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Hey guys,

(1) There's been a lot of talk about how Orks recently (and how bad they are).

(2) I also have a friend who plays Orks, and as of now, their army isn't all that big. I play Black Templars and usually win unless I really water down my lists (which becomes nigh impossible for me the high the points limit is).

So two above points got me thinking on how they might be able to improve their lists and become competitive against me (and win a few games in the process). This also (naturally) led me on to what my friend might have to purchase next.

So if you were to build a list (500, 1000, 1500, or 2000 points), what would you include (and why)?

Cheers guys

Bikers. Meganobz. Zhadsnark biker troops. Tankbustas. Gretchin to hold points. Deff koptas.

Spam those.

I normally run a MANz missile and 2 Wagons full of MANz along with 2 squads of 30s shoota boyz and 3 quad PK deffdreads with a Lukky stikk megaboss leading them. It's not optimal my any means but it's the best one I've been able to come up on my without having to buy a ton of bikers.

@Overlord Thraka:Forgive my ignorance on this, but by MANz, do you mean Mega Armour Nobz? Or....? Because I'm not familiar with that acronym.

Assuming the answer is 'yes', that sounds like a decent list TBH. Is it ever worth taking Killa Kanz in any number?


@Tibs Ironblood: I want to avoid spamming (whether it's my army or theirs). I mean, I could spam Predators and Dreadnoughts and kick ass, but that's not much fun. I'll bear the units you mentioned in mind, though.



Also, are Gorka's and Morka's worth taking?

No sadly. They are super expensive paper weights at best.

 Tibs Ironblood wrote:
No sadly. They are super expensive paper weights at best.

Is that because they're both 250+ points each (i.e. they're just overpriced points-wise), or are they useless on the tabletop as well?

 IllumiNini wrote:
Is that because they're both 250+ points each (i.e. they're just overpriced points-wise), or are they useless on the tabletop as well?

Both - they're priced like small Super-Heavies, but without any of the benefits of super-heavies (immunity to stuns, 12" movement range, stomps).

Yes, MANz are Mega-Armoured Nobz, and are fantastic as a cheap unit (min 3 I think?) to stick in a Trukk as a "deal with this or else" distraction unit.

 Quanar wrote:

 IllumiNini wrote:
Is that because they're both 250+ points each (i.e. they're just overpriced points-wise), or are they useless on the tabletop as well?

Both - they're priced like small Super-Heavies, but without any of the benefits of super-heavies (immunity to stuns, 12" movement range, stomps).

Fair enough. I just figured in 2,000+ point games, the one tat has the 50-point 'shield' (which one has that I can never remember) would actually be worth it. I always thought that the only thing that was over-priced part of either of them was the aforementioned 'shield' at 50 points.

 Quanar wrote:
Yes, MANz are Mega-Armoured Nobz, and are fantastic as a cheap unit (min 3 I think?) to stick in a Trukk as a "deal with this or else" distraction unit.

In my experience, Trukks are only useful en mass. Also, if my Vindicators have taught me anything: the MANz need something else just as scary (if not, more scary) to take some of the heat off of them. Any suggestions on what can share the heat?

At this point more MANZ is probably our only option lol
150 points for 3 MANZ in a trukk is a an effective effective method of solving most of our problems. You could also spring for the secret transport option if Forge world Gun Wagons as your transports.

Lootas can be good, but need to be taken in decent numbers. The amount of dakka they can put out and the fact that the difference between firing at BS2 and snapfiring into the air make them alright anti-flyer units. I've certainly taken down Talons and the like with mine.

Other than that, mostly what's already been said. I will advocate Ork Boyz though if it's a more friendly game. They aren't completely awful and an Ork list just doesn't feel right without at least 40-60.

 IllumiNini wrote:

 Tibs Ironblood wrote:
No sadly. They are super expensive paper weights at best.

Is that because they're both 250+ points each (i.e. they're just overpriced points-wise), or are they useless on the tabletop as well?

At 250pts you would think they would either be survivable or full of dakka. They are neither.

Neither one of them can stand up to a melta gun or two. Neither can put out any kind of dakka. The Gork has a 3D6 gun but even if you roll 3 6s you get 18 shots at BS2 meaning at most 6 hits. And the gun is only S6 I believe so ....who cares? it also has 2 Rokkitz and 2 TL big shootas as well as a flamer. The rokkitz in 5 turns will fire 10 times and hit 3 times on average. The Morkanaut is slightly better because for orks the Blast templates have a better chance of hitting then their regular ballistic skill. (1/3rd chance of a direct hit and scatter dice mean unless you roll really high your still going to hit) But the KMB is worse then the Flamer because its got a 1/3 chance to hit and a 1/6 chance to get hot...

So they would be perfectly fine if they costed around 150 at most but since they are 230+...utter trash.

All codex walkers are pretty underwhelming for the points. So are flyers.

You could technically make hordes decent but not in a sense of killing stuff but just holding points. 220 pt for 30 boyz with a pk-bp nob is not amazing but works as a bauble wrap against melta and for holding objectives. They'll never get into combat with something mobile and shooty but at the same time, this mobile and shooty stuff wouldn't want to come too close to boyz. Dedicated mellee would have no problem dealing with boyz but it'd take a turn or two.

Tankbustas used to be an answer to many things but now they can't really hunt superheavies with the recent FAQ and we're pretty much left with MANz spam for that job now. Take a look at bully boyz formation. Use killsaws on 1-2 manz there. Oh, and avoid regular nobz. They're overpriced garbage like 60% of the codex. As for tankbustas, they can still be used more or less effectively but not as a spammable option anymore.

We have some decent heavy support in face of lootas and mek guns. KMK have taken a huge hit with a FAQ, so i'm not sure about them, however lobbas are still amazing and even got a buff as they can hit rear armor from time to time now.

All in all, what i'd avoid: All walkers, all flyers, burnas, regular nobz, flash gits (some people like them but it's a love-hate relationship, really), Ghazzy (unless you're fixed on running a Ghazcurion), stormboyz (unless it's a single small squad).