explanation of European soccer, you have the following levels of competition:
1) National Top Tier League (Premier League, Bundesliga, etc) Championship
Each nation has a couple different leagues, with the top level league awarding a championship trophy to the winner of the league. The season is simple, play each opponent twice (home and away), get points for winning or a tie, and after tie breakers the team with the most points wins the season.
2) National Cup Championship
Each nation also has a "Cup" Championship. This championship is open to a large number of teams participating in the national federation and usually includes very large number of teams. The teams from the top tier league compete as well as teams from the 2nd tier league and depending on the individual national federation it can actually go pretty far down the "tiers" and amateur clubs may be competing against professional clubs. I think for most countries this is a single game bracket competition and if you win your match you keep on moving up the bracket until there are only two teams left to play for the Cup.
3) UEFA Champions League
A European competition between the different Champions in Europe, pretty much what the name implies.
The actual rules are a bit more complicated, but the individual League Champions are automatically included, and additional slots are provided to individual leagues based on the strength of the leagues. So the top 3 teams of League A may be included in the competition and only the top 2 teams of League B.
Basically the UEFA Champions League is a "reward" competition that you get to participate in for doing very well in your national league as you get additional exposure, ticket sales, prestige, and money for winning.
Edit:
For the Premier League:
The Top 3 teams qualify automatically for the Champions League, with the #4 team going through a playoff to qualify.
Edit 2:
The Cup winners go to the EUFA Cup, I was confused. Soccer is complicated!
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/12/21 00:47:33
The UEFA thing is sorta weird. In American football, the players are practically forbidden to engage in a lot of personal activities for fear that they may injure themselves. Hell, they're trying to do away with pre-season games because of the injuries that take place before the real season starts. I couldn't imagine the tears of rage if a player got injured playing games for a completely separate league!
To further complicate it, as well as having the Champion's League (which isn't just made out of champions) there is also the UEFA Europa league. This is in effect a lower division of European football played by teams who aren't good enough to be in the Champion's league.
As all the money in European football is in the Champion's league, nobody cares about the Europa league and high quality teams that fail to make the Champion's league get peeved off that they have to play extra games in a Mickey Mouse tournament that nobody cares about.
For middling and lower class teams that make the Europa league though it's a wonderful European tour where fans of football get to share in the cultures of other countries by learning how to order two large beers in as many languages as they can before their team gets knocked out.
The Champion's league can be hit and miss. Technically it can bring together the greatest stars in European football. However the games are usually so tight, as teams would rather not lose than win, that big games can turn out to be very dull affairs.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Ah, don't think of it as a separate league as such. EUFA is the governing body for all European football. The governing bodies for the individual countries work alongside UEFA.
It's more like an extension of the domestic league and is vastly more profitable for the clubs involved.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/12/21 02:18:51
the_Armyman wrote: The UEFA thing is sorta weird. In American football, the players are practically forbidden to engage in a lot of personal activities for fear that they may injure themselves. Hell, they're trying to do away with pre-season games because of the injuries that take place before the real season starts. I couldn't imagine the tears of rage if a player got injured playing games for a completely separate league!
American Soccer does follow the same trend as Europe though.
Major League Soccer: One(ish) Championship with the MLS Cup being given to the winner of the playoffs. We also have the Supporters Shield that became a thing when people wanted a more "European" like championship, which is now awarded to the team at the top of the table at the end of the regular season.
US Open Cup: Cup Championship between the teams in Major League Soccer, North American Soccer Leagues, and United Soccer Leagues (professional and amateur) as well as some additional amateur league teams.
The CONCACAF Champions League: From the US the winner of the US Open Cup, the Supporters Shield winner, the MLS Cup Winner, as well as Conference Champions qualify.
As all the money in European football is in the Champion's league, nobody cares about the Europa league and high quality teams that fail to make the Champion's league get peeved off that they have to play extra games in a Mickey Mouse tournament that nobody cares about.
MLS here often feels that way about the Cup competition, and you end up with teams practically playing all their bench-warmers and reserve squats.
Ah, don't think of it as a separate league as such. EUFA is the governing body for all European football. The governing bodies for the individual countries work alongside UEFA.
It's more like an extension of the domestic league and is vastly more profitable for the clubs involved.
