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Hi,
I've been tinkering with a scion based force for a few months now using inquisitors and AM or Elysians to plug gaps in the army, and have been wondering about producing a fandex which expands on the existing supplement.

Just looking for suggestions of existing fandex's to see what's already been tried along with input from other people. I would like to attempt to try and produce a relatively polished finished project (this kind of thing is new to me so emphasis on "relatively") so I'm also looking for sources of fluff and fandex templates/creation guides.

If there's interest in the thread I'd like to use it for feedback on ideas as well as for people to to suggest their own.

As an example here's changes I'd like to make to scions in the AM codex, the stand alone fandex would go more in depth with new war gear and units, but this at least gives an idea of how I view the force as being fielded.

Basic profile for command squad and troops


WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
4 4 3 3 1 4 1 7 4+ Trooper
4 4 3 3 1 4 2 8 4+ Tempestor
4 4 3 3 1 4 3 9 4+ Tempestor Prime

Equipment: Carapace, Hotshot carbine, Krak and Frag grenades

Hotshot Carbine: 18" S3 AP3 Assault 2

Special rules: Move through cover, Special operations, chosen men

Special operations:
Unit must choose 1 of the following doctrines:
Airbourne: Deep strike, HALO insertion (can choose to have intercept shots snap fired at unit at the cost of losing move through cover for that turn)
Recon: Infiltrate, Stealth
Stormtrooper: Transports count as assault vehicles, zealot (thinking this maybe too much and swapping it to hammer of wrath or for overwatch casualties to be removed after the charge has been made)

Chosen men: Due to Scions being deployed for a specific mission attached IC's gain the benefit of the units doctrines (mainly so inquisitor's other than terminator equipped malleus gain be deployed with their household troops)

Tempestor Prime gains senior officer allowing access to all infantry orders as well as being able to issue 2 orders a turn.

10 man units can take 3 special weapons to a 5 man squads 2.

Points cost increased to 14pts for a scion, tempestors reduced to 14pt making 5 man units same cost but increasing cost slightly of larger units (possibly still too cheap at 140pts for a bare bones 10man unit), command squad points kept the same as current.

Nice stuff, pretty similar to most other suggestions, personally I like the HALO rule, this one I've never seen before.

Personally, I would see Stormtroopers completely removed from the Imperial Guard army proper, and integrated into a general purpose "Miscellaneous Imperials" army, alongside Inquisitors, Arbites, the Imperial Navy aircraft (so Valks/Vendettas go there), etc. Let IG Veterans be Elites and represent rank-and-file Grenadiers (and get Hellguns alongside their Carapace upgrade).
Barring that, at least clear up distinctions between Stormtroopers, Inquisitorial Stormtroopers, etc.

It would also be nice to see the Elysian Drop Sentinel rewritten as a Storm Sentinel/Sentinel Prime. Give it 11 Armor or so, BS 4, and some rules allowing it to Fire After Move.

Chimera Primes should theoretically be a thing as well, Fast and with Hotshot Lasgun Arrays. A Hotshot Multilaser that shaved off 12" of range for AP 3 would also be fun.

Here's my take on it, still a WIP. Steal whatever you want, that's what I did!

Expanded Rules - MT Rework

1. Faction special rules:
1a. All infantry models are baseline LD8, Move through Cover, and Deepstrike.
1b. Tempestus infantry are trained to perform in confusing battlefield conditions and be interoperable with Astra Militarum forces. To reflect this:
-- Tempestus units may be issued a maximum of 2 successful Orders per turn.
-- Tempestus infantry may carry out Orders issued by allied Astra Militarum Senior Commanders, even if fielded outside an AM detachment.

2. Default infantry kit is:
-- Clarion Vox - Treated as a Vox unit with a 24" range. Clarion Vox Net extended to 24".
-- Monoscopes - Once per game, an equipped squad may reroll all misses while making a snapshot.
-- Auspex (Sgt only, +5pts optional equipment). Apply -1 to enemy cover saves within 12" instead of shooting.
-- HS Lasgun and HS Laspistol.
-- Additional CCW for Sgt/Tempestor only.
-- Krak/Frag grenades.
-- Carapace Armour (4+)

