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Im seriously confused if preferred enemy works on plasma cannons or not.

The rules for Gets Hot and Re-rolls say 'If a model has the ability to re-roll its rolls To Hit (including because of BS 6+, or Twinlinked),
a Wound is only suffered if the To Hit re-roll is also a 1; it may also re-roll Gets Hot
results of 1 for weapons that do not roll To Hit'.

But the recent FAQ says that it can not use re-rolls to hit on gets hot blast weapons because the roll you make to see if the blast weapon overheats is not a to hit roll.

Im confused the FAQ says it cant re-roll because its not a to hit roll but the rule book specifically says 'it may also re-roll Gets Hot
results of 1 for weapons that do not roll To Hit'.

Thoughts ?

My understanding is that you cannot reroll the gets hot of a blast weapon due to preferred enemy (even twin linked wouldnt get you that).

A comparison for you. The riptide putting its gun on novacharge (gains gets hot, and 12 shots).

If i roll a 1 on my to hit roll, then he gets hot. If i had boosted his BS to 6 or higher with marker lights, I would reroll all misses, and stick with the last result, 1's would still get hot.

If I put it on over charge (blast weapon) . and still boosted the BS, I roll the gets hot dice once. There is no weapon that I'm aware of that rerolls a gets hot check. It's only a reroll of the hit, where the gets hot would otherwise prohibit the shot taking place, thus massively diminishing the effectivenss of twin linked), where this rule matters.

hope this helps (and is right!)

Because Plasma Cannons are Blast Weapons with the Gets Hot Special Rule, there are two things to note here:

-- Because it is a Blast Weapon, it does not roll To Hit.

NB: There was actually a thread I participated in not all that long ago that discussed the issue of Preferred Enemy with regards to Blast Weapons and, unless I'm mistaken, the end result was that Preferred Enemy has no effect on Blast Weapons in terms of the To Hit rolls (since Blast Weapons don't roll To Hit).

This means that Preferred Enemy only affects the Plasma Cannon when you make the To Wound rolls.

-- Not only is the Gets Hot roll separate from the Scatter Dice roll in the case of the Plasma Cannon, but the Gets Hot roll is also not a To Hit roll and nor is it a To Wound roll, so Preferred Enemy has no effect on that either.

TLDR? Preferred Enemy only affects Plasma Cannons when you make the To Wound roll(s) and has no effect whatsoever on the Gets Hot roll.

if that is the case why does the rule book say ' it may also re-roll Gets Hot
results of 1 for weapons that do not roll To Hit' ? why are you ignoring that line ?

Lume wrote:
if that is the case why does the rule book say ' it may also re-roll Gets Hot results of 1 for weapons that do not roll To Hit'? why are you ignoring that line ?

My apologies, I miss-read that line as something slightly different. It's also unwise to immediately accuse me of deliberately doing something wrong (in this case, ignoring a particular sentence) - I do make mistakes, and I'm trying to help you after all.

...it may also re-roll Gets Hot results of 1 for weapons that do not roll To Hit.

On the quote directly above specifically: That sentence should answer your original question clearly. Where's the ambiguity?

no no no im not accusing you, sorry man i just worded that badly.

I hope it is the case that I can re roll Gets Hot because i really dont want my 155 point Executioner Leman Russ killing it self !

Lume wrote:
no no no im not accusing you, sorry man i just worded that badly.

No worries

Lume wrote:
I hope it is the case that I can re roll Gets Hot because i really dont want my 155 point Executioner Leman Russ killing it self !

It's a case of that excerpt of a sentence seems to strongly suggest that you do get to re-roll the Gets Hot roll, but here's where I'm starting to get a little hesitant:

In the same sentence when it talks about weapons that do roll To Hit, it refers to the ability to re-roll. In the wording for Preferred Enemy, it only permits the re-rolling of the To Hit roll on a specific result - which isn't necessarily the same as generically saying that the weapon has the ability to re-roll its To Hit roll. With that in mind, I can't help but wander if that differentiation (however minor) might be the difference to whether or not the weapon gets to re-roll its Gets Hot roll.

Just pointing that according to the new FAQ draft Preferred enemy do not confer the ability to re-roll the get's hot dice with plasma cannons.

Q: Does the Preferred Enemy special rule allow you to re-roll Gets Hot rolls of 1 for blast weapons (e.g. a plasma cannon)?
A: No.

Lord Perversor wrote:
Just pointing that according to the new FAQ draft Preferred enemy do not confer the ability to re-roll the get's hot dice with plasma cannons.

Q: Does the Preferred Enemy special rule allow you to re-roll Gets Hot rolls of 1 for blast weapons (e.g. a plasma cannon)?
A: No.

In short: a badly written rule, vitually unusable, illogical, and incoherent in the BRB that spawned a thousand arguments on YMDC alone has been tidied up and FAQ'd. End of.

looking at the rulebook again, (the iBook version) under gets hot and rerolls, it may also reroll gets hot results for weapons that do not roll to hit, IF the model has the ability to reroll its to hit rolls, including because of bs 6 and twin linked.

so i change my original answer. As it stands, you can reroll the gets hot.

