Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

People love to argue how Tau battlesuits can't be poisoned due to being in battlesuits... But how can someone fully enclosed in armour be poisoned? Sure, if they're helmetless they can... But what if they aren't stupid enough to take their helmets off?

Same for Terminator armour... How can they be poisoned? Wouldn't haywire work against them too I shut down their servo motors or whatever?

Because GW's system makes no sense. Armor saves should come before wound rolls anyway.

Martel732 wrote:
Because GW's system makes no sense. Armor saves should come before wound rolls anyway.

While I agree that order makes more logical sense, at the same time the current makes the process a tiny bit faster.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
Because GW's system makes no sense. Armor saves should come before wound rolls anyway.

While I agree that order makes more logical sense, at the same time the current makes the process a tiny bit faster.

yeah all it does is lets the opposing player roll more dice which is kinda nice.

poison really makes no sense on a lot of things. how on earth are you hurting a riptide with shard of glass........

i know they tried to excuse it by saying its some times acid. but acid wouldnt do gak for a decently long time. and some acids dont even effect some metals.
also necrons.

but the real answer is that its an abstraction. because making fluff work with crunch is pretty impossible when everything is dialed to 11

I recall reading in older Necron-Codizes something along the lines of "We know that poison wouldn't work on machines, but we assume that the opposing army has adapted and uses something different, that has the same effect on Necrons as poison."
Don't know if that bit is still in the current codex.
Maybe we can assume that it works similar for marines. And since every weapon in 40K is super evil we may also assume super acid poison that eats through power armor...

SGTPozy wrote:
People love to argue how Tau battlesuits can't be poisoned due to being in battlesuits... But how can someone fully enclosed in armour be poisoned? Sure, if they're helmetless they can... But what if they aren't stupid enough to take their helmets off?

Same for Terminator armour... How can they be poisoned? Wouldn't haywire work against them too I shut down their servo motors or whatever?

because its assumed that the attack penetrates the armor somehow, probably through a weakpoint. The only oddity is having the wound comes before the save, but thats done to minimize back and forth messiness when rolling.

The game is an abstraction as it is. How much more points should we have to pay for a model immune to "poison"? Yes, ofc PA/TDA/Tau suits should also be vulnerable to EMP - if they have countermeasures then surely much bigger vehicles should be able to have them too. But then the cheap desperate AT option would instead be a counter to PA armies, requiring more points rebalancing.

And ofc, not all poisons are the same. Some forms just start rapidly destroying tissue from the entry point, making even a marine's extra organs almost powerless to prevent damage. He might not die but he will be out of action, probably needing cloned tissue replacement or even a bionic limb.

You can add Stormtroopers to that list and Kriegsmen, too, for that matter.

Poison in the old WHFB worked even more weirdly, It worked more like rending if I remember correctly.

 Bobthehero wrote:
You can add Stormtroopers to that list and Kriegsmen, too, for that matter.

Why? A failed armor save presumably means the round reached the squishy bits inside. Nothing about Stormtroopers or DKoK makes them resistant to poison. Same for marines (although they are supposed to be resistant to poison) and same for Tau battlesuits (although they're huge compared to their pilots, so there isn't much to poison - Riptides etc should be walkers - but I digress).

SGTPozy wrote:
People love to argue how Tau battlesuits can't be poisoned due to being in battlesuits... But how can someone fully enclosed in armour be poisoned? Sure, if they're helmetless they can... But what if they aren't stupid enough to take their helmets off?

Same for Terminator armour... How can they be poisoned? Wouldn't haywire work against them too I shut down their servo motors or whatever?

What is worse is you can poison artillery. Not just the crews; you can poison a the gun itself.

Dumb.

 JimOnMars wrote:

SGTPozy wrote:
People love to argue how Tau battlesuits can't be poisoned due to being in battlesuits... But how can someone fully enclosed in armour be poisoned? Sure, if they're helmetless they can... But what if they aren't stupid enough to take their helmets off?

Same for Terminator armour... How can they be poisoned? Wouldn't haywire work against them too I shut down their servo motors or whatever?

What is worse is you can poison artillery. Not just the crews; you can poison a the gun itself.

Dumb.

Yeah thats really dumb

Unstoppable force meets unmoveable object. Welcome to 40k where there is no logic.

 CalgarsPimpHand wrote:

 Bobthehero wrote:
You can add Stormtroopers to that list and Kriegsmen, too, for that matter.