3. Taurox Primes gain:
- Mobile Command Vehicle.
- Searchlight.
- Smoke Launchers.
- Camo Net.

4. Valkyrie Primes gain:
- BS4.
- Vector Dancer.
- Strafing Run.

5. Warlord Traits:
-- Dauntless. Warlord gains Fearless, +1W, and EW. Also gains Objective Secure and IC, if applicable.
-- Gravchute. Tempestus infantry scatter D6", and may re-reroll failed Reserves rolls. Tempestus infantry shooting attacks are twin-linked upon the turn they Deep Strike.
-- Drill Chief. Tempestus infantry within the detachment recieve +1BS and Relentless. All infantry units within 12" of the warlord which remain stationary in the movement phase may add 6" to the range of their Hotshot Weapons.
-- Grenadiers. All Tempestus infantry within the detachment receive Tempestus grenades as a free upgrade. Warlord gains TL when attacking with grenades in shooting phase, and Tank Hunter/Monster Hunter with grenades in assault.
-- Finger of God (fire support) : 1x off-map Deathstrike missile blast, one use only. Countdown applies, beginning on turn 2.
-- Combat medics. All Tempestus models recieve a 5+ FNP, medi-kits now grant a 4+ FNP.

6. Senior Officer Orders:
-- Expert Targeting : Tempestus Infantry models add +1 to the Vehicle Damage chart with Krak, Melta and Plasma Weapons. Against Super-Heavy vehicles, "Explodes!" results remove 1+D3 Hull Points.
-- Xeno Hunters : Tempestus Infantry models add +1S to attacks with Krak, Plasma, and Melta weapons against MCs. Against GMCs, a 'to wound' roll of 6 also confers Instant Death.
-- Gunslingers: Defensive order. If targeted during the opponent's shooting phase by a unit arriving from Reserves, the ordered unit may immediately make an out-of-sequence shooting attack against the attacking unit. Casualties are resolved simultaneously.

7. Officer Orders:
-- TL shooting.
-- PE shooting.
-- Crusader and Furious Charge.
-- Grenade volley. All Scion models in the ordered unit may use their grenades as a shooting attack, provided the Scion unit declares a charge against the target in the following assault phase.
-- HS Weapons excluding Volleyguns gain Sniper/Pinning fire, and become single shot.
-- Rending fire against MC/Vehicles.

8. Tempestus Experimental Equipment. Unique. May only be selected by Tempestor Prime Warlords.
---- 1: Warp Damper TDA (2+/5++), confers Adamantium Will. Provides a 2++ against wounds suffered by Witchfires.
---- 2: Advanced Tempestus AGL (Assault 2, 24", twin-linked). Does not require LOS. Split fire. May fire Blind, Haywire, and Illumination grenades (removes Stealth) in addition to Tempestus grenade types.
---- 3: Tactical Reliquary of the Tempestus Scions (+1 Order, +1 to Seize). Also, is a MC Power Sword.
---- 4: Cloak of the Aquila. +1LD. Warlord may roll an additional trait.
---- 5: Advanced Auspex. May forego shooting to apply -2 Cover against a targeted unit within 18". Allied flyers and barrage weapons gain +1BS against this target. Stacks.
---- 6: Radiation Mines. 3 uses. Allocated to dismounted infantry units or unoccupied terrain features, after initial deployment but before Scout moves. Enemy units charging a unit equipped with Radiation mines count as making a Disordered Charge, and recieve -1 to Strength and Toughness for 1 turn. These stat penalties are likewise applied to non-vehicle enemy units which move into any designated terrain trapped with Radiation mines. Friendly units are unaffected.

9. Tempestus Infantry Weapons:
-- HS Lasgun (S3 AP3, Rapidfire, 18")
-- HS Laspistol (S3 AP3, Pistol, 6")
-- HS Volleygun (S4 AP3, Salvo 2/4, 24")
-- Tempestus AGL (Assault 2, 24")
---- Incendiary (S3 AP6, 3" Blast, Ignores Cover)
---- Improved Krak (S6 AP4, adds +1 to Vehicle Damage chart)
-- Tempestus Accelerated Flamer (S4 AP5, Template)
---- Roll 2D6 for "No Escape" and select the highest.
-- Meltagun, Meltabombs
-- Plasmagun, Plasma pistol
-- Power Weapons, Power Fist.

10. MT Formations.
-- Formation 'troops' are now ObSec (Scions, DTs).
-- Formations may roll on T1 to arrive from reserve.

11. MT Units.

Specialists (No FOC). Must be attached during deployment. Max 1x per squad.
- 1x Commissar/LC. As per existing codex. May not take experimental equipment.
- 1x Regimental Standard. +1 to Assault Results and Attacks within 12".
- 3x Medi-pack. Grants FNP to squad.
- 3x Marksman. Hotshot Designated Marksman Rifle replaces HSLG. Profile follows:
---- Hotshot DMR, S4 AP3, Precision Shot, Assault 1, 24".

HQs:
Command Squad - 85pts, 4x Special Weapons
- Tempestor Prime gains Senior Officer, 2x Orders.
- Squad may purchase an optional Sgt or Veteran Sgt as a 6th member.