A way to think of it may be like the NFL:
You have teams in the American Football Conference and the National Football Conference who are then part of the National Football League.
Soccer just has a ton of different levels that are all interconnected in different ways between FIFA, the continental federations, the national federations and the individual leagues.
Just try to think of it as a worldwide pyramid scheme
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/12/21 03:03:01
Money talks in football as much as any other sport.
All football fans want to see the best clubs in Europe play against each other and the TV rights generate huge sums for the participants and UEFA.
The Champions League like the Premier League (never referred to as the BPL btw) there is also a certain cache and Glory to winning it (Best in Europe/England) that just doesn't apply to the UEFA or English League Cups*. Yes they are trophies but to bigger Clubs are seen as mere distractions from the true competitions.
* The exception is the FA Cup. As the Oldest and most respected Cup completion in the World it remains a great trophy to win an comes with the additional honour of playing in the season opening Community Shield vs the Premier League Champions..
How do you promote your Hobby? - Legoburner "I run some crappy wargaming website "
the_Armyman wrote: As much as an underdog like Bournemouth strikes my fancy, it might be folly to support a club that may not be long for the BPL. It's a practical choice, really: they don't televise Champion's League stuff over here unless you pay for a Premium channel, and that ain't gonna happen! Arsenal sounds like it could be a contender. I mean, I'm a yank and their club logo is a cannon!
While I'm here, what's the deal with UEFA? Why do some BPL clubs participate and some don't?
Money talks in football as much as any other sport.
All football fans want to see the best clubs in Europe play against each other and the TV rights generate huge sums for the participants and UEFA.
The Champions League like the Premier League (never referred to as the BPL btw) there is also a certain cache and Glory to winning it (Best in Europe/England) that just doesn't apply to the UEFA or English League Cups*. Yes they are trophies but to bigger Clubs are seen as mere distractions from the true competitions.
* The exception is the FA Cup. As the Oldest and most respected Cup completion in the World it remains a great trophy to win an comes with the additional honour of playing in the season opening Community Shield vs the Premier League Champions..
Some football fans want to see the best vlubs play each other, but real football fans like myself
want to see Leeds United hacking lumps out of Millwall!
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Henry wrote: To further complicate it, as well as having the Champion's League (which isn't just made out of champions) there is also the UEFA Europa league. This is in effect a lower division of European football played by teams who aren't good enough to be in the Champion's league.
As all the money in European football is in the Champion's league, nobody cares about the Europa league and high quality teams that fail to make the Champion's league get peeved off that they have to play extra games in a Mickey Mouse tournament that nobody cares about.
For middling and lower class teams that make the Europa league though it's a wonderful European tour where fans of football get to share in the cultures of other countries by learning how to order two large beers in as many languages as they can before their team gets knocked out.
The Champion's league can be hit and miss. Technically it can bring together the greatest stars in European football. However the games are usually so tight, as teams would rather not lose than win, that big games can turn out to be very dull affairs.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Ah, don't think of it as a separate league as such. EUFA is the governing body for all European football. The governing bodies for the individual countries work alongside UEFA.
It's more like an extension of the domestic league and is vastly more profitable for the clubs involved.
Speak for yourself - I love the Europa league.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/12/21 10:45:56
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
I imagine Armyman means as a contender for a team to support. It's a great club with good global support and strong owners who have shown loyalty to their manager. However, let's avoid discussing Ramsay and Shawcross.
Money talks in football as much as any other sport.
All football fans want to see the best clubs in Europe play against each other and the TV rights generate huge sums for the participants and UEFA.
Maybe it's a strong player's union in America, but there's a lot of resistance to players being told to play more games than what the current schedule dictates. The owners certainly have a lot of pull in the league (we're talking the NFL) and want to make as much money as possible, but the players have the ability to strike and refuse to play.
The Champions League like the Premier League (never referred to as the BPL btw)…
Noted, thank you. No one wants to sound like a pleb
...there is also a certain cache and Glory to winning it (Best in Europe/England) that just doesn't apply to the UEFA or English League Cups*. Yes they are trophies but to bigger Clubs are seen as mere distractions from the true competitions.