Why? A failed armor save presumably means the round reached the squishy bits inside. Nothing about Stormtroopers or DKoK makes them resistant to poison. Same for marines (although they are supposed to be resistant to poison) and same for Tau battlesuits (although they're huge compared to their pilots, so there isn't much to poison - Riptides etc should be walkers - but I digress).

The OP mentionned sealed armor, both the Scions and the Kriegsmen can be completely sealed, furthermore, Kriegsmen have CBRN protection on their coats.

On a 4+



Actual answer: it's for gameplay purposes and just to give some weapons more flavor. If the bullet/splinter/dart got through their armor and it was a strong enough poison, it could kill them.

Marines also have organs designed to resist and filter poisons so it makes even less sense.

hobojebus wrote:
Marines also have organs designed to resist and filter poisons so it makes even less sense.

Humans have those too.

They're called kidneys.

And if Space Wolves can get beer that can affect SM, pretty sure more virulent stuff will

hobojebus wrote:
Marines also have organs designed to resist and filter poisons so it makes even less sense.

It's almost as if this is a game.

 Bobthehero wrote:
And if Space Wolves can get beer that can affect SM, pretty sure more virulent stuff will

To be fair it's closer to fuel than beer.

pm713 wrote:

 Bobthehero wrote:
And if Space Wolves can get beer that can affect SM, pretty sure more virulent stuff will

To be fair it's closer to fuel than beer.

White Scars have their own alcohol as well............

There are poisons/viruses/checmicals that will effect any biological and will often also be able to burn through the armour seals etc - if it even needs to considering on a battlefield, tehre are likely to eb breaches of the suits - be they Imperial,Tau or whatever. Add in a Chaos God of disease to just make sure..............

Cause poison = poison/acid/radiation

As for marines and their biological superiority, never forget the fused ribcage that would prevent them from being able to breathe on their own. Too much thought it often put into 40k when it's purpose is to be cool or something like that.

Hey you look hungry would you like to taste my soup ?

That should do it.

well seeing as suits are not vehicles and are clearly monstrous creatures that are linked to their pilots; I think it's pretty clear that if you poison the machine you are poisoning the pilot. Other wise they'd be vehicles right?

SGTPozy wrote:
People love to argue how Tau battlesuits can't be poisoned due to being in battlesuits... But how can someone fully enclosed in armour be poisoned? Sure, if they're helmetless they can... But what if they aren't stupid enough to take their helmets off?

Same for Terminator armour... How can they be poisoned? Wouldn't haywire work against them too I shut down their servo motors or whatever?

In the year 40,000 there are beings not of this reality. They walk through walls like they are doors, and peer into your very soul as if it were a painting. They are made of raw emotions, and some of them spread plague, poison and disease. No technology of this dimension will be able to stop their pox. Weapons advanced beyond the comprehension of mere humans also exist, firing projectiles that penetrate at the molecular level, releasing toxins unknown to humanity. Marine helmets can only filter out so much.

A tau suit, marine, and terminator armor all have weak points, and can all be penetrated. That penetrating blow may not be be a killing blow, but with a poisonous weapon, it just needs to scratch, which is why and how they can be poisoned. What is to say the poxes of Nurgle cannot corrode ceramite?

SGTPozy wrote:
People love to argue how Tau battlesuits can't be poisoned due to being in battlesuits... But how can someone fully enclosed in armour be poisoned? Sure, if they're helmetless they can... But what if they aren't stupid enough to take their helmets off?

Same for Terminator armour... How can they be poisoned? Wouldn't haywire work against them too I shut down their servo motors or whatever?

Why, actually, thinking about it - why are you assuming that they have to inhale the poison? Most poisoned weapons are injury-based.

 Furyou Miko wrote:

hobojebus wrote:
Marines also have organs designed to resist and filter poisons so it makes even less sense.

Humans have those too.

They're called kidneys.

Liver too.

Here are a few leading causes of Space Marines getting poisoned: Nurgle, magic poison, plot poison.

People in power armour aren't invulnerable. The galaxy is a big place, and there's a lot of weird gak in it. Dark Eldar and Tyranids in particular, have all sorts of freaky chemical agents that can bypass an Astartes' immune system/armour.

 Bobthehero wrote:
And if Space Wolves can get beer that can affect SM, pretty sure more virulent stuff will

Given that said beer one-hit kills humans...