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more of a rules question here, but does the gladius strike force interact at all with any of the new formations introduced in AoD or are Ultramarine players screwed?

I'm pretty certain none of them interact with the gladius unless it specifies under the formation that they may be taken within a gladius otherwise nope.

Not exactly screwed. Any formations that dont require you to take a specific chapter tactics can be used in an ultramarines army with um chapter tactics. It just isn't included in the gladius

 jokerkd wrote:
Not exactly screwed. Any formations that dont require you to take a specific chapter tactics can be used in an ultramarines army with um chapter tactics. It just isn't included in the gladius

and thus get excluded from the additional chapter tactics.

so yeah kinda screwed. be nice if GW would have publiushed an upgraded gladius in the book

BrianDavion wrote:
so yeah kinda screwed. be nice if GW would have publiushed an upgraded gladius in the book

Why do you think Gladius need upgrade? It has it's benefits and costs. One of the costs is necessity to take not so cheap and perfect Auxillary Choice. You can't have everything.
Also the other superdetachments have to have something to compete with Gladius, right?
What I would like to see are dedicated detachments for Ultramarines and Black Templars...

 danyboy wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
so yeah kinda screwed. be nice if GW would have publiushed an upgraded gladius in the book

Why do you think Gladius need upgrade? It has it's benefits and costs. One of the costs is necessity to take not so cheap and perfect Auxillary Choice. You can't have everything.
Also the other superdetachments have to have something to compete with Gladius, right?
What I would like to see are dedicated detachments for Ultramarines and Black Templars...

yeah black templars suprise me they weren't included. I mean I get the logic behind Ultramarines not being, (although this woulda been a chance to take the general concept behind 'nid war veterns and REALLY flesh it out) but black templars more so then the other chapters in the book needed some formations etc. right now if you want crusader squads you're forced to CAD it. my hope is black templars didn't get any love because GW;s planning on giving them a supplement of their own.

BrianDavion wrote:

 danyboy wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
so yeah kinda screwed. be nice if GW would have publiushed an upgraded gladius in the book

Why do you think Gladius need upgrade? It has it's benefits and costs. One of the costs is necessity to take not so cheap and perfect Auxillary Choice. You can't have everything.
Also the other superdetachments have to have something to compete with Gladius, right?
What I would like to see are dedicated detachments for Ultramarines and Black Templars...

yeah black templars suprise me they weren't included. I mean I get the logic behind Ultramarines not being, (although this woulda been a chance to take the general concept behind 'nid war veterns and REALLY flesh it out) but black templars more so then the other chapters in the book needed some formations etc. right now if you want crusader squads you're forced to CAD it. my hope is black templars didn't get any love because GW;s planning on giving them a supplement of their own.

I'm glad my Salamanders finally got a LITTLE attention finally but still annoyed GW can't do the simple tweak of letting their Tactical squads take Heavy Flamers as a heavy weapon choice.

 bomtek80 wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:

 danyboy wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
so yeah kinda screwed. be nice if GW would have publiushed an upgraded gladius in the book

Why do you think Gladius need upgrade? It has it's benefits and costs. One of the costs is necessity to take not so cheap and perfect Auxillary Choice. You can't have everything.
Also the other superdetachments have to have something to compete with Gladius, right?
What I would like to see are dedicated detachments for Ultramarines and Black Templars...

yeah black templars suprise me they weren't included. I mean I get the logic behind Ultramarines not being, (although this woulda been a chance to take the general concept behind 'nid war veterns and REALLY flesh it out) but black templars more so then the other chapters in the book needed some formations etc. right now if you want crusader squads you're forced to CAD it. my hope is black templars didn't get any love because GW;s planning on giving them a supplement of their own.

I'm glad my Salamanders finally got a LITTLE attention finally but still annoyed GW can't do the simple tweak of letting their Tactical squads take Heavy Flamers as a heavy weapon choice.

How would you reliably model that? The only kits for Power Armor that come with Heavy Flamers are the Sternguard Kit and the Blood Angels Tactical Squad. It isn't like the rest of the heavy weapons where you can poach a pair of them out of the Devastator Squad.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
How would you reliably model that? The only kits for Power Armor that come with Heavy Flamers are the Sternguard Kit and the Blood Angels Tactical Squad. It isn't like the rest of the heavy weapons where you can poach a pair of them out of the Devastator Squad.

Probably the same way the Sternguard and Tactical Squad gain access to the Heavy Weapons only found in the Devastator Squad kit? Most of those are compatible across the Power Armor Marine lines. All you need is the arms, backpack, and weapon, and you're good. Not everyone builds Sternguard with Heavy Flamers, nor do all Blood Angel Tactical builders. Getting their bits isn't that difficult if you have a friendly group.

