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While writing the background for my tau army I came to the question of how unified are the ethereals. I'm curious about if every ethereal follows and enforces the commands and dictats of the ethereal high council, if there are varying levels of obediance between different etherals and if lone ethereals are willing to go against the decisions of the majority for whatthey believe is right.

Since Aun'shi is apparently willing to move among the farsight enclaves without manipulating them some sort of differing opinions seems possible, but since the whole point of the ethereals are to provide a single, absolute road to greatness having the priest caste spreading different opinions seems incredibly counterproductive.

For context I'll also add a summary of my army's background. My contingent has been fighting the imperium in the damocles gulf but during a critical battle an imperial psyker mistakenly open a warp breach, the tau manage to close it, but before knowledge of the warp and the daemons can spread among the wider imperium the ethereal council decides to quietly silence the army by sending it on a forlorn hope mission. Now the critical part, would it be possible that an ethereal disagrees with the decision and informs the army of their fate and encourages it to go rogue and join the farsight enclaves?

I imagine that the Ethereal High council is just like any other with the possible exception of the Tyranid Hive Mind. Individually, you can have your own feelings and beliefs, but when acting with outsiders, you MUST toe the party line. Give the impression that all are pulling for the greater good even if you personally are fine with taking a small bribe on the side.

I'm not sure of any examples, buy I imagine just like any governing body there are different opinions on how the empire should expand, while they all agree the empire has to expand.
My own tau force I have planned to be led by an etherial who has an undying belief that any race brought in by the tau is capable of doing everything the tau can do, thus creating a more equal system. His main focus right now is the gue vesa, he uses his etherial status to pull strings in the earth caste to make battlesuits for his vesa who have proven themselves in battle. Obviously this doesn't sit well with most etherials, so they consistently find themselves on progressively tougher missions.

There are differences and disputes*, but I don't think there is much open defiance. Though sending an army on a suicide mission is almost a crime in the empire. (Fluff sometimes counter acts this, but the tau don't believe in the concept of disposable warriors.)


*They settled them with sword fights.

But, isn't the idea of chaos pretty heavily suppressed? I mean only farsight is aware of the warp and it is unlikely that the tau have never stumbled upon daemons during their expansions, so there has to be some form of censure. And it is probably quite easy, and hardly questioned, if an army is sent against lets say a necron tomb world, according to the greater good they should come up on top. And if a relay station temporarily crashes and communication to the expedition is lost then who can you blame?

Shutting an army up is probably not very hard in the tau empire. Coming up with a viable story shouldn't be impossible for the etherals, and with their suspected mind control abilities they wouldn't have to worry about suspicions from the other castes.

But then we have ethereals with the expedition, they might be more attached to the soldiers they are overseeing, might not get all the viewpoints put forward in the high council or just not realise that it is a suicide mission, so after the invasion is begun they countermand the order to seize the planet at all cost and instead withdraw.

You're the most logical tau player I have ever encountered. In light of this I'm here to bring references.

There have been multiple instances of tau politics clashing and resulting in bloodshed. I do not have a single example of this directly involving the Etherials but, with some evidence provided down below, it really doesn't have to.
In "Thirtenth Penal legions" (-Schaffers last chancers) second book the plot involves a tau renegade commander who adopted his own belief of the greater good that was counter productive to the Tau Empire as a whole.

In "Fire caste":


In "For the Emperor":


In "Xenology" tau are disscected and it's clear that the Etherials extend a phermone like substance that affect all other tau near them, subcounsiously making them agree to their actions.

None of the above scenarios directly involve the etherials but seeing as to how tau are pretty much "programmed" to agree with the Etherials it makes sence that a word or a quite meeting between the ruling caste and the water caste are the offsets of such events. With the phermone system, no matter how schrewed a diplomat the water caste member may be he still must accept the Etherials words as absolute truth.

As to the original question the Tau society is actually deeply splintered with small planets wanting to form their own city states and propaganda being the most powerfull weapon in the taus arsenal (just as "faith" would be in the Imperium). Hence to me the idea of an etherial forming his own judgment of what the greater good truly means sounds like an excellent story and good grounds on which to base your army.

