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The godlike ascendant Warmaster is monstrous but his pointcost (1550) prevent him from being used in all but the largest of games.
This was created by adding 2 to each of the Warmaster's stats, making him a significantly more powerful psyker than Lorgar, and enhancing the special rules already present before his ascension.
The resultant monster lacks any real ability to do damage at range, and despite himself has a massive weakness to being tarpitted by oceans of conscripts whose blows lack any ability to even register to his sense of touch.
The description given of Horus' newfound godhood given in Vengeful Spirit actually made him seem to be significantly more powerful than the Emperor. The Dark Gods made Horus their vessel willingly after he had proved himself time after time within their realm for eons. The Emperor? He just took some power. Also worth consideration is that the Emperor without his psychic might is a man first and foremost. Horus without his godhood was a 10+ foot immortal with an immune system that managed to fight a supernatural toxin that poisoned daemons.
Without further ado, the monster that slew the Emperor
Horus Lupercal the Chosen Champion of Chaos
Spoiler:
Horus Lupercal the Chosen Champion of Chaos
WS:10 BS:8 S:9 T:9 W:8 I:8 A:7+1 LD:10 SV:2+/3++/5+++ 1550 points
***Special Rules: Primarch, Sire of the Sons of Horus, Weapon Mastery, Very Bulky. God of Battle, Point of the Spear, Psyker (Mastery Level 4), Champion of Chaos
***Wargear: Worldbreaker, Talon of Horus, The Serpant’s Scale, Cognis Signum, Teleportation Matrix
----Sire of the Sons of Horus: For every point of difference between Horus’ WS of 10 and the average WS of the unit he is currently in combat with he may make 1 additional attack during the first round of combat against that unit. For example against a unit with an average WS of 4 Horus would make 6 additional attacks or 14 attacks total the first assault phase against that unit (discounting all bonuses from charging that may be present)
----Worldbreaker: With Horus’ newfound godlike strength, the blows of Worldbreaker are like unto the blows of a Warlord Titan’s powerfist. S, AP:1, Melee, Master Crafted, Concussion, Unwieldly
----Talon of Horus: S:As User, AP:2, Melee, Master Crafted, Disabling Strike (For every unsaved wound inflicted by this weapon the wounded model loses 1 point of strength and 1 point of Weapons Skill. The effects stack with multiple wounds)/ S:5, AP:4, Assault 4, 30”
----Psyker (Mastery Level 4): Horus generates 4 Warp charges per turn. Horus may choose 4 powers from any combination of powers listed in the Telekinesis, Pyromancy, and Biomancy disciplines. Horus may cast 4 powers from any combination of disciplines per turn.
----Champion of Chaos: Horus is host to a great chunk of power from each of the 4 dark gods. From the blessings of Nurgle Horus gains a 5+ Feel No Pain!. From Khorne Horus gains the Rage and Furious Charge Universal Special Rules. From Slaanesh Horus gains the ability to reroll failed charges, and also adds 3 inches to all run and charge moves. From Tzeentch Horus gains the ability to reroll 1’s on his invulnerability saves (if a 1 is rolled a second time against the same wound the wound goes through) As Horus is literally host to a massive portion of the might of Chaos his defeat more or less means the defeat of his army. Should Horus be reduced to 0 wounds the game is ended and Horus’ controlling player is considered to have lost the game.
----The Serpent’s Scale: This armor grants Horus a 2+ armor save, and a 3+ invulnerable save. In addition it allows Horus to ignore anything that would negatively affect his characteristics (aside from normal wounding) on a 3+.
----Primarch: Fleet, Fear, Fearless, It Will Not Die!, Eternal Warrior, Adamantium Will, Master of the Legion
----God of Battle: Any unit that is part of a force containing Horus placed in reserves gains the Outlflank special rule. All models with the Legiones Astartes (Sons of Horus) special rule gain +1 Leadership to a max of 10. A force containing Horus may seize the initiative on a roll of 4+.
----Point of the Spear: Horus does battle with the full might of the traitor legions at his back. Unless engaged in close combat once per game Horus may call down an orbital bombardment with the following profile in the shooting phase: S:10, AP:1, Ordinance d3, Large (5”) Blast, Lance, Twin Linked, Unlimited Range
Yeah so there's a recend novel where a Vindicare Assasin attempts to assassinate Horus with his Exitus Rifle. Doesn't go too well. Horus is walking with the mournival and the Vindicare shoots him.....Horus turns around after the round is fired and catches it in his hands and crushes it to dust, and tells the Vindicare that he knew of him since he first left Terra.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/08/12 21:59:32
Finally found my quote from a gym buddy born and raised in South Korea:
"It is the soldier, not the reporter who has given us the freedom of the press.