* The exception is the FA Cup. As the Oldest and most respected Cup completion in the World it remains a great trophy to win an comes with the additional honour of playing in the season opening Community Shield vs the Premier League Champions..
I always thought the English tried to separate themselves from the European continent as much as possible? Or is okay as long as you beat them at something?
Well in regards to football, a lot of the best players in the Premier League tend to be foreign. It got so bad at one point they had to bring in laws to make sure that each team had a few British players in it. Arsenal once played a squad without a single Brit in it. It made national news.
I support Swansea. It's my hometown so I have done since the days of division three. Not doing so well this year, but they are still my team whether they are premiership players or conference dogfighters.
DS:90-S+G+++M++B-IPw40k03+D+A++/fWD-R++T(T)DM+ Warmachine MKIII record 39W/0D/6L
welshhoppo wrote: Well in regards to football, a lot of the best players in the Premier League tend to be foreign. It got so bad at one point they had to bring in laws to make sure that each team had a few British players in it. Arsenal once played a squad without a single Brit in it. It made national news.
I support Swansea. It's my hometown so I have done since the days of division three. Not doing so well this year, but they are still my team whether they are premiership players or conference dogfighters.
Was that around the time that Arsenal was basically the french national team?
The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.
Colonel Flagg wrote:You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me.
welshhoppo wrote: Well in regards to football, a lot of the best players in the Premier League tend to be foreign. It got so bad at one point they had to bring in laws to make sure that each team had a few British players in it. Arsenal once played a squad without a single Brit in it. It made national news.
I support Swansea. It's my hometown so I have done since the days of division three. Not doing so well this year, but they are still my team whether they are premiership players or conference dogfighters.
Was that around the time that Arsenal was basically the french national team?
At least Bayern München kept it local and fielded the German national team.
welshhoppo wrote: Well in regards to football, a lot of the best players in the Premier League tend to be foreign. It got so bad at one point they had to bring in laws to make sure that each team had a few British players in it. Arsenal once played a squad without a single Brit in it. It made national news.
I support Swansea. It's my hometown so I have done since the days of division three. Not doing so well this year, but they are still my team whether they are premiership players or conference dogfighters.
Was that around the time that Arsenal was basically the french national team?
I think so, it's how Wenger is allowing the French to invade us, one football pitch at a time.
DS:90-S+G+++M++B-IPw40k03+D+A++/fWD-R++T(T)DM+ Warmachine MKIII record 39W/0D/6L
Money talks in football as much as any other sport.
All football fans want to see the best clubs in Europe play against each other and the TV rights generate huge sums for the participants and UEFA.
Maybe it's a strong player's union in America, but there's a lot of resistance to players being told to play more games than what the current schedule dictates. The owners certainly have a lot of pull in the league (we're talking the NFL) and want to make as much money as possible, but the players have the ability to strike and refuse to play.
Certainly the players have a union here but a strike is practically unheard of. The Players want to perform on the biggest stage (it is what garners their eye watering salaries after all) and playing in the most notable competitions provides this. Player refusing to play here or seen to be not putting any effort in for the team are generally booed by fans and quickly withdrawn by managers. Fans will spend large sums on season tickets but woe betide any fether that's not pulling his weight.
The Champions League like the Premier League (never referred to as the BPL btw)…
Noted, thank you. No one wants to sound like a pleb
No problem, just remember it's called soccerfootball as well.
...there is also a certain cache and Glory to winning it (Best in Europe/England) that just doesn't apply to the UEFA or English League Cups*. Yes they are trophies but to bigger Clubs are seen as mere distractions from the true competitions.
* The exception is the FA Cup. As the Oldest and most respected Cup completion in the World it remains a great trophy to win an comes with the additional honour of playing in the season opening Community Shield vs the Premier League Champions..
I always thought the English tried to separate themselves from the European continent as much as possible? Or is okay as long as you beat them at something?
Generally yes, but football was our gift to the world (along with modern democracy, the Rolling Stones and Gunboat Diplomacy) but we still like to show Johnny Foreigner who's boss from time to time.....
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/12/22 10:28:33
How do you promote your Hobby? - Legoburner "I run some crappy wargaming website "
I imagine Armyman means as a contender for a team to support. It's a great club with good global support and strong owners who have shown loyalty to their manager. However, let's avoid discussing Ramsay and Shawcross.