 Nerak wrote:
You're the most logical tau player I have ever encountered. In light of this I'm here to bring references.

There have been multiple instances of tau politics clashing and resulting in bloodshed. I do not have a single example of this directly involving the Etherials but, with some evidence provided down below, it really doesn't have to.
In "Thirtenth Penal legions" (-Schaffers last chancers) second book the plot involves a tau renegade commander who adopted his own belief of the greater good that was counter productive to the Tau Empire as a whole.

Spoiler:

The story then follows the penal assasination squad who, under tau water caste behest, infilitrate the tau army in question and attempt to assasinate said Shas'O.

In "Fire caste":

Spoiler:

the tau water caste representative and the overall fire caste commander clash to such a degree that the taus hold of the planet is threatened, even going so far as to contact imperial forces to force a surrender due to their dispute.

In "For the Emperor":

Spoiler:

Commissar Ciaphas Cain single handedly stops a war between tau and Imperial forces in favour of continued diplomacy. During this event the tau involved loudly argue what would be the correct way to reach the greater good.

In "Xenology" tau are disscected and it's clear that the Etherials extend a phermone like substance that affect all other tau near them, subcounsiously making them agree to their actions.

None of the above scenarios directly involve the etherials but seeing as to how tau are pretty much "programmed" to agree with the Etherials it makes sence that a word or a quite meeting between the ruling caste and the water caste are the offsets of such events. With the phermone system, no matter how schrewed a diplomat the water caste member may be he still must accept the Etherials words as absolute truth.

As to the original question the Tau society is actually deeply splintered with small planets wanting to form their own city states and propaganda being the most powerfull weapon in the taus arsenal (just as "faith" would be in the Imperium). Hence to me the idea of an etherial forming his own judgment of what the greater good truly means sounds like an excellent story and good grounds on which to base your army.

Thank you for the quotes! And I realy want to have an interesting backstory true to the fluff.

Yes, I can see there being strugles between castes that requires eihter water caste or in worse situations ethereals. Having strugles inside castes also seems possible so why not have them within the ethereal caste? Interpreting a concept such as the greater good is probably as hard as any of our current day theological or philosophical questions. So having ethereals coming to blows over how to go forth and implement the greater good seems more likely than every ethereal instinctively knowing what is right in every situation.

When taking into account the suspected, The amount of thruth in xenology has been discussed, mind control I can see there being lots of conflicts among the ethereals that are never noticed, or at least questioned, by the other castes. So while in the precence of ethereals the other castes they will assume that there is a bigger plan and accept any statement as the truth.

Certainly not unified or there would be no scope for the ultimate decision making mechanism of the anti-violence priest-administrator governing class of a species that deplores hand to hand combat -- the one on one knife fight!

 Dantioch wrote:
But, isn't the idea of chaos pretty heavily suppressed? I mean only farsight is aware of the warp and it is unlikely that the tau have never stumbled upon daemons during their expansions, so there has to be some form of censure. And it is probably quite easy, and hardly questioned, if an army is sent against lets say a necron tomb world, according to the greater good they should come up on top. And if a relay station temporarily crashes and communication to the expedition is lost then who can you blame?

Shutting an army up is probably not very hard in the tau empire. Coming up with a viable story shouldn't be impossible for the etherals, and with their suspected mind control abilities they wouldn't have to worry about suspicions from the other castes.

But then we have ethereals with the expedition, they might be more attached to the soldiers they are overseeing, might not get all the viewpoints put forward in the high council or just not realise that it is a suicide mission, so after the invasion is begun they countermand the order to seize the planet at all cost and instead withdraw.

There are a few stories about tau and chaos. They tend not to see it as anything special. They will just go ahead and shoot Slaanesh in the head and not give it much worry, so I kind of doubt there would be an effort to suppress chaos knowledge.

If they did want to sprees something, then they would just move the army to a hidden planet and limit contact. Like what they did when developing the gostkeel armor. Actually they could just send the army to the enclaves is they really wanted them to go away.