"It is the soldier, not the poet, who has given us the freedom of speech.
"It is the soldier, not the campus organizer, who gives us the freedom to demonstrate.
"It is the soldier who salutes the flag, who serves beneath the flag, and whose coffin is draped by the flag, who allows the protester to burn the flag."
Since when is Horus a psyker? I've read every HH novel up to this point and I don't think he ever harnesses the Warp even once.
6000 pts
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2500 pts
3000 pts
"We're on an express elevator to hell - goin' down!"
"Depends on the service being refused. It should be fine to refuse to make a porn star a dildo shaped cake that they wanted to use in a wedding themed porn..."
Retrogamer0001 wrote: Since when is Horus a psyker? I've read every HH novel up to this point and I don't think he ever harnesses the Warp even once.
The old fluff has him spewing mind bullets and straight up destroying souls.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ashiraya wrote: You really, really like those super-powerful 1000+ points models, don't you?
Funnily enough the Tau'nar is fully 1/3 the cost of this and is significantly tougher. Though it's generally believed that it'd still be good at 2x it's points cost.
But yes. I love centerpiece units and how the army basically becomes that unit and its' support.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/05/31 21:15:47
Finally found my quote from a gym buddy born and raised in South Korea:
"It is the soldier, not the reporter who has given us the freedom of the press.
"It is the soldier, not the poet, who has given us the freedom of speech.
"It is the soldier, not the campus organizer, who gives us the freedom to demonstrate.
"It is the soldier who salutes the flag, who serves beneath the flag, and whose coffin is draped by the flag, who allows the protester to burn the flag."
Valkyrie wrote: Ridiculous idea. Toughness 9 with FNP, a 3++ Invuln with re-rolling 1's AND a re-rollable IWND?
No. This is just game-breaking, and adding a nonsense clause like "oh if he dies you lose" does little to balance it out.
It is certainly ridiculous, but the alternate ways for your opponent to gain VP built into some of the ROWs really alter the game. He is OPatm but I would say that clause about loosing if you let him die does quite a bit to balance him out.
I would do this: Nerf some of the super duper durability going on to make him closer to (but still decidedly better than) the Normal Horus, to the point that he's worth 800- 900 points and make him worth 5 VP for your opponent. This way, the rule itself gels with other mission rules so you retain some strategy with the wording of the rule. Also, maybe a morale debuff for the army the turn he dies? I feel like if you just loose when he dies, that makes him less of a character and more of a scenario in and of himself. This might be what some people want and not what others want, so that's a little grey. Just my 2 cents.
Psyker (Mastery Level 4): Horus generates 4 Warp charges per turn. Horus may choose 4 powers from any combination of powers listed in the Telekinesis and Pyromancy disciplines. Horus may cast 4 powers from any combination of disciplines per turn. ----Champion of Chaos: As an avatar of the combined might of the ruinous powers Horus’ psychic might is rivaled only by his father. Horus does not roll to harness warp charges (as is normally done on a 4+) but instead instantly harnesses them when manifesting powers. Horus requires 1 less warp charge than normally required (powers still have a minimum of 1 warp charge) to cast powers. The blessings of all 4 dark gods are upon Horus and each grants its’ own boon. From the blessings of Nurgle Horus gains a 4+ Feel No Pain, and the ability to reroll failed It Will Not Die! rolls once per turn. From Khorne Horus gains the Rage and Furious Charge Universal Special Rules. From Slaanesh Horus gains the ability to reroll failed charges, and also adds 3 inches to all run and charge moves. From Tzeentch Horus gains the ability to reroll 1’s on his invulnerability saves. As Horus is literally host to a massive portion of the might of Chaos his defeat more or less means the defeat of his army. Should Horus be reduced to 0 wounds the game is ended and Horus’ controlling player is considered to have lost the game.
First off, "Champion of Chaos" should really be at least 2 rules, maybe even 4 so each god's boon gets a fluffy name. So I'm gonna parse these out individually because my compulsive reformatting urges are on the fritz after reading this.
Psyker (Mastery Level 4): Horus generates 4 Warp charges per turn. Horus may choose 4 powers from any combination of powers listed in the Telekinesis and Pyromancy disciplines. Horus may cast 4 powers from any combination of disciplines per turn. Horus does not roll to harness warp charges (as is normally done on a 4+) but instead instantly harnesses them when manifesting powers. Horus requires 1 less warp charge than normally required (powers still have a minimum of 1 warp charge) to cast powers.