Yeah, but you're Scottish. Like I said, middling to lower class teams.
We're bouncing back!
Automatically Appended Next Post:
notprop wrote: I would love to see that sentiment expressed in a less salubrious pub in Manchester or Liverpool. If that happens please allow me to be there....?
Money talks in football as much as any other sport.
All football fans want to see the best clubs in Europe play against each other and the TV rights generate huge sums for the participants and UEFA.
Maybe it's a strong player's union in America, but there's a lot of resistance to players being told to play more games than what the current schedule dictates. The owners certainly have a lot of pull in the league (we're talking the NFL) and want to make as much money as possible, but the players have the ability to strike and refuse to play.
Certainly the players have a union here but a strike is practically unheard of. The Players want to perform on the biggest stage (it is what garners their eye watering salaries after all) and playing in the most notable competitions provides this. Player refusing to play here or seen to be not putting any effort in for the team are generally booed by fans and quickly withdrawn by managers. Fans will spend large sums on season tickets but woe betide any fether that's not pulling his weight.
The Champions League like the Premier League (never referred to as the BPL btw)…
Noted, thank you. No one wants to sound like a pleb
No problem, just remember it's called soccerfootball as well.
...there is also a certain cache and Glory to winning it (Best in Europe/England) that just doesn't apply to the UEFA or English League Cups*. Yes they are trophies but to bigger Clubs are seen as mere distractions from the true competitions.
* The exception is the FA Cup. As the Oldest and most respected Cup completion in the World it remains a great trophy to win an comes with the additional honour of playing in the season opening Community Shield vs the Premier League Champions..
I always thought the English tried to separate themselves from the European continent as much as possible? Or is okay as long as you beat them at something?
Generally yes, but football was our gift to the world (along with modern democracy, the Rolling Stones and Gunboat Diplomacy) but we still like to show Johnny Foreigner who's boss from time to time.....
Typical of England to airbrush out the fact that Scotland was the main mover behind international football. Not only did they organise the world's first international (Scotland Vs. England) but they toured extensively in South America and introduced football to Brazil!
Yes, we've falling on hard times these days, but that's not the point!
welshhoppo wrote: Well in regards to football, a lot of the best players in the Premier League tend to be foreign. It got so bad at one point they had to bring in laws to make sure that each team had a few British players in it. Arsenal once played a squad without a single Brit in it. It made national news.
I support Swansea. It's my hometown so I have done since the days of division three. Not doing so well this year, but they are still my team whether they are premiership players or conference dogfighters.
Was that around the time that Arsenal was basically the french national team?
At least Bayern München kept it local and fielded the German national team.
Apart from that Polish striker and Brazilian defender and that Spanish guy
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/12/22 10:52:37
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: ...Typical of England to airbrush out the fact that Scotland was the main mover behind international football. Not only did they organise the world's first international (Scotland Vs. England) but they toured extensively in South America and introduced football to Brazil!
Yes, we've falling on hard times these days, but that's not the point!
Not at all old bean, I understood that the Scots had to play abroad on account of them not being able to beat any one in the UK?
The Late Jimmy of Hill wrote:Back of the net!!
How do you promote your Hobby? - Legoburner "I run some crappy wargaming website "
It might have been unexciting for you. I was on the edge of my seat, especially when Butland saved us. Twice!
I haven't lived in the midlands for about fifteen years now, so only get to go on special occasions when I'm visiting the folks. Normally I would have been at the Boxing day match, but I'm away with work this year.
Considering that we've been established in the top division for a good while, our ticket prices are reasonable. It's usually less than £30 which is better than half the teams in the league.
Generally, American football and hockey cost about $60-$80 for a mid-tier seat. If you want good seats, it's $100-200+ per ticket. Baseball tends to be much cheaper, mainly because they play so many games in a season. £30-40 seems very reasonable, and much less than what I'd expect for a London team.
As with anything, the upper limit of what you can spend on a game ticket varies wildly by how close you want to be to the action, to how many amenities you want, and the locale of the game. Peope in LA who want courtside seats or a luxury box at the next Lakers game probably spend thousands of dollars for a couple hours of entertainment.
