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Hello everyone, we are not done showing off what the new Tau can do! This will be a fight you will not want to miss. We have Reece atrying out the new Cadian Battle Force “Decurion” style detachment vs. Keith and his donkey punching Tau list. But who will be the Donkey, and who will be the puncher?! This and other highly intellectual questions will be answered, Tuesday night, January 26th!

http://www.twitch.tv/frontlinegaming_tv

Make sure to tune in and find out 7:00 pm PST on twitch we will also be giving away some GW product so make sure to tune in, Subscribers get triple the chances to win!



Keith’s List:

Primary Detachment: Tau Empire (Combined Arms Detachment)
HQ:
Commander – Drone Controller, Iridium Armor, Marker Drones x2
Troops:
Kroot x10, 1 Hound
Strikers x5
Fast Attack:
Y’Vahra – Early Warning Override, Stimulant Injector
Lord of War:
Stormsurge – Pulse Driver Cannon, Airbursting Fragmentation Projector, Shield Generator, Early Warning Override, Advanced Targeting System
Formations:
Drone Net:
Marker Drone x4
Marker Drone x4
Marker Drone x4
Marker Drone x4
Riptide Wing:
Riptide x1 – Heavy Burst Cannon, Smart Missile System, Early Warning Override, Stimulant Injector
Riptide x1 – Heavy Burst Cannon, Smart Missile System, Early Warning Override, Stimulant Injector
Riptide x1 – Ion Accelerator, Smart Missile System, Early Warning Override, Stimulant Injector



Reece’s list:

Cadian Battle Force 1850pts
Battle Group Command Description Size Cost
CCS P.Gun x 4 5 120
Chimera - 1 65
Armoured Company
Vanquisher (Tank Command Squad) Commander, L.Cannon 1 175
Vanquisher (Tank Command Squad) L.cannon 1 145
Punisher M.Meltas, Dozer 1 165
Eradicator H.Bolters 1 140
Exterminator H.Bolters 1 150
Enginseer - 1 40
Assault Company
CCS P.Gun x 4 5 120
Chimera - 1 65
Veterans M.Gun x 2, H.Flamer 10 90
Taurox - 1 50
Veterans M.Gun x 2, H.Flamer 10 90
Chimera - 1 65
Veterans M.Gun x 2, H.Flamer 10 90
Chimera - 1 65
Hellhound - 1 125
Militarum Tempestus Platoon
Scions M.Gun x 2 5 90
Totals - 57 1850

This is going to be a tough fight. Tau hit like a ton of bricks and Astra Militarum can pack a punch, too! Both armies will want to strike first. The Astra Militarum have the edge with mobile ObSec, but the Tau have the advantage with pore offensive power. Who do you all think will win?

Short description of the result for those who can won't be able to view it?

Enough marker drones, huh? One unit for each MC plus the commander. Where is he going to hide anyway?

Yeah, I will post a recap after the game.

I will probably get demolished, lol, the Cadian Battle Group isn't that hot, but we'll see! I'll give my best for the Emperor!

The Drone Net require 4 units of drones, that's why you see so many in my list. It's hard giving up bs 3 marker drones that can Intercept and split fire.

I'll be tuning in as I work on some artwork. Looking forward to seeing the IG in action.

Hopefully it is a fun game to watch =)

Poor IG, this'll be a slaughter

Was it? Come on, people are waiting.

DirtyDeeds: We discussed this in another thread. Have you considered running one of the units as outflanking gun drones?

I may do that to help out the Kroot, sometimes it feels like I have too many Marker Drones.

My kid wasn't going to sleep..so I missed it. Results?

Breakdown, first turn saw very little damage done to both sides, but once he spread out I was able to assault his tanks with my rock'em sock'em robots. He killed a Riptide and nearly killed my Stormsurge. We didn't tally the points in the end, but I had primary (Killpoints), first blood, slay the warlord. He may have won secondary.

P.s. I think I had line breaker, or could have if I finished my turn.

Yeah, the outcome was fairly predictable. There were some fun/funny highlights but it went pretty much as expected.

MCs=can kill a vehicle in one shot. Tau can increase accuracy and ignore cover.

Tanks=cannot kill an MC in one shot (usually), don't ignore cover, typically don't ignore armor.

Math says that isn't a fight the tanks win in most engagements and that is what we saw. The game is just skewed against tanks at this point in time, as we all know. Unless your tanks are of the free, ObSec variety, haha.

Rolling up Kill Points for the mission made it even more lopsided and once Tau got First Blood (unsurprisingly with BS5+, ignores cover D missiles, lol) it was pretty much game over at that point.

I wanted to show the Cadian Battle Force in action and while it is fun, it is not at all competitive with the mech build. I think if you had the models you could do quite well with the Infantry build, though.

@Dirty Deeds

Good game, buddy!

Bummer. IG is in such a weird place right now. I really feel that IG has lost it's flavor. With all the books they have been releasing they really need to make a digital release or something with different regiments. I haven't touched my IG in so long because they feel to vanilla now. Oh well.

They are still really good and can totally win games, but the Cadian battle Force (at least the way I played it) certainly isn't going to get it done.

 Reecius wrote:
They are still really good and can totally win games, but the Cadian battle Force (at least the way I played it) certainly isn't going to get it done.

Oh I'm sure they can still win games, but they feel so vanilla now. I missed the little quirks each regiment had. GW can bring this back easily in the use of formations, etc. I really hope they do that at some point. I'd like to see a special decurion of a Vostroyan regiment.

