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Bullgryn/ogryn, are they ever worth taking?  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
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Made in us
Lone Wolf Sentinel Pilot





I'm considering picking up a few more kits, but having second thoughts. They're cool, but are they any good? First off, ogryn or bullgryn? What size of squads? Right now I run a 3 man bullgryn squad with with two grenade and one maul, with a priest. When I do get it into melee it holds up pretty well (wrecks any shooting themed squad, especially if they have a 4+ or weaker, ties/slightly loses to other melee themed squads).

The problem I'm having is crossing the field. On foot, they take ages to get over there and are often a prime target for shooting armies. T5 and a 3+ are nice, but against fire warriors, or such they crumble. In chimeras, I get across the field faster but they stand there for a turn and just get slaughtered. Is there any sure way to get them into combat? Or are they never worth the points outside of giving a tank a better cover save?

I've only used them in 3 games so far so it's hard to tell. First game they were footslogging and were obliterated, second game they went in a chimera, got in and wiped a FW squad, but didn't make it into any other melee. The third game they did shine, but it was against terminators who are also not always worth the points. The three of them charged a 6 man TH/SS plus Belial in it that had just DS, the two grenades killed one, hammer of wrath a second, and while they got beat up pretty bad after that (aka died in two turns) the bone 'ead took out belial in the challenge and I killed 2 more with a smash from the priest and the hits from the other 2 bullgryn.

So really, other than lucky hits against terminators and managing to get into melee with fire warrior eq, do they ever do anything other than act as a distraction carnifex?
   
Made in gb
Raging-on-the-Inside Blood Angel Sergeant





Luton, England

Bullgryns are passable in certain situations where as I think Ogryns are pretty worthless.

I've used Bullgryns a few times and they can do a reasonable job, I play pretty heavy armour saturation and use the 'gryns as a counter charge unit that handily provides a nice cover bonus to Pask and friends.
I run a similar set up of a Priest, 3 standard Bullgryns and a Bone'ead with maul. I won't beat up a properly powerful melee unit but with the priest providing re-rollable saves they will last a while verses most things and can deal out alot of wounds when they charge.

That and I really like the models ;-)

40,000pts
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1,000pts
:deathwatch: 3,000pts
:Imperial Knights: 2,000pts
:Custodes: 4,000pts 
   
Made in us
Hardened Veteran Guardsman



Tampa, Florida

They were awesome about 15 years ago in 3rd edition, but tragically times have changed and they aren't worth the points IMO. For the same cost as a decent sized squad and priest you can take your pick of a geared up vet squad, a tank, a Valkyrie, a CCS in a vehicle, 2 Wyverns, about 5 million conscripts, or an entire platoon, all of which are better and harder to kill. It's a shame because they look cool, but I haven't had a game where they did anything but die for little gain since about 4th edition. Every new codex I pull them out for a few games before putting them back for several years.

Maybe if they were about 20 points each but until that day, leave the "assault" troops where they belong, in other armies.
   
Made in us
Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator





Pittsburgh, PA, USA

Ogryns are terribad. Bullgryns are slightly less terribad.

First off, they can never be run alone. It is absolutely necessary to run them with a Commissar or (preferably) a priest. So, just automatically add 25 points to their cost. Oh look, now they cost 160 points for four models! But, as an assault unit, you kinda want to run more than a minimum squad. What's that? Add another bullgryn and now they don't fit in a transport? Sweet.

S7 is nice, but they can only ever be AP4. Don't bother to give that attached IC any gear, because you'll always be denying challenges and he'll be skulking in the back. T5 does make them a bit resistant to being insta-gibbed, but weight of shots/attacks will whittle you down. Although they can offer some cover save utility with their shields, an ADL and camo netting is waaaay cheaper amd more effective.

If they were 15 points cheaper and could take some meaningul upgrades that made them faster (stimm injectors) or more killy (power fists), they'd be worth a look. As it is, I just do not see any upsides here.

   
Made in us
Preacher of the Emperor





Denver, CO, USA

This is such a bummer. IG was one of my original armies from way back, chosen purely for flavor and fluff. I sold my whole collection on Craigslist a couple of years ago. I have regretted it since, but when I see posts like this, it tempers my regret. I was all about Ogryns, Ratlings, even Beastmen back in the day. Nothing like a badass Commissar leading a unit of the Imperium's unloved mutants looking to prove their worth to the God-Emperor.

   
Made in us
Whiteshield Conscript Trooper




Ogryn/Bullgryn should be way cheaper. 3 T5 wounds are nice, but they don't deal out enough punishement in return.
Astartes terminators are what, 35 each? They come stock with storm bolters and power fists?
25 pts for the power fist. 10 pts for the armor. Free marine and storm bolter.

For Ogryn/Bullgryn to be worth their points they only need a couple of tweaks.

Feel no pain 5+. Increases to a 4+ for free if you are against some serious eldar provolone.

Move through cover. (I doubt a little chain link fence or little barricade would slow them down.)

Make them bulky.( If an 8 foot Astartes in power amrour isn't bulky, ogryn are not very bulky.)

Every roll to hit of 6 generates another hit. These hits do not generate further hits. (This simulates them crashing into, knocking over, lifting up any unfortunates they get their hands on)
Every to wound roll of 6 is AP1. (Remember when the huge space ogre knocked over the smaller taget or managed to grab them? Now they are grabbing the pooor sod and ripping them apart or just smashing them into paste.)

As they are now? Not worth it.
Though you COULD load 3 in a valkyrie with a priest and an inquisitor with hammerhand and use grav chute insertion for Paratrooping space ogres.
While hilarious, not point efficient at all.

*Referring to my empty beer glass*
"Is this glass full or is it empty?"
Wife: uhh.. Empty...?
"Wrong... It is full..of disappointment BECAUSE it is empty." 
   
 
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