Murderhorde with Fleshhounds?

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**MechaEmperor7000**

I wanna run a bunch of blood puppies with a Jugger herald and was wondering how viable this would be, since they lack any sort of power weapons, ranged attack, and anti-air, but Fleshhounds have been decent to good recently.

Has anyone tried the Murderhorde? How does it fare?

**TwiG**

I've played a couple games with it its pretty good, you have alot of fast units that can corrupt objectives and hit pretty hard. The fleshounds have a lot of attacks already and get more with this formation. Adding support like fateweaver, dthirsters, or a knight is a good idea as well.

**ZergSmasher**

I played against one with my Tau a couple of months ago. My opponent was running a Murderhorde with a JuggerHerald and 8 units of 5 dogs each, along with a bunch of R&H artillery pieces and a Daemons CAD with Fateweaver and 2 Nurglings units. That was a brutal list that stomped not only my list, but both of his other two opponents of the day. I think the Murderhorde easily gives the Daemonkin codex a run for its money for best way to run Khorne stuff.

**MechaEmperor7000**

I'm considering running a Jugger Herald with 8 units of 5 Hounds, Karnak and a Thirster (possibly the D-thirster) for the full Daemonic Incursion

Alternatively I've been looking at the Gorethunder Battery, but I get the feeling the cannons would wipe out anything it shot at rather than "soften it up" for the pups.

**mrhappyface**

The murderhorde stomps everything, give your herald the crimson crown and hatred loci to buff up your army even more.
Just one unit of hounds with the herald and Karanak in has the potential for:
8x Str7 ap2 (herald on jugg with axe of khorne)
7x Str6 (Karanak)
30x Str5 (5 flesh hounds) (<--Multiply this by 8 to get you 240 attacks)

Be sure to take a D-Thirster (or two) as your command in order to take down some higher armour vehicles.

I have taken a murderhorde against a necron player that I managed to table on turn two: he had several units in reserve and not much on the board. The 24" deployment and 12" +d6" move on the first turn is a real help.

I would also say that, because of your manoverability, flyers can easily be ignored by keeping out of their arc of fire and/or moving within their movement range.

**MechaEmperor7000**

So I worked up a list:

Daemonic Incursion:

Murderhorde:
Herald of Khorne - Juggernaut, Crimson Crown, Greater Locus of Fury - 160pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (10) - 160pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts

Hunter of Khorne:
Karanak - 120pts

Total: 1000pts

That would be the smaller version of the army for 1000 points. I had to drop a Greater Reward from the Herald to fit in some extra fleshhounds (it would have precluded me from taking 2 extra hounds) but he can hang back because his locus can affect them from up to 12". It's built on the advice mrhappyface gave me and basically trying to get as many hounds with the benefits as possible. The Scout move, Beast Move and charge range should get me into combat in turn 1, if not turn 2. Everything else is just peachy from there.

For 1500 points, I'll go with the following:

Daemonic Incursion:

Murderhorde:
Herald of Khorne - Juggernaut, Crimson Crown, Greater Reward, Greater Locus of Fury - 180pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts

Hunter of Khorne:
Karanak - 120pts

Daemonlord:
Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage - 275pts

Daemonlord:
Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage - 275pts

I just added two Bloodthirsters and gave the herald a greater reward because he's most likely going to die a horrible death at this point. Two thirsters because honestly I don't know what else to add besides more pups, and these guys would be good Distraction Carnifexes at worst.

**Captyn_Bob**

Locus of fury? Remember Karanak has that too, so if you take a locus of wrath, you can double up using the formation bonus (you may not want to do this, as then you have the herald and karanak in different units, but worth considering)

.. and remember scouting units can't assault turn 1.. :(

**MechaEmperor7000**

Oh right forgot that. Well turn 2 is still good since i got so many dang pups.

The main problem with the Locus is that I don't know where to spare the 5 points for the upgrade, although now that I crunch the numbers Hatred might get me more actual hits than Rage does.