@Reece Thanks for having me on the stream again, it was a lot of fun. I'll make sure I bring some beer next time.

@Dirty Deeds

You are a pleasure to game with dude, feel welcome to come on the stream any time.

And yes, if you plan on kicking my ass like that again, please bring me some pity beer, lol!

@CaptnKaruthors

Yeah, I agree 100%! I wish they'd bring Doctrines back, that was so much fun. My Jungle Fighting Drop Troopers were so much fun!

Reecius, 5th edition called and wants its army list back.

I hope yall take another stab at doing a guard primary but with a more up-to-date view on what's good list construction.

Thanks for posting and putting the game together though, always nice to see guard, even if they're getting the red-headed stepchild treatment.

 Reecius wrote:


Tanks=cannot kill an MC in one shot (usually), don't ignore cover, typically don't ignore armor.

....... The game is just skewed against tanks at this point in time, as we all know. !

Your ITC faq skews the game against tanks my friend, not GW. You ban the Typhon and the Battle of Keylek legacy of glory. You prevent tanks from getting ignores cover while allowing Tau MC's and superheavies to keep their ignores cover.

DarthDiggler wrote:

 Reecius wrote:


Tanks=cannot kill an MC in one shot (usually), don't ignore cover, typically don't ignore armor.

....... The game is just skewed against tanks at this point in time, as we all know. !

Your ITC faq skews the game against tanks my friend, not GW. You ban the Typhon and the Battle of Keylek legacy of glory. You prevent tanks from getting ignores cover while allowing Tau MC's and superheavies to keep their ignores cover.

No army really utilizes tanks in any meta outside of maybe the Sicaran. As a weapons platform tanks are far too easy to neutralize outside of super heavies because basically any penetrating hit will shut down their shooting, movement, or remove the vehicle from the game. Non super heavy vehicles that work are either acting as transports, are artillery that hides out of LOS, or flyers which are hard to hit plus coming out of reserves shooting so they get a round of shooting in (usually). MCs on the other hand don't suffer from diminished shooting ability unless they are completely dead (lots of wounds in generally T6+), can toe in cover for easy cover saves, have good armor so weapons that tend to chip away HP don't work that well against them, and can't be 1 shotted outside of stuff like Str D and instant kill (which is far more rare on a range weapon than things that can one shot a tank). MCs also often times have Invuln Saves and/or FNP saves for added durability which Invuln on vehicles is incredibly rare while vehicles don't have any FNP mechanic. Also most MCs have well designed weapon loadouts while tanks (which are generally older in design) have a mix of weapons that don't really synergize well with each other (Land Raider is a prime example of mismatch weapons). MCs also can fight in close combat fairly effectively (smash giving AP2, fear because GW hates Orks) while non walkers get hit in the rear armor in close combat with no ability to fight back. 6th edition was incredibly bad for non flying/skimmer vehicles and in 7th they gave a big nerf to jinking firing platforms (buff to skimmer transports) and a slight boost to general vehicle durability with explosions being on a 7 (still does nothing to stop a vehicle from being glanced to death).

The Typhon is an amazing super heavy and well costed for the points too. I see them on a fairly regular basis.

@Ether

Lol, right?! But hey, that is the way the detachment plays.

I actually play AM a lot, we have a number of Bat Reps on our YouTube channel with them and I typically do quite well vs. tournament lists. Tau are just really brutal for them in any list.

@DarthDiggler

Right, right, of course. If the FAQ allowed Typhons for Space marines, I would have won that game with my Astra Militarum tanks. Very good point, lol =P

@Vankraken

Yeah, agreed. Vehicles should just have toughness, armor saves and wounds like other units. Makes it so much easier. But as they are now, they are just too flimsy, and not being able to shoot if they take damage, or shoot at reduced efficacy, really stinks.

Grav too, is such a disruptive rule. Assault walkers get relegated to the shelf in a hurry. I think making walkers immune to immobilization would be a really solid benefit for the game, personally.

@Reecius: I wonder how it would be if Vehicles had a 3+ armor save (except skimmers and flyers having 4+, grav still glances on a 6), Immobilized became something like Engine Damaged that cuts movement by half, and Vehicle Explosion added an additional D3 hull points lost instead of being instantly destroyed.

Personally I like the AV mechanic (having immunity to certain weapons as they plink off harmlessly) but its the vehicle damage table and the general math of saves that vehicles generally lack that really cripples vehicles. Maybe if shaken lowered BS to 1 instead of snap firing so blast and template weapons could still be used.

Yeah, agreed. I mean, if they had a special rule "Tank" That said weapons under strength 5 couldn't hurt them, or whatever, it would accomplish the same thing.

But yeah, not having a save and being crippled by damage results is a real bummer.

They'd need a rule that still made them immune to poison and fleshbane.

Yeah, for sure. I was just spitballing, but you're right. That could be included in the hypothetical "Tank" rule.

 Reecius wrote:




@DarthDiggler

Right, right, of course. If the FAQ allowed Typhons for Space marines, I would have won that game with my Astra Militarum tanks. Very good point, lol =P

.

Your exact words were tanks don't ignore cover. I pointed out two instances where you have banned cover ignoring abilities for tanks. Your response is to present a straw man argument that I said your IG would have won with a space marine tank.

Really? Really?

People need to focus on the "why" you, rather than the "why didn't" you. Obviously the battle force without Pask is a huge oversight by GW and needs to be fixed. Also, you can't bandaid a broken unit by saying just replace It, when the whole point was to show how the unit(s) fit into the current meta.