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Hello all,

I'm a long time 40k player looking to kick start a local league for 30k. I've just gotten my hands upon the books and am searching through the fundamentals, but am looking for guidance in where a fundamental army should begin. Having looked over some of this forum I understand a few key suggestions (fluff over min/max, the need for RoW, etc.) but know next to nothing on the Fists strategy.

Currently I have but one box of Calth, and General fisticuffs himself Alex Polux. Any help with what kind of squads to make, or purchases to hedge towards, or heretics to look out for would be greatly appreciated!

well, if you have the immediate funds you could always go for a breacher army (getting the warder kit to use with some Calth models ). Fits polux and you can basically get an entire army of T: 5 BS: 5 models

beyond that a solid, easy to expand 'generic' template is:

HQ:
Praetor (either the terminator or artificer HQ)
Centurion (can be any console type, doesn't have to be chaplain)

Troops:
2 15-man tactical squads W/ kitted out sergeants

Elites:
5 terminators (can convert to be holding shields since you're fists)
1 contemptor

You could also run the new RoW with Phalanx Warders as Troops, and the option for deepstrike everywhere.

With the Warders have Deep Striking, BS5 and WS5 (when charged) Troops.

Well I definitely love the aesthetic of the shield bearing choices. Are Wardens the only real choice for it?

There are standard Breecher Squads in the Troops Section.

What's the opinion on Templar Brethren? I think the models look awesome, but I'm unconvinced as to the effectiveness of 175pts for 5 blokes with power weapons.

they are pretty amazing, though expensive. Locally one players' favorite list is 20 in land raiders backed by Sigismund if I recall correctly, aren't they all in artificer armour + shileds? so for 175 points you get terminator-lites (just terminators in CC) with power weapons and options?

You can give them combat shields for +5pts, but then they lose an attack. That makes them 25pts more expensive than a terminator squad, but they're +1 WS and have a sergeant with +1 wound.

Oh and with furious charge, but without fists and combi-bolters, and no ability to score.

I feel like they're just weaker versions of terminators, for more points. I guess on the charge, if you don't give them shields (because what's the point) they are going to wipe out pretty much any 3+ unit they come across.
3s to hit, 3s to kill, striking first, with 4 attacks on the charge is pretty scary. They'll wipe out a tactical squad without any issue, but against anything with a 2+ they can either take an axe, but then lose the bonus from furious charge, AND need to take the combat shield, so lose the bonus from 2 CCWs.

I just don't feel like killing tactical squads is that difficult that it requires a unit pretty much dedicated to it.

remember that termiantors come with power weapons base in 30k, not fists

for 5 base terminators (175 pts.) you get:
10(15) power weapon attacks
5 combi bolters
2+5++ save

for 5 base brethren (175 pts.) you get:
15(20) power weapon attacks at +1 S on charge and +1 WS
5 bolt pistols
assault grenades
2+ save

additionally, it's 5 points cheaper to add another templar brethren compared to terminators, so overall you can basically add combat shields to everyone for not much of an investment (also you can take voxes and vexillas to pump up usage and LD, as well as massed melta bombs)

 Griddlelol wrote:
You can give them combat shields for +5pts, but then they lose an attack. That makes them 25pts more expensive than a terminator squad, but they're +1 WS and have a sergeant with +1 wound.

Oh and with furious charge, but without fists and combi-bolters, and no ability to score.

I feel like they're just weaker versions of terminators, for more points. I guess on the charge, if you don't give them shields (because what's the point) they are going to wipe out pretty much any 3+ unit they come across.
3s to hit, 3s to kill, striking first, with 4 attacks on the charge is pretty scary. They'll wipe out a tactical squad without any issue, but against anything with a 2+ they can either take an axe, but then lose the bonus from furious charge, AND need to take the combat shield, so lose the bonus from 2 CCWs.

I just don't feel like killing tactical squads is that difficult that it requires a unit pretty much dedicated to it.

Why would you lose an attack with a Combat Shield, that's the shield that is designed for being able to still get your attack from having a pistol. I think you are confusing its rules with the Boarding Shield.

 Griddlelol wrote:
What's the opinion on Templar Brethren? I think the models look awesome, but I'm unconvinced as to the effectiveness of 175pts for 5 blokes with power weapons.

I run 6 or 7 with a Primus Medicae and a Centurion in a Land Raider. I gave all 7 combat shields, and the Sergeant gets a solarite Power Gauntlet. There are very few times where this unit assaults something and doesn't kill them in a round, even terminators. I charged Perturabo and 4 terminators with this squad, killing all of the terminators the first round, and putting 3 wounds on him before he finally nutted up and destroyed them.

Anyway, IF I get them into assault, they are fun. A few games were keep away from the clown car and they did nothing.

Huge point sink and takes away from my Tank Hunter Heavy Support Squads and BS5 Bolters.

Ah! I have clearly missed a few things then!

I forgot that Terminators only come with PW in 30k, and indeed, I was confusing boarding shield with combat shield.

That makes all the difference! Suddenly they're looking a lot better. Although, I still they excel at killing 3+ models, not something that I feel is particularly difficult.

Also - yeah, they need a Land Raider or they're not getting anything done. I suppose you could keep a small squad back, hidden to counter charge depending on who you are playing against (those deep striking armies are pretty common) if you don't want to invest in the LR.