**mrhappyface**

The hatred loci is a must imo. In the 1000pt list I would lose a pup and the locus of fury in order to give your herald a lesser reward and the locus of wrath.
Similarly on your 1500pt list, swap the loci and the greater reward for a lesser and wrath.

The herald works great as hidden ap2 in a sea of ap-, and lets not forget the instant death on 6's: the blade of blood isn't going to do much when your herald is in a unit of pups (it gives you rampage for 10 more points).

Besides that the list looks great, very similar to my own list

**blackmage**

i played a list at tourney with 7x5 hounds karanak 5 crushers+champion less.rewardm herald with exalted locus and exalted reward, D thirtsterwith 2 greater rewards and Kairos as command, i tabled a white scars list almost tabled a blood angel and won with a space wolf war convocation, so yes the list work.

**MechaEmperor7000**

Came up with a few new lists:

Daemonic Incursion:

Murderhorde:
Herald of Khorne - Juggernaut, Crimson Crown, Lesser Reward, Exalted Locus of Wrath - 175pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (9) - 160pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts

Hunter of Khorne:
Karanak - 120pts

999pts

Daemonic Incursion:

Murderhorde:
Herald of Khorne - Juggernaut, Exalted Reward (Grimoire), Greater Reward, Exalted Locus of Wrath - 175pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts
Fleshhounds of Khorne (5) - 80pts

Hunter of Khorne:
Karanak - 120pts

Daemonlord:
Bloodthirster of Unfettered Fury - Crimson Crown - 290pts

Daemonlord:
Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage - 275pts

1500

The change to the Exalted Locus gave me weird points values and I realized my 1500 points list was missing 10 points anyways. Decided to downgrade one of the thirsters to a vanilla one so the herald can carry the grimoire to keep the thirsters alive (I think this is possible? It was late).

EDIT: I was wondering if i could use Khorne-Marked Soulgrinders (I know Khorne is the worst mark but I wanna keep the mono-god theme) instead of the Bloodthirsters. Mainly because I already have Soul Grinders and the BTs are extremely expensive atm (and I only have the old metal ones).

**Captyn_Bob**

herald can't have an exalted and a greater. You could give the grimoire to the one thirster, and the crown to the other. (tho the new armour is nice..)
I wouldn't bother with the grimoire without fateweaver TBH.

**MechaEmperor7000**

Bah I forgot the limit.

I could get the Armor of Scorn instead for the D-Thirster, but it'd only be for the psuedo +1 toughness (which, admittedly, would be very useful on him).

**blackmage**

give 2x greater rew to D thirtsters it increase dramatically their endurance, you can try forgeghost if want use grinders, bettern than use just 2-3 normal grinders and you keep the whole incursion bonus.

**MechaEmperor7000**

I kinda wanna run the Forgehost specifically because I already have Soul Grinders but none of the new D-THirsters, and 280 bucks is a heafty asking price for the next 500 pts.

I'm just unsure of how to equip the Soulgrinders. The Phlgem seems nice but Ordinance kinda sucks on an assault platform, but the baleful torrent lacks AP to deal with the majority of things (4+ armor would probably be dealt with by the rest of my army easily).

**CrownAxe**

Why does Ordnance suck on an assault platform? It has no penalties for assault being a relentless vehicle

**blackmage**

you dont need new D thirtser i have the old one and still play it with no problems.

**skycapt44**

I have found the crimson crown is a large investment that doesn't add much punch for dogs as it only affects models within the range and not units.

**blackmage**

yes usually it is not so useful, if you have 40 spare points anyway you can play it maybe on D thirtser if you dont give it armor of scorn.

**MechaEmperor7000**

I'm iffy on the armor of scorn cuz 30 points is pretty hefty and most of the benefits are ignored.

But then again pseudo +1 Toughness is HEUG.

**blackmage**

+1 tough is big...ok sometimes they ignore armor but when you face lot of low AP shoots that can change between take wounds or not, like for example scatter bikes, wound at 5+ is pretty different than wound on 4+.same for thigs like smart missiles, also meltas wound on 3+ can make difference,