 Charistoph wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
How would you reliably model that? The only kits for Power Armor that come with Heavy Flamers are the Sternguard Kit and the Blood Angels Tactical Squad. It isn't like the rest of the heavy weapons where you can poach a pair of them out of the Devastator Squad.

Probably the same way the Sternguard and Tactical Squad gain access to the Heavy Weapons only found in the Devastator Squad kit? Most of those are compatible across the Power Armor Marine lines. All you need is the arms, backpack, and weapon, and you're good. Not everyone builds Sternguard with Heavy Flamers, nor do all Blood Angel Tactical builders. Getting their bits isn't that difficult if you have a friendly group.

I get that, I am just saying that it is pretty darn hard to pull off relative to the rest of the heavy weapons.

casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Charistoph wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
How would you reliably model that? The only kits for Power Armor that come with Heavy Flamers are the Sternguard Kit and the Blood Angels Tactical Squad. It isn't like the rest of the heavy weapons where you can poach a pair of them out of the Devastator Squad.

Probably the same way the Sternguard and Tactical Squad gain access to the Heavy Weapons only found in the Devastator Squad kit? Most of those are compatible across the Power Armor Marine lines. All you need is the arms, backpack, and weapon, and you're good. Not everyone builds Sternguard with Heavy Flamers, nor do all Blood Angel Tactical builders. Getting their bits isn't that difficult if you have a friendly group.

I get that, I am just saying that it is pretty darn hard to pull off relative to the rest of the heavy weapons.

It certainly wouldn't be as easy as getting hold of ML's and Plasma Cannons no, but not that difficult. There are always people who sell bits online as well. I just figure that for a chapter of pyromaniac weaponsmiths it doesn't make any sense that they can't grab HF's in their Tac squads or have melta-pistols. The Blood Angels can take 'em all day though?

 bomtek80 wrote:

casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Charistoph wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
How would you reliably model that? The only kits for Power Armor that come with Heavy Flamers are the Sternguard Kit and the Blood Angels Tactical Squad. It isn't like the rest of the heavy weapons where you can poach a pair of them out of the Devastator Squad.

Probably the same way the Sternguard and Tactical Squad gain access to the Heavy Weapons only found in the Devastator Squad kit? Most of those are compatible across the Power Armor Marine lines. All you need is the arms, backpack, and weapon, and you're good. Not everyone builds Sternguard with Heavy Flamers, nor do all Blood Angel Tactical builders. Getting their bits isn't that difficult if you have a friendly group.

I get that, I am just saying that it is pretty darn hard to pull off relative to the rest of the heavy weapons.

It certainly wouldn't be as easy as getting hold of ML's and Plasma Cannons no, but not that difficult. There are always people who sell bits online as well. I just figure that for a chapter of pyromaniac weaponsmiths it doesn't make any sense that they can't grab HF's in their Tac squads or have melta-pistols. The Blood Angels can take 'em all day though?

Bangles taking Heavy Flamers (an assault weapon) and being able to take the Hand Flamer and Inferno Pistol has to do with their favoring assault, which all of those weapons lend themselves to. I am not opposed to Salamanders getting those weapons, more I think it is impractical from a bits standpoint. And I think it would be unfair to Salamanders players to include an option that is incredibly difficult to field.

NOW, that being said, I would totally be in favor of a Salamanders Upgrade Kit(like the Bangles, Dangles, Smurfs, and Yiffs received last year) that included an Inferno Pistol, Hand Flamer, and a Heavy Flamer alongside shoulder pauldrons. Heck, have the kit include a card that includes the rules for the items and have it state that Salamanders Tactical Squads can take them.

Sqauwky wrote:
I'm pretty certain none of them interact with the gladius unless it specifies under the formation that they may be taken within a gladius otherwise nope.

IIRC Space marine codex said you must use data slates from this book for Gladius. New AoD has a section that clearly say's

(pg 52 in AoD)
" The following section details a number of formations that can be used with any force chosen from Codex: Space Marines regardless of the chapter it is drawn from. Each Formation grants the units withinit powerful bonuses, which can really enhance their effectiveness on the battlefield. Formations in your army as described in the warhammer 40k rulebook."


Now if im reading this correctly that counts towards formations that can be used to make a gladius strikeforce.

No. The Gladius has a specific list of units and formations which may be used in the detachment. The new formations in Angels of Death can be used in your army, but not as a part of the Gladius Strike Force.