Troops
Scion Squad - 12ppm, 2x Special Weapons.
- Squad Sgt may be upgraded to Vet Sgt for 10pts (+1A, +1LD)
- If upgraded, choose between the following individual specializations during list construction:
-- Vehicle Sgt: +1BS to embarked DT
-- Airborne Sgt: May reroll scatter during DS or Grav-Chute Insertion
-- Recce Sgt: Confers Infiltrate, Stealth to squad.
-- Assault Sgt: Confers Counterattack and +1WS to squad

DTs/FA
- Taurox Prime - Changes as above
- Valkyrie Prime - Changes as above

12. Design Theory.
- Maintain MT as a limited codex with very focused choices; no extra units, limited weapons palette
- Maintain theme as elite light infantry; primary enablers remain leadership and personal equipment
- Ameliorate certain GW design issues -- no cover removal, lack of orders, too similar to AM veterans, little enjoyable customization
- Encourage experimentation with different tactical approaches
- Maintain typical vulnerabilities (lack of psychic defense, poor physical resiliency, AA)
- Create a more cinematic playstyle and better representstion as an elite force

Not sure if I've left it too long between posts and if this counts as necroing, just moved house and getting things sorted has taken longer than expected.

 MagicJuggler wrote:
Personally, I would see Stormtroopers completely removed from the Imperial Guard army proper, and integrated into a general purpose "Miscellaneous Imperials" army, alongside Inquisitors, Arbites, the Imperial Navy aircraft (so Valks/Vendettas go there), etc. Let IG Veterans be Elites and represent rank-and-file Grenadiers (and get Hellguns alongside their Carapace upgrade).
Barring that, at least clear up distinctions between Stormtroopers, Inquisitorial Stormtroopers, etc.

It would also be nice to see the Elysian Drop Sentinel rewritten as a Storm Sentinel/Sentinel Prime. Give it 11 Armor or so, BS 4, and some rules allowing it to Fire After Move.

Chimera Primes should theoretically be a thing as well, Fast and with Hotshot Lasgun Arrays. A Hotshot Multilaser that shaved off 12" of range for AP 3 would also be fun.

Aye, I have been wondering about rolling it in with inquisitorial lists, (with scions providing troops and henchmen units with their higher levels of customisation remaining as elites), hadn't thought of including navy and Arbites (had been thinking of attached SoB SM and GK units but figured it was making things overly complicated and same things could be easily achieved with allies). I quite like the idea but taking flying units and scions out of the guard codex would make a pure AM force even more static.

The sentinels and chimeras make sense, but I think Chimera look a little to heavy for a fast response force, Taurox Prime look more appropriate (when given a wheeled conversion) but could do with a few changes to make them worth while, having a choice special rules through special operations so that deep strike isn't going to waste would help but they still seem point heavy for a glass cannon. Would cutting points by 15 be excessive? That would be 15 points more than the standard Taurox giving it fast and a blast autocannon, maybe a little too cheap. Drop sentinels seem like a shoe in just not sure what role they should fill for the scions, I had been thinking of using the FW Tauros Venerator (yep the names will probably get confusing), as a basis for a small transport similar to a Landspeeder storm (thinking Landrover "Pinkie" compared to the Tauroxs' MRAP/Sd Kfz) which could be upgrade to a support weapon platform, I was thinking of making them capable of choosing to skyfire/intercept or to shoot normally with a twin-linked lascannon or hotshot multilaser which was similar to your concept, but maybe intercept and cognis might be a better all rounder with out being a hard counter to flyers.


Yoyoyo, those are some great ideas but a lot to chew on, I'll get back to you when I've has a chance to mull them over some more.


PS. I'm wondering if I'm going with a slightly too bland "special forces in space" vibe and was wondering about adding in some grimdark, while covering a niche in the force, would just like like first impressions on whether it works or is just ridiculous/ stupid. The idea is an approach similar to dreadnaughts, with allowing fallen comrades to continue to serve and preserve their skills and experience, so how about taking a scion whose body is too far gone and an Ogryn who has taken too much lead to the head and graft the two together using servitor technology. The result being a strong and resistant monster that can provide heavy weapon support or the power and momentum to breach a position, the down sides being that the grafting procedure doesn't always work and even when it does the links between cobbled together nervous system are flawed resulting in lower WS BS and initiative, and the scion unable to speak (hence them not leading the force) but the scions knowledge and experience allow him to operate advanced equipment operate on the same tactical level as the rest of the force.

ragnorack1 wrote:
Yoyoyo, those are some great ideas but a lot to chew on, I'll get back to you when I've has a chance to mull them over some more.

It's not a very "developed" codex, so it's well suited towards homebrew.

That's a cool idea with the Ogryn, I think it's very 40k.