Trazer985 wrote:looking at the rulebook again, (the iBook version) under gets hot and rerolls, it may also reroll gets hot results for weapons that do not roll to hit, IF the model has the ability to reroll its to hit rolls, including because of bs 6 and twin linked.

so i change my original answer. As it stands, you can reroll the gets hot.

GW Draft FAQ wrote:Q: Does the Preferred Enemy special rule allow you to re-roll Gets Hot rolls of 1 for blast weapons (e.g. a plasma cannon)?
A: No.

That's direct from GW. That's the answer, regardless of the RAW from the BRB.

 Yarium wrote:

Trazer985 wrote:looking at the rulebook again, (the iBook version) under gets hot and rerolls, it may also reroll gets hot results for weapons that do not roll to hit, IF the model has the ability to reroll its to hit rolls, including because of bs 6 and twin linked.

so i change my original answer. As it stands, you can reroll the gets hot.

GW Draft FAQ wrote:Q: Does the Preferred Enemy special rule allow you to re-roll Gets Hot rolls of 1 for blast weapons (e.g. a plasma cannon)?
A: No.

That's direct from GW. That's the answer, regardless of the RAW from the BRB.

if thats what GW say in an official FAQ, then thats what you have to play, but for twin linked they'll get it.

Isn't that part of the draft FAQ though?

Hence why it's titled GW Draft FAQ. You may choose to play it differently until it's official, but I can almost guarantee that this is going to stay this way

 Yarium wrote:
Hence why it's titled GW Draft FAQ. You may choose to play it differently until it's official, but I can almost guarantee that this is going to stay this way

I think the issue with that answer is simply that it's not consistent. Now they've made one single exception (PE), but never tell us how to treat all the other sources of rerolls. It's a bad answer regardless of which way you played before / preferred.

just to be clear... if the weapon allows you to reroll the result (not only 1's like preffered enemy, more like twin linked) you can still reroll gets hot results of 1?

RedNoak wrote:
just to be clear... if the weapon allows you to reroll the result (not only 1's like preffered enemy, more like twin linked) you can still reroll gets hot results of 1?

Well the FAQ only speaks of Prefered Enemy IIRC, so anything ELSE is unaffected including "only 1s".

RedNoak wrote:
just to be clear... if the weapon allows you to reroll the result (not only 1's like preffered enemy, more like twin linked) you can still reroll gets hot results of 1?

Per the BRB, yes.

However per the Draft FAQ

Q: Do plasma cannons and other Gets Hot Blast weapons benefit from rules that allow them to re-roll To Hit rolls of 1? For example, a Clan Raukaan character wearing the Tempered Helm nominates a unit of friendly Devastators to re-roll To Hit rolls of 1 in this Shooting phase. These Devastators are all equipped with plasma cannons. Do they get to re-roll the Gets Hot roll if it comes up as 1?
A: No. The roll to see if a Gets Hot Blast weapon overheats is not a To Hit roll.

There is no way to re-roll Gets Hot for Blast weapons, as it is not a To Hit roll.


That said, it has been pointed out in the comments that this means the rule does nothing and needs to be addressed before final publication.

 Happyjew wrote:

RedNoak wrote:
just to be clear... if the weapon allows you to reroll the result (not only 1's like preffered enemy, more like twin linked) you can still reroll gets hot results of 1?

Per the BRB, yes.

However per the Draft FAQ

Q: Do plasma cannons and other Gets Hot Blast weapons benefit from rules that allow them to re-roll To Hit rolls of 1? For example, a Clan Raukaan character wearing the Tempered Helm nominates a unit of friendly Devastators to re-roll To Hit rolls of 1 in this Shooting phase. These Devastators are all equipped with plasma cannons. Do they get to re-roll the Gets Hot roll if it comes up as 1?
A: No. The roll to see if a Gets Hot Blast weapon overheats is not a To Hit roll.

There is no way to re-roll Gets Hot for Blast weapons, as it is not a To Hit roll.


That said, it has been pointed out in the comments that this means the rule does nothing and needs to be addressed before final publication.

Ah, so for Prefered Enemy they ruled it "no" twice then. I missed the 2nd, generic, ruling apparently, thanks!

It ignores that bs1 twin linked and PE trigger on the exact same roll, but one gets a reroll on gets hit and one doesn't.

It's a poor faq answer, as it doesn't address the actual rule.

nosferatu1001 wrote:
It ignores that bs1 twin linked and PE trigger on the exact same roll, but one gets a reroll on gets hit and one doesn't.

It's a poor faq answer, as it doesn't address the actual rule.

According to the FAQ Twin-Linked also doesn't work RAW then, or am I missing anything?

However the intent is pretty clear I'd say. PE and anything similar doesn't work. TL and BS6+ does.

nekooni wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:
It ignores that bs1 twin linked and PE trigger on the exact same roll, but one gets a reroll on gets hit and one doesn't.

