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So in a recent game it came up about using different weapons that shoot templates from the same unit (Sister squad using a Heavy Flamer and a Flamer at same time) after i have been playing this way for years with the same guys and it was never an issue before. The rule in question:

"Template Weapons:
Template weapons are indicated by having the word 'Template' for their range instead of a number. Instead of rolling To Hit, simply place the template so that its narrow end is touching the base of the firing model and the rest of the template covers as many models in the target unit as possible, without touching any other friendly models (including models from the firing model's unit). Any models fully or partially under the template are hit. Against vehicles, the template must be placed to cover as much of the vehicle as possible without touching a friendly model. The position of the firer is used to determine which armor facing is hit. A template weapon never hits the model firing it.

Template weapons have the Ignores Cover, Wall of Death and No Escape special rules. Wounds inflicted by template weapons are allocated following the normal rules. Template weapons cannot fire snap shots.

Multiple Templates:
If a unit is firing more than one shot with the Template type, resolve each shot, one at a time, as described above, determining and recording how many hits are scored by each template. Once the number of hits from all templates has been determined, roll To Wound as normal."

My interpretation and the way i have read that just about everyone else plays it is that you lay out the templates for each weapon seperately and tally up the hits. then you roll the wounds against all the hits you tallied up.

Example: a 10 man marine squad gets hit with the templates. I lay out the heavy flamer and can hit 8, then i lay out the flamer and can hit 7. Now i roll to wound against 8 marines using the heavy flamer profile and wound 5 and then roll to wound using the flamer profile and wound 3. marine player now has 8 saves to make.

The counterpoint is essentially a clarification of the normal shooting phase that allows you to overlap templates of the same name.

Counterpoint example: a 10 man marine squad gets hit with templates. i lay out the heavy flamer and can hit 8, wound 5, kill 2. Now the flamer can only hit 5 wounding 2, kill 1. Point being that you cant hit multiple models with different templates.

Points supporting the main Example:
1) the Template Special Rule is written in the "Special Rules" section of the rule book and special rules are defined as something that goes against normal rules. If a clarification then it wouldnt need to be in the special rules but probably somewhere in the shooting phase section.

2)The multi template section mentions that you roll to wound once hits from ALL templates have been determined. Not the hits from the heavy flamer or the flamer but ALL templates.

3)Later on in the BRB it goes on to break down the types of weapons and Flame Weapons is the broad category that encompasses the weapons that use template. Template itself is not a broad category with heavy flamer, flamer, etc. as the subtype. Template is the Type by itself.

4)the special rule uses 'Template Weapon' for every mention of the weapon in the rule itself except in the multi template section where it uses 'template type' meaning it is no longer looking at the weapon by the type of weapon. Doesnt care if it is a heavy flamer vs a flamer as they are both template type.

5)the special rule defines the template weapon right in the rule. if it is has 'Template' in the range, it is a template weapon and falls into this special rule.

6)Since all shooting of each type happens at the same time then no there is no "getting hits off of a corpse" as all the flames swirl together and fry the target all at once, not one at a time.

7)Similar sequence as barrage where you lay out all markers/templates to determine hits then roll To Wound.

8)No other Special Rule is a "clarification" of an already explained rule so why would this one be the exception?


Points for Counter example:
1)shooting sequence is by weapon name

2)rule is a clarification of the normal shooting sequence cause GW thinks players are stupid and need extra help

3)Template is the Type of weapon and then you shoot by name of the template type.

I also posted this in Librarium Online so check out what they have to say as well
http://www.librarium-online.com/forums/40k-rules-help/306929-template-special-rule.html#post2763617

So, if you have a unit with a Flamer, Heavy Flamer, and Combi-Flamer, here is how it breaks down:

Select either Flamer or Heavy Flamer to fire first.

Heavy Flamer is selected first.

Heavy Flamer template is placed.

Hits are allocated according to the coverage of the Template and applied with the Heavy Flamer profile.

Wounds are determined, allocated, and attempted to be Saved.

Select another weapon, which would be the Flamer. The one-shot Flamer in the Combi-Flamer still counts as a Flamer, so it gets processed with the regular Flamer.

Proceed through the process of determining Hits, Wounds, and Saves as before.

Select another Weapon, move on to the next unit, or end the Phase.

Always remember the name of the Weapon is what important, not the TYPE of the Weapon.

Lord Scave wrote:
3)Later on in the BRB it goes on to break down the types of weapons and Flame Weapons is the broad category that encompasses the weapons that use template. Template itself is not a broad category with heavy flamer, flamer, etc. as the subtype. Template is the Type by itself.

6)Since all shooting of each type happens at the same time then no there is no "getting hits off of a corpse" as all the flames swirl together and fry the target all at once, not one at a time.

7)Similar sequence as barrage where you lay out all markers/templates to determine hits then roll To Wound.

Just want to clarify on these points

3) & 4) Template weapons are a type like heavy is a type. You don't fire all your ML and LC at the same time.

7) The multiple barrage is only for a single weapon with multiple shots or if multiple weapons of the same name are firing.

Edit got it.

Response is inbound



Situation A. Burna's all the same weapons. -> All count the hits at the same atime all wound at the same time

Situatuon B mixed wearpons. First the Flmaers calculate their hits and do their wounds and remove those models.
Then the hand flamer fires looks how many it can hit & wound.

So if we go with the counterpoint on this then how is this really any different than normal shooting sequence? Why would they bother to write this special rule or even place a "clarification", if that is what it is, in the Special Rule section?

For the same reason as they write any other clarification: to clarify the rules.

but why put it in the Special Rules section if it isnt a special rule really and more of a clarification. there is no other special rule that is a clarification so why is this one special?

I would guess because the multiple template rule predates the current shooting sequence, and it didn't occur to the writer of the 7th ed rules to remove it.

Lord Scave wrote:
but why put it in the Special Rules section if it isnt a special rule really and more of a clarification. there is no other special rule that is a clarification so why is this one special?

You should place all the templates shot together as described above and avoid them from touching any friendly model. That's why it's special.
Just as the multiple blast rule says(not the barrage one).