I think Ethereals are relatively unified but there are some exceptions such as Ethereals in the Farsight Enclave...

nomotog wrote:

 Dantioch wrote:
But, isn't the idea of chaos pretty heavily suppressed? I mean only farsight is aware of the warp and it is unlikely that the tau have never stumbled upon daemons during their expansions, so there has to be some form of censure. And it is probably quite easy, and hardly questioned, if an army is sent against lets say a necron tomb world, according to the greater good they should come up on top. And if a relay station temporarily crashes and communication to the expedition is lost then who can you blame?

Shutting an army up is probably not very hard in the tau empire. Coming up with a viable story shouldn't be impossible for the etherals, and with their suspected mind control abilities they wouldn't have to worry about suspicions from the other castes.

But then we have ethereals with the expedition, they might be more attached to the soldiers they are overseeing, might not get all the viewpoints put forward in the high council or just not realise that it is a suicide mission, so after the invasion is begun they countermand the order to seize the planet at all cost and instead withdraw.

There are a few stories about tau and chaos. They tend not to see it as anything special. They will just go ahead and shoot Slaanesh in the head and not give it much worry, so I kind of doubt there would be an effort to suppress chaos knowledge.

If they did want to sprees something, then they would just move the army to a hidden planet and limit contact. Like what they did when developing the gostkeel armor. Actually they could just send the army to the enclaves is they really wanted them to go away.

But isn't that a sign of a cover-up that they see daemons as just another opponent, if they were aware of the threat that chaos possesses I find it hard to believe that they would just try shooting slaanesh in his/her/it private parts. Tau is certainly an army that documents any and all encounters both with friends and hostiles so when fighting an army that pretty obviously breaks the laws of physics it is bound to raise questions. But there seems to be virtually no knowledge of this, and as you stated they seem to be treated as just another xenos, so there has to be at least some form of cover up or they should find knowledge of chaos in their archives.

 Dantioch wrote:

nomotog wrote:

 Dantioch wrote:
But, isn't the idea of chaos pretty heavily suppressed? I mean only farsight is aware of the warp and it is unlikely that the tau have never stumbled upon daemons during their expansions, so there has to be some form of censure. And it is probably quite easy, and hardly questioned, if an army is sent against lets say a necron tomb world, according to the greater good they should come up on top. And if a relay station temporarily crashes and communication to the expedition is lost then who can you blame?

Shutting an army up is probably not very hard in the tau empire. Coming up with a viable story shouldn't be impossible for the etherals, and with their suspected mind control abilities they wouldn't have to worry about suspicions from the other castes.

But then we have ethereals with the expedition, they might be more attached to the soldiers they are overseeing, might not get all the viewpoints put forward in the high council or just not realise that it is a suicide mission, so after the invasion is begun they countermand the order to seize the planet at all cost and instead withdraw.

There are a few stories about tau and chaos. They tend not to see it as anything special. They will just go ahead and shoot Slaanesh in the head and not give it much worry, so I kind of doubt there would be an effort to suppress chaos knowledge.

If they did want to sprees something, then they would just move the army to a hidden planet and limit contact. Like what they did when developing the gostkeel armor. Actually they could just send the army to the enclaves is they really wanted them to go away.

But isn't that a sign of a cover-up that they see daemons as just another opponent, if they were aware of the threat that chaos possesses I find it hard to believe that they would just try shooting slaanesh in his/her/it private parts. Tau is certainly an army that documents any and all encounters both with friends and hostiles so when fighting an army that pretty obviously breaks the laws of physics it is bound to raise questions. But there seems to be virtually no knowledge of this, and as you stated they seem to be treated as just another xenos, so there has to be at least some form of cover up or they should find knowledge of chaos in their archives.

I think it's more the tau just being too reasonable to exist in 40k. It's kind of a common trope in 40k that the tau just don't get it. They throw parties for necrons, trade with dark eldar, or report that they have killed Slaanesh. When the tau see something that another fraction would describe as demon influence they might describe it as a form of neuroses.

nomotog wrote:

 Dantioch wrote:

nomotog wrote:

 Dantioch wrote:
But, isn't the idea of chaos pretty heavily suppressed? I mean only farsight is aware of the warp and it is unlikely that the tau have never stumbled upon daemons during their expansions, so there has to be some form of censure. And it is probably quite easy, and hardly questioned, if an army is sent against lets say a necron tomb world, according to the greater good they should come up on top. And if a relay station temporarily crashes and communication to the expedition is lost then who can you blame?

