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I am looking to build up an Optimized Stealth Cadre formation to add to my current Tau list. So far I have purchased the 2 squads of Stealth suits, but have not yet purchased the 3 Ghostkeel suits that I plan to run. I wanted to ask some key questions about the proper use of the Optimized Stealth Cadre before sinking the $225 plus tax into those big suits.

Formation Special Rule: Ghostkeels and any stealth suit squads from the formation that are within 6" of one of the ghostkeels fire at +1BS, Ignore Cover, and strike vehicles against their rear armor value regardless of facing.

Question: Based on my reading and understanding of the Formation Special Rule, the Ghostkeel suits in this formation are ALWAYS capable of utilizing the Formation benefit, regardless of whether there are Stealth suits within 6". Is that accurate? Then the Stealth Suits will only benefit from the special rule if they are within 6" of the Ghostkeels. Right? So if someone kills off all of my stealth suits, or I choose to move them away from the Ghostkeels for some reason, the Ghostkeels still benefit from the special rules. This is the part that I wanted to get certain before getting the Ghostkeel models.

So if that is the case, and I do field the Fire Team of Ghostkeels, they would be firing at BS5 as long as all 3 suits are alive, and fire at BS4 after losing one of the suits...... and their attacks would always ignore cover AND strike vehicles on the rear armor value at all times. The Stalth suits would be buffed to BS4, etc when they are within the 6" of the Ghostkeels. This seems like a very strong buff for a formation, and I just want to make sure that I plan to use it properly. Thanks for your guidance.

YES.

i read through your post and what you asume seems to be right. so yes thats how it is and works.

something that struck me, the 'always strike rear armor' bit seems a bit ambiguous. does this mean:
*that If I use a melta weapon, but the melta rule is out of range of the rear, what happens? for instance, using the melta blast weapon with the front facing of the vehicle at 8" (within melta range). The rear is still in range, but not melta range.
*I can use weapons that don't have range? EX: shoot the 18"melta gun from 48" away but still count as hitting the rear armor?

 carldooley wrote:
something that struck me, the 'always strike rear armor' bit seems a bit ambiguous. does this mean:
*that If I use a melta weapon, but the melta rule is out of range of the rear, what happens? for instance, using the melta blast weapon with the front facing of the vehicle at 8" (within melta range). The rear is still in range, but not melta range.
*I can use weapons that don't have range? EX: shoot the 18"melta gun from 48" away but still count as hitting the rear armor?

As the "always strike rear" rules never ask if you have LOS to the rear-armor, etc... I believe you forego everything, and simple draw LOS/range/etc... to the facing you're in, and then simply roll against their rear-armor value. I've yet to see it played any other way.

I know the buff also ignores cover altogether, but if it didn't, measuring to the rear-armor would also trigger the odd "buff cover saves when you can only see a facing you're not firing into" rule... so Occums Razor?

 carldooley wrote:
something that struck me, the 'always strike rear armor' bit seems a bit ambiguous. does this mean:
*that If I use a melta weapon, but the melta rule is out of range of the rear, what happens? for instance, using the melta blast weapon with the front facing of the vehicle at 8" (within melta range). The rear is still in range, but not melta range.
*I can use weapons that don't have range? EX: shoot the 18"melta gun from 48" away but still count as hitting the rear armor?

There has been an official answer or example somewhere that clearly states that the rear armor need not be within range (melta or otherwise) so long as the closest part of the vehicle was within range. So if the front armor is 5 inches away, but the rear armour is 12 inches away you would count your melta distance from the 5 inches. Pretty darn Nasty, especially since Tau's fusion weapons are 18" range and get Melta rules at 9". Also, the Cyclic Ion Raker really becomes the preferred weapon in this formation (in my opinion) because 6 shots at BS5 at Strength 7 hitting the rear armor is just going to split open nearly everything in the game statistically. AND it will be doing it from plenty safe distance with its JSJ shenanigans.

The second part of your statement is not correct, you still need range to the target in the first place.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
There was another question I meant to ask as well.

So in my supposed Fire Team of the 3 Ghostkeel suits it states that the model can choose to use its Holophoton Countermeasures once per game when it or its unit is targeted by the enemy, which forces them to fire snap shots against the Ghostkeel instead of shooting normally.

Since the effect protects the entire unit does that mean that my unit of 3 suits could use this ability a total of 3 times per game? Or a unit of 2 could use it 2 times per game, etc?

Remember that if the formation is a part of the hunter contingent, it would get an additional +1 BS should 3 or more unit shoots at the same target. thus possibly bump the ghostkeel to BS6 and stealth to BS5 on the shooting phase.

Also remember that the fire team +1 BS bonus apply to shot fired during interceptor, the other 2 +1 BS only apply in the shooting phase.

You hit it right on the noggin. OSC is actually the only damn good rule we got in formations thats not "fuzzy" - the Ghostkeels are more advanced than the stealth suits, not just in size but also in system capabilities. Therefore they are the source of the bonus, Stealth Suits can only tap into it but they cant house the gear doing it /fluffexplainationdisabled

Also, when hitting a vehicle in melee you dont take into consideration how the hell theyre hitting rear armor, so why would you question the Mirrors? Fluffwise it says you hit a weakspot for melee, while Mirrors just dont say anything as to HOW they do it. So we can assume that its not actually firing a reflective shot at a levitating mirror, its just ridiculously accurate aiming that hits the "weak spots" like melee does.
If i had to actually measure it out with a bend to hit rear armor i probably wouldnt even bother more because thats just tedious and annoying than a nerf since i'd have to be about 6" closer to pull it off.

I think that the Wall of Mirrors trick is pulled off not by reflecting shots off of mirrors, but by tricking the enemy into thinking that your unit is standing where the models are, but in reality they can be anywhere on the battlefield at that moment without them knowing.