It's a poor faq answer, as it doesn't address the actual rule.

According to the FAQ Twin-Linked also doesn't work RAW then, or am I missing anything?

However the intent is pretty clear I'd say. PE and anything similar doesn't work. TL and BS6+ does.

sadly its not that clear as the BRB states, BS boosted to 6+ and TL are some examples of how this can happen.

Oddly enough, BS 6+ and PE both work on the exact same requirement...

 Charistoph wrote:
Oddly enough, BS 6+ and PE both work on the exact same requirement...

It is odd from that perspective, but that doesn't necessitate that the two are the same.

My guess is that GW's going with the thought that someone with BS6+ knows how to fire a gun really well to avoid it, while someone with Preferred Enemy just knows how to hurt their enemy really well and might miss that critical overload.

 Yarium wrote:

 Charistoph wrote:
Oddly enough, BS 6+ and PE both work on the exact same requirement...

It is odd from that perspective, but that doesn't necessitate that the two are the same.

My guess is that GW's going with the thought that someone with BS6+ knows how to fire a gun really well to avoid it, while someone with Preferred Enemy just knows how to hurt their enemy really well and might miss that critical overload.

Same requirements, though, rolling 1 To Hit. BS 6+ is not a reroll of a Miss. Should not the same judgement be in place for both without anything else addressing it?

Someone with Preferred Enemy knows a little better on which way their target needs to be led to hit them. Just knowing how to hurt their enemy really well only applies to Wounding/Armour Penetration (which is also covered in PE).

 Charistoph wrote:
Same requirements, though, rolling 1 To Hit. BS 6+ is not a reroll of a Miss. Should not the same judgement be in place for both without anything else addressing it?

Someone with Preferred Enemy knows a little better on which way their target needs to be led to hit them. Just knowing how to hurt their enemy really well only applies to Wounding/Armour Penetration (which is also covered in PE).

You'll find no argument from me on the specifics of the rules, but just because two things share a connection doesn't mean they are handled the same. As it stands, this is simply what GW has said so far. Thus, it's only Preferred Enemy that doesn't allow the reroll of the Gets Hot roll, with all other sources of rerolls still allowing a reroll of the Gets Hot roll. My fluff description is just an attempt at rationalization for their decision, and definitely not rules related in any way. How? Why? Will it stay the same? Will Mountain Dew ever taste good? These questions and more cannot yet be answered.

 Charistoph wrote:
Oddly enough, BS 6+ and PE both work on the exact same requirement...

GW has said that PE does not allow a reroll for gets hot. it is a draft, but I don't think that is going to change. it might though.

Yarium wrote:You'll find no argument from me on the specifics of the rules, but just because two things share a connection doesn't mean they are handled the same. As it stands, this is simply what GW has said so far. Thus, it's only Preferred Enemy that doesn't allow the reroll of the Gets Hot roll, with all other sources of rerolls still allowing a reroll of the Gets Hot roll. My fluff description is just an attempt at rationalization for their decision, and definitely not rules related in any way. How? Why? Will it stay the same? Will Mountain Dew ever taste good? These questions and more cannot yet be answered.

Same requirements is the same requirements. Either they both work, or they both don't. It is the only way to be consistent without coming across as a preferential jerk in a game.

DeathReaper wrote:GW has said that PE does not allow a reroll for gets hot. it is a draft, but I don't think that is going to change. it might though.

And they have said a lot of things without actually reviewing their rules, like Battle Brothers in Transports on Deployment, for example.

 Charistoph wrote:
Same requirements is the same requirements. Either they both work, or they both don't. It is the only way to be consistent without coming across as a preferential jerk in a game.

Well, I guess GW is coming across as a preferential jerk then . I agree, it might be a little confusing to someone why one "reroll 1's = reroll Gets Hot" works and the other doesn't, but hey, them's the breaks. We do have it "from the horse's mouth" so to speak, with a definite "yes" to BS6+ in the BRB, and a definite "no" to PE in the FAQ. Why one and not the other? Because spaghetti flying monsters are chasing me in my dreams.

 Yarium wrote:

 Charistoph wrote:
Same requirements is the same requirements. Either they both work, or they both don't. It is the only way to be consistent without coming across as a preferential jerk in a game.

Well, I guess GW is coming across as a preferential jerk then . I agree, it might be a little confusing to someone why one "reroll 1's = reroll Gets Hot" works and the other doesn't, but hey, them's the breaks. We do have it "from the horse's mouth" so to speak, with a definite "yes" to BS6+ in the BRB, and a definite "no" to PE in the FAQ. Why one and not the other? Because spaghetti flying monsters are chasing me in my dreams.

Or we take it as the FAQ overriding BS 6+ as well. Or we take it as GW talking out of their arse with their own House Rules because they don't really read them half the time anyway.

Exactly. With the FAQ bs6 and PE behave differently raw.
Which is why GWs answer simply sucks - it overcomplicates an already unclear rule and still manages to leave questions unresolved.