Shutting an army up is probably not very hard in the tau empire. Coming up with a viable story shouldn't be impossible for the etherals, and with their suspected mind control abilities they wouldn't have to worry about suspicions from the other castes.

But then we have ethereals with the expedition, they might be more attached to the soldiers they are overseeing, might not get all the viewpoints put forward in the high council or just not realise that it is a suicide mission, so after the invasion is begun they countermand the order to seize the planet at all cost and instead withdraw.

There are a few stories about tau and chaos. They tend not to see it as anything special. They will just go ahead and shoot Slaanesh in the head and not give it much worry, so I kind of doubt there would be an effort to suppress chaos knowledge.

If they did want to sprees something, then they would just move the army to a hidden planet and limit contact. Like what they did when developing the gostkeel armor. Actually they could just send the army to the enclaves is they really wanted them to go away.

But isn't that a sign of a cover-up that they see daemons as just another opponent, if they were aware of the threat that chaos possesses I find it hard to believe that they would just try shooting slaanesh in his/her/it private parts. Tau is certainly an army that documents any and all encounters both with friends and hostiles so when fighting an army that pretty obviously breaks the laws of physics it is bound to raise questions. But there seems to be virtually no knowledge of this, and as you stated they seem to be treated as just another xenos, so there has to be at least some form of cover up or they should find knowledge of chaos in their archives.

I think it's more the tau just being too reasonable to exist in 40k. It's kind of a common trope in 40k that the tau just don't get it. They throw parties for necrons, trade with dark eldar, or report that they have killed Slaanesh. When the tau see something that another fraction would describe as demon influence they might describe it as a form of neuroses.

Sort of going of point, but I like how varied the tau background actually is. There is the comical viewpoint such as the incidents listed by you where the tau are overly friendly and blue eyed. But there is also the dark and conspiratory background with deep rooted conspiracies, heavy use of propaganda and gunpoint conversion/diplomacy. It gives fans and foes of the greater good a large choice for how to interprate the faction and make them what they want to be, something that isn't as easy with the tyranids or eldar who are quite fixed.

I personally like the tau as a more sinister faction, not in the obviously kafkaesque or brutal way that the imperium treats its citizens/slaves, but rather in a sortof illuminati way of manipulating things for what is perhaps the better but could be for something much more malign.

 Dantioch wrote:

Sort of going of point, but I like how varied the tau background actually is. There is the comical viewpoint such as the incidents listed by you where the tau are overly friendly and blue eyed. But there is also the dark and conspiratory background with deep rooted conspiracies, heavy use of propaganda and gunpoint conversion/diplomacy. It gives fans and foes of the greater good a large choice for how to interprate the faction and make them what they want to be, something that isn't as easy with the tyranids or eldar who are quite fixed.

I personally like the tau as a more sinister faction, not in the obviously kafkaesque or brutal way that the imperium treats its citizens/slaves, but rather in a sortof illuminati way of manipulating things for what is perhaps the better but could be for something much more malign.

Well the reason why the Tau have two interpretations was a very real world decision made by GW to offer up a secondary Orwellian viewpoint due to the fact that as Nomotog pointed out - the Tau are just.....well.... waaayyy to reasonable in their original conception.

When the Tau were first introduced 2001, Andy Chambers and Graham McNeill designed them to be idealistic, altruistic, and determined. IE: They were meant to be the Good Guys of the 40K Universe.

And then.........the Community kinda went cuckoo bananas on them. "THESE THINGS RUIN OUR GRIMDARKITY DARKNESS!" was pretty much the complaint of the time.

I remember those days - peeps were GRIMDARK GRIMDARK as a point of near fanaticism. Folks even hated on the Orks since they were the only faction to retain some of the original humor found in previous iterations of Warhammer 40K.

Hence - we have "sorta sinister" Tau.

But if you really think about it, there's a lot of ambiguity to many things in 40K. There's always at minimum 2 ways of looking at things - to which GW will never of course make a decision one way or another.