Being a Psyker is a niche deal for primarchs. IMO it should really only be something only Lorgar and Magnus get. If you really want him to be psyker, make it more conditional. Also, for the love of the Emperor, Khorne, Tzeentch, Nurgle, Slaanesh, Malice, whatever is left of the Eldar Pantheon and all of the minor Warp Entities, we should all stop writing Mary Sue psykers who harness WC automatically. No amount of points will ever make an ability like that balanced.
Any way. Maybe Horus can harness charges normally, but you have to declare how many WC you want to try and harness, roll them all at once. Then, if you have any you don't use, it has an area effect where it hurts things around him, but friendly fire is on, even against himself.
The blessings of all 4 dark gods are upon Horus and each grants its’ own boon:
From the blessings of Nurgle Horus gains a 4+ Feel No Pain, and the ability to reroll failed It Will Not Die! rolls once per turn.
Neither of these are bad ideas but together, are a little OP. It doesn't matter much which one, but only pick one of these abilities. I would go for the IWND reroll because its more unique. Everything and its mother has FnP anymore.
From Khorne Horus gains the Rage and Furious Charge Universal Special Rules.
Rage works but is a little mundane. I would go for more like +d6 Attacks on the charge or an extra attack in all combats for every enemy unit that outnumbers him. Or maybe an "exploding" mechanic where he gets additional attacks every time an attack lands a wound. FC is also meh here since he's already S9. I wouldn't even bother with replacing it either; one boon per god is good for formatting and consistency.
From Slaanesh Horus gains the ability to reroll failed charges, and also adds 3 inches to all run and charge moves.
This is fine, but add a clause where his unit or all models within X' get it too.
From Tzeentch Horus gains the ability to reroll 1’s on his invulnerability saves.
Same as before; this fine, but make it an aura effect so he becomes more of a force multiplier. This way, it makes more sense to build the entire army around him, which is what it looks liek you want to o anyways.
As Horus is literally host to a massive portion of the might of Chaos his defeat more or less means the defeat of his army. Should Horus be reduced to 0 wounds the game is ended and Horus’ controlling player is considered to have lost the game.
I commented on this earlier, so see above. In any case, I'd just like to point out that the way this is worded is open to shenanigans. If you really want to leave this as is, change it to:
When Horus reduced to less than one wound, end the game. The owner of Horus looses the game.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/06/20 21:31:35
I went to Hershey Park in central PA this year, and I have to say I was more than a little disappointed. I fully expected the entire theme park to be make entirely of chocolate, but no. Here in America, we have "building codes," and some other nonsense about chocolate melting if don't store it someplace kept below room temperature.
in truth, it would probably be better to take the base horus, add on all 4 marks of chaos (i.e. pull an abbadon), give him 1-2 MLs (since now-a-days he pales in comparison to The Emperor, Malcador, Magnus, Sanguinius (kinda), and Lorgar), Give him the daemon special rule and Maybe stop there (untill we see what rules the Big E will have). Makes him tougher, stronger, faster, and all that jazz, without being stupidly silly.
I'll never be able to repay CA for making GW realize that The Old World was a cash cow, left to die in a field.
Brennonjw wrote: in truth, it would probably be better to take the base horus, add on all 4 marks of chaos (i.e. pull an abbadon), give him 1-2 MLs (since now-a-days he pales in comparison to The Emperor, Malcador, Magnus, Sanguinius (kinda), and Lorgar), Give him the daemon special rule and Maybe stop there (untill we see what rules the Big E will have). Makes him tougher, stronger, faster, and all that jazz, without being stupidly silly.
Brennonjw wrote: in truth, it would probably be better to take the base horus, add on all 4 marks of chaos (i.e. pull an abbadon), give him 1-2 MLs (since now-a-days he pales in comparison to The Emperor, Malcador, Magnus, Sanguinius (kinda), and Lorgar), Give him the daemon special rule and Maybe stop there (untill we see what rules the Big E will have). Makes him tougher, stronger, faster, and all that jazz, without being stupidly silly.
No psyker please.
I second this. Honestly, Lorgar should have been a weaker psyker. It makes magnus and other dedicated psykers feel less unique the more primarchs get psychic rules when that was only a minor part of their character. For normal special characters, some lee way can be had but with primarchs, the whole deal is about how they are unique center piece characters.
I would advise against just giving him the stock god marks though. +1 toughness and initiative on a model that already has 6+ in both of those stats is a waste. He already has an invuln, so a 6++ is worthless. A reroll a la daemon of Tzeentch would be worthwhile though. And then Mark of Khorne would almost not be noticeable. Rage? okay I guess that works but is kind of meh on such a big character. Counter Attack? Who on earth is charging your primarch deathstar unit?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/06/22 20:26:24
I went to Hershey Park in central PA this year, and I have to say I was more than a little disappointed. I fully expected the entire theme park to be make entirely of chocolate, but no. Here in America, we have "building codes," and some other nonsense about chocolate melting if don't store it someplace kept below room temperature.
