Ogryns anygood?

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**drunken0elf**

I'm going to buy a used astra militarum army and it comes in the lot with the 5 old school ogryns.
They any good? the models be sexy tho.

**Slayer-Fan123**

If you thought I hated Mutilators, I hate Ogryns even more.

**epronovost**

Ogryns (and bullgryn) are the case of a good unit that fill a niche necessary in the Imperial guard force, but the fact that their weapons aren`t affected by first rank fire second rank fire and their terrible pricing (seriously they should be aroun 28 pts not 40) makes them a very poor choice. Shame since they are indeed very cool both in fluff and model.

**War Kitten**

Ogryns and Bullgryns aren't that bad. It's just that they're overcosted for what they do.

**koooaei**

It'd be interesting to see someone making them work, right?

**Kanluwen**

epronovost wrote:
Ogryns (and bullgryn) are the case of a good unit that fill a niche necessary in the Imperial guard force, but the fact that their weapons aren`t affected by first rank fire second rank fire and their terrible pricing (seriously they should be aroun 28 pts not 40) makes them a very poor choice. Shame since they are indeed very cool both in fluff and model.

Bullgryn are kinda fun if you throw "Suppressive Fire!" or "Forwards, for the Emperor!" on them.

Otherwise you're absolutely right. Waaaaaay overpriced for what they are. It's a relic of 2nd/3rd edition IMO.

**drunken0elf**

So the only real problem they have is their point cost. All in all, the unit itself is quite good and fills a niche, but the only real issue here is point cost?

**Tibs Ironblood**

drunken0elf wrote:
So the only real problem they have is their point cost. All in all, the unit itself is quite good and fills a niche, but the only real issue here is point cost?

I would say so, but point cost is everything.

**Kanluwen**

drunken0elf wrote:
So the only real problem they have is their point cost. All in all, the unit itself is quite good and fills a niche, but the only real issue here is point cost?

Their weapons and durability are also issues.

But points cost is the biggest, effectively relegating them to "wouldn't it be cool..." status.

**Vaktathi**

War Kitten wrote:
Ogryns and Bullgryns aren't that bad. It's just that they're overcosted for what they do.

They're *massively* overcosted, and then they have the Ld issue to contend with, the low LD means they *must* be babysat or they're going to run away, which really does make them pretty bad for a unit that's supposed to fill the role that they do.

**War Kitten**

Vaktathi wrote:
War Kitten wrote:
Ogryns and Bullgryns aren't that bad. It's just that they're overcosted for what they do.
They're *massively* overcosted, and then they have the Ld issue to contend with, the low LD means they *must* be babysat or they're going to run away, which really does make them pretty bad for a unit that's supposed to fill the role that they do.

I can't disagree. I would love to use Ogryns or Bullgryns as an means to counter-charge and tarpit some of my opponent's nasty units, but LD 7 sucks. They pretty much need a priest babysitter just to keep em' in combat.

**Commissar Benny**

Ogryns are one of those units I have always wanted to field but never do. As Vak mentioned, they are massively overpriced points wise for what they offer & their low leadership means you have to add even more points into either a commissar or what have you to babysit them.

Literally half the posters on this site are more qualified than whomever is making the rules for these units at GW. Every single codex update they make the same mistakes over & over, then wonder why certain models don't sell well.

**MechaEmperor7000**

Run them for fun, but don't expect much out of them. There's a reason that "Ogryn Syndrome" is named after them (that is, a model that has pretty good stats for assault and multi-wound, but lacks actual good CC weapons and are overcosted, thus means that they die to ID too fast and don't actually do much better than single-wound assault-oriented squads).

**HoundsofDemos**

Other problem is IG doesn't have a good delivery system for them.

**MechaEmperor7000**

Well if you're willing to go Forge World, I'd imagine a Gorgon would be a good transport.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Bullgryns are basically everything you wanted out of Ogyrns, but much more.

**morganfreeman**

The only real time that I'd imagine ogryns being worth the points would be in a very large game where you wouldn't feel their points lost. Something like a wall of bullgryns behind an Aegis line blocking some tanks (either a parking lot or a few baneblades) with camo netting. 2+ cover saves would be pretty nifty.

**master of ordinance**

Ogryns and Bullgryns both suffer from being too pricey for what they do whilst lacking key pieces of equipment and stats. Compare them too something like, say, Centurions which are essentially the C:SM equivalent. Centurions cost 55 points per model, have 1 wound less but have a far better save, two, usually heavy, weapons that are usually twin linked, can fire both these weapons in the shooting phase, have relentless, have a far longer engagement envelope and are far better in assault.
Oh and they have far better BS, I and LD.

Saying this I did have some brief success with using a unit of six Ogryns. They gave my opponent a nasty surprise and when used in an extremely limited field (IE separated from the rest of the battle by terrain, with infantry and armour support and against only a couple of MEQ squads) they proved to be lethal. My opponents had a few tough moments dealing with them.
Then one of my opponents turned up with Primarch Angron and they where completely invalidated.

Oh and a single Eversor Assassin can kill around 8.33' off in a single assault phase before the Ogryns can even strike back.I know because one of my opponents once charged a ten Ogryn unit with his Eversor and there where enough left over wounds to kill another two and a bit.

**pumaman1**

Are ogryns or bullgryns competitive, no.
are they points effecient, no.
Can they do surprising things, like 4+ cover in the open Leman Russes yes (bullgryns with slab shields give anything behind them +1 better coversave than normal, 5+ for intervening model, 4+ for bullgryn, 3+ for camo net) so you vehicles can get a save for once. and if they are base to base they are 3+ armor, not totally ignored. And if they ignore your bullgryns (because there is a dangerous tank behind them) while you move forward with russ following, they punch really hard.

but they aren't good