BrianDavion wrote:
more of a rules question here, but does the gladius strike force interact at all with any of the new formations introduced in AoD or are Ultramarine players screwed?

None of the new Strike forces are chapter specific. They have chapters that mainly use them, but any chapter can play any of the strike forces. I believe it is in the paragraph that is in bold print at the top of each strike force page. Says something along the lines of x chapter and fellow chapters that adopt this type of strategy. Also none of the formations are chapter specific either.

 Glitcha wrote:
None of the new Strike forces are chapter specific.

False. All of the new Strike Forces are Chapter-specific as noted in the Restrictions for the appropriate Strike Force. Its the new formations which make up the Strike Forces which are not Chapter-specific.

 Ghaz wrote:
False. All of the new Strike Forces are Chapter-specific as noted in the Restrictions for the appropriate Strike Force. Its the new formations which make up the Strike Forces which are not Chapter-specific.

Actually all Strike Forces are Chapter-specific except Anvil Strike Force which may be used by any Chapter (like Gladius).

So in any of the strike forces you can take two battle companies. as long as you take one auxiliary for the strike force and one auxiliary for the the gladius I don't see why you can't take a gladius inside the strike force.

drok55555 wrote:
So in any of the strike forces you can take two battle companies. as long as you take one auxiliary for the strike force and one auxiliary for the the gladius I don't see why you can't take a gladius inside the strike force.

Because the Gladius is a separate detachment from the other Strike Forces, and a model can not be a part of two detachments except where noted. For example, you have permission for the Battle Demi-Company formation (a formation is a special type of detachment) to be a part of the Gladius Strike Force or the Sternhammer Strike Force but you have no permission for the Gladius Strike Force to be a part of the Sternhammer Strike Force.

 Ghaz wrote:

drok55555 wrote:
So in any of the strike forces you can take two battle companies. as long as you take one auxiliary for the strike force and one auxiliary for the the gladius I don't see why you can't take a gladius inside the strike force.

Because the Gladius is a separate detachment from the other Strike Forces, and a model can not be a part of two detachments except where noted. For example, you have permission for the Battle Demi-Company formation (a formation is a special type of detachment) to be a part of the Gladius Strike Force or the Sternhammer Strike Force but you have no permission for the Gladius Strike Force to be a part of the Sternhammer Strike Force.

Precisely. It would be like taking a CAD as part of a CAD. Or using the required Troops and HQ of one CAD as the Troops and HQ of another CAD at the same time.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

a Salamanders Upgrade Kit(like the Bangles, Dangles, Smurfs, and Yiffs received last year)

Can you please also use an annoyingly cryptic, negative, and silly replacement word for Salamanders? Why give them the honour of a real name while denigrating the other chapters?

And while you're at it, I'd like some for:
Exorcists
Star Phantoms
Black Templars
Deathwatch
Lost and Damned

 Elric Greywolf wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

a Salamanders Upgrade Kit(like the Bangles, Dangles, Smurfs, and Yiffs received last year)

Can you please also use an annoyingly cryptic, negative, and silly replacement word for Salamanders? Why give them the honour of a real name while denigrating the other chapters?

And while you're at it, I'd like some for:
Exorcists
Star Phantoms
Black Templars
Deathwatch
Lost and Damned

No, because Sallies is a term for effeminate or homosexual men where I am from and I don't play party to that.

I also have this concern. My question is what classifies something as a Battle Demi-Company. Gladius strike force says if your detachment includes two battle Demi-companies you get the free transports. I was wondering if you can use Stormlance Battle Demi-Company. It is technically a core choice for the Marines and its a battle demi-company. Instead of taking this core as a flame-blade strike force you can take it as a Gladius strike force and get all transports for free instead of relentless and +1 s flamer weapons.

 spaceviking22 wrote:
I also have this concern. My question is what classifies something as a Battle Demi-Company. Gladius strike force says if your detachment includes two battle Demi-companies you get the free transports. I was wondering if you can use Stormlance Battle Demi-Company. It is technically a core choice for the Marines and its a battle demi-company. Instead of taking this core as a flame-blade strike force you can take it as a Gladius strike force and get all transports for free instead of relentless and +1 s flamer weapons.

A battle demi-company is the formation listed on page 174 of the codex. The stormlance is a formation listed on page 58. One of the gladius bonuses is the free transports and a stormlance is not an option for a gladius and it says the the bonus applies to 2 demi companies the demi company is a different formation and hence the stormlance cant be used to replace it as there is no option to do so.

Please don't revive threads that are more than one month dormant; often, the original posters in the thread will have moved on, and it tends to confuse people. Feel free to start a new thread.