Brennonjw wrote: in truth, it would probably be better to take the base horus, add on all 4 marks of chaos (i.e. pull an abbadon), give him 1-2 MLs (since now-a-days he pales in comparison to The Emperor, Malcador, Magnus, Sanguinius (kinda), and Lorgar), Give him the daemon special rule and Maybe stop there (untill we see what rules the Big E will have). Makes him tougher, stronger, faster, and all that jazz, without being stupidly silly.
No psyker please.
I second this. Honestly, Lorgar should have been a weaker psyker. It makes magnus and other dedicated psykers feel less unique the more primarchs get psychic rules when that was only a minor part of their character. For normal special characters, some lee way can be had but with primarchs, the whole deal is about how they are unique center piece characters.
I would advise against just giving him the stock god marks though. +1 toughness and initiative on a model that already has 6+ in both of those stats is a waste. He already has an invuln, so a 6++ is worthless. A reroll a la daemon of Tzeentch would be worthwhile though. And then Mark of Khorne would almost not be noticeable. Rage? okay I guess that works but is kind of meh on such a big character. Counter Attack? Who on earth is charging your primarch deathstar unit?
yeah, the MLs were just throwing a bone to OP, truth be told.
As for not just using the stock marks: It's not only about the crunch, but the fluff. He is technically the 'chosen' of the chaos gods, and just like the other 2 people we have rules for being the 'chosen/champion' of the gods (abadon + archaon), he should have the marks. As you said: his stats are already high enough that most buffs will just be unneeded (I would argue T: 7 actually being a decent upgrade as it buys you literal immunity to the "threat" of militia+ solar auxilia lasrifles)
The other thing is the fact that technically, giving him the daemon rule would mean that he's getting the daemon buffs over the mark buffs, no? also, as a possibility (again, depending on how OP the emperor's rules are): give him Mark buffs AND daemon buffs?
I'll never be able to repay CA for making GW realize that The Old World was a cash cow, left to die in a field.
Brennonjw wrote: yeah, the MLs were just throwing a bone to OP, truth be told.
As for not just using the stock marks: It's not only about the crunch, but the fluff. He is technically the 'chosen' of the chaos gods, and just like the other 2 people we have rules for being the 'chosen/champion' of the gods (abadon + archaon), he should have the marks. As you said: his stats are already high enough that most buffs will just be unneeded (I would argue T: 7 actually being a decent upgrade as it buys you literal immunity to the "threat" of militia+ solar auxilia lasrifles)
The other thing is the fact that technically, giving him the daemon rule would mean that he's getting the daemon buffs over the mark buffs, no? also, as a possibility (again, depending on how OP the emperor's rules are): give him Mark buffs AND daemon buffs?
I think we can take some liberty with primarch stats and rules. I get what you mean about the "chosen" flavor but if it comes out that they all don't do much on such a fancy model, its kind of disappointing.
Also, didn't the KDK book give possessed daemons of Khorne and Mark of Khorne? It wouldn't be hard to do that, too if you like the stock marks anyways.
I went to Hershey Park in central PA this year, and I have to say I was more than a little disappointed. I fully expected the entire theme park to be make entirely of chocolate, but no. Here in America, we have "building codes," and some other nonsense about chocolate melting if don't store it someplace kept below room temperature.
Brennonjw wrote: in truth, it would probably be better to take the base horus, add on all 4 marks of chaos (i.e. pull an abbadon), give him 1-2 MLs (since now-a-days he pales in comparison to The Emperor, Malcador, Magnus, Sanguinius (kinda), and Lorgar), Give him the daemon special rule and Maybe stop there (untill we see what rules the Big E will have). Makes him tougher, stronger, faster, and all that jazz, without being stupidly silly.
That wouldn't make sense. Horus is not simply blessed by the Dark Gods, he has an absurd chunk of thier combined power ingrained in his being. The difference is literally along the lines of the one between some random blessed oil and the fething True Cross. The fluff is literally making him out to be an untouchable God. He mentally broke a Vindicare Assassin in a few seconds after catching a Turbo Penetrator Round in his hands.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/08/12 22:05:32
Finally found my quote from a gym buddy born and raised in South Korea:
"It is the soldier, not the reporter who has given us the freedom of the press.
"It is the soldier, not the poet, who has given us the freedom of speech.
"It is the soldier, not the campus organizer, who gives us the freedom to demonstrate.
"It is the soldier who salutes the flag, who serves beneath the flag, and whose coffin is draped by the flag, who allows the protester to burn the flag."
, 
6000 pts
2000 pts
2500 pts
