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Hi I'm looking for some wisdom on scout and rhino upgrades:

I've armed my scouts uniformly the same way:
CCWs, Ordinary Serg with Combi-Melta in LSS with MMelta & used it as a cheap anti-vehicle & backfield harassment unit.
I've take then view that CCloaks are pointless because they are in the Storm initially and have avoided the Vet Serg/Power weapon upgrade.

What I'm wondering is that if you are using 3 units of scouts in 3 LSS as part of a Stormbringer Formation - is it then worth a vet serg/power maul as you hurl three close combat scout units (still only 15 bodies) at an enemy with LSS and Landspeeder backup? (750/1000 point games). Additionally do any of you use CCloaks for when they disembark ( seems pointless? ).

On a similar note - I've generally avoided Rhino upgrades - but am keen to know what others experience of dozer blades, extra SBolter, hunter killer missile and extra armor are? My view has been a bit like my approach to scouts keep them lean...

Regarding Rhinos: a Dozer Blade is a good buy if you have the spare points. I try to have at least one of my Rhinos equipped with a Dozer Blade, as there's always some sort of terrain on the battlefield that you want to send a unit into.

Hunter-killer missiles more optional, but I buy them if I have the spare points. I don't make a point of taking them, but if you can slap 3 or 4 onto your vehicles you can get a good first-turn barrage. Multiples are good.

Extra armor and Storm bolters are really, really optional. They don't add much but they do soak up extra points, though I'd rather spend those points on melta bombs, dozer blades, etc.

Regarding Scouts: I take three sorts of Scout squad (using Imperial Fists tactics): sniper rifles and camo cloaks, for getting maximum benefit from the 10th Company Task Force bonuses; bolters and a heavy bolter, for harassing the enemy, possibly from inside a Storm; and all close combat weapons, mounted in a Storm.

I usually keep upgrades to a minimum, maaaaybe buying melta bombs for the Sergeant, because I use my Scouts as expendable throw-away troops. This has worked out well for me.

However, I definitely see a use in making Scouts into more of a cutting-edge assault force, leading your attack on the enemy lines. In that case I would definitely upgrade the Sergeant to a Veteran and buy him a Power Weapon. If you are taking three squads I would upgrade one or two of the Sergeants but not all of them, as not every squad is going to have an ideal target to go after with the power weapon so you might as well save points on the guy whose power weapon would be wasted anyway.

Extra armor can be key on a transport though. Keep it moving.

I've never used scouts but for rhinos I keep them as cheap as possible. They're essentially a 3-wound marine (I know that they're technically more durable than that but really, when has a Rhino had a longer life expectency than a normal wound-filler marine?) for the cost of 2.3 marines that can transport another squad.

However if you go Chaos, Havoc Launchers and an extra combi bolter can be fun. Still cheap enough that you can spam them in decent numbers and the enemy generally won't think much of them until it open fires. Good against hordes (and unlike the loyalist counterpart the weapon isn't one-shot) and is basically a mini-whirlwind for CSM. Don't expect it to do much other than be a distraction though.

Being a Space Mutt player scouts are not something I depend heavily on but I've been running the Iron Wolves formation a bit lately so I can completely upgrade some vehicles for free, admittedly I have been using rather reckless tactics to boot but it has put some stress testing on upgrades to find out which ones do get more use than others.

Dozer Blade: Admittedly I'm being ultra reckless but Rhinos and Razorbacks rarely see much benefit of the extra front armour in a ramming situation, they're just too small to hit big stuff without equal risk and too slow to catch most things of an equal or smaller size. The re-roll on dangerous terrain makes the points well spent though and I use it at least once in every game, again though I'm being stupidly reckless.

Extra Armour: This one I'm torn on, Rhinos and Razorbacks don't really see full benefit from the armour as usually the kind of fire that brings them down is not a one-shot mega weapon and vehicle damage table but a couple of glancing shots to wreck it, on the other hand there are armies that have overkill as a normal setting and bailing stunned or shaken troops onto the battlefield is never fun.

Hunter Killer Missile: Unless you have a way of re-rolling the results this will usually fizzle.

Storm Bolters: I like them, they make the Rhino more of a utility vehicle, capable of harassing troops on objectives, getting a bit of extra firepower and LOS blockage or cover into a firefight or just picking off stray models to rack up kill points.

Hunter Killers are fun to spam with free Rhinos/Razorbacks, but that's about it.

You get more mileage from both Extra Armor and Dozer Blades, but Hunter Killers don't hurt to add for fun. About 30 points gives your Rhino/Razorback a lot of utility in that regard, and adding 20 for an assault Cannon on the Razorback makes it absurd almost. Luckily they're easy to pop with Scatterbikes.

I play on boards with lots of terrain and Dozer Blades are a must, a transport immobilized on hedgesis a useless one.

Storm Bolters are very nice to have it turns the Rhino into a light gun platform. If you have a min squad inside you'll have 6 bolt shots at 24" or 8 at 12"

Extra Armour might be useful if your meta has lots of Krak Missles.

Hunter Killer Missles are only good if taken on 4 or more vehicles. With 6 you can almost guarantee first blood on a light enemy vehicle.

I never run extra armor as one of my Rhinos is almost certainly going to be first blood. I run HKs when I have the points, as I've pulled off some amazing bs with them in past games. However, the people I play with always go medium to heavy terrain boards so it's more or less mandatory to run dozer blades.

As far as scouts go, I'd keep them cheap. LSS are best used as objective grabbing. Even with CC 5 scouts won't be able to hold it for more than a turn. If you're using them to pop armor (interesting strategy) then I would keep them the same way. I'd run a melta bomb instead of the maul. That many attacks on armor 10 is almost overkill. The melta bomb is cheaper a maul and you've got a krak grenade and Str 4 attacks on top of a MM and combi shot. I know it's only 10 points saved, but that's 30 between all 3 squads. There are a lot of seemingly trivial upgrades that can make a respectable difference (veteran Sgt upgrades, auspexes, Hunter killers etc).

Extra armor is very valuable for Rhinos being used as mobile terrain.

Bolters in storms are kind of meh now that the Jinking vehicles cause snap shotting dudes thing was confirmed. My CCW scouts usually do work - a 55 point unit of scouts murdered a eleven man unit plus herald of horrors, then ran over and killed some cultists, and took an objective.

I haven't bought dozer blades yet despite my fairly reckless play style with transports. Since they're only immobilized in a 1 and can repair themselves on a 6, even when I break them I can often get them back in the game. I do make a point of trying to enter terrain in ways and places I don't mind getting stuck-- near an objective or with good LoS for shooting.

I do want to make some magnetic hard points for my Rhinos to try out Hunter-killers.

 Crazyterran wrote:
Bolters in storms are kind of meh now that the Jinking vehicles cause snap shotting dudes thing was confirmed. My CCW scouts usually do work - a 55 point unit of scouts murdered a eleven man unit plus herald of horrors, then ran over and killed some cultists, and took an objective.

Reread the jink rule. The dudes don't snapshot(or get the cover save); them counting as having jinked has no actual effect.

FAQ apparently says otherwise.

 Kommissar Kel wrote:

 Crazyterran wrote:
Bolters in storms are kind of meh now that the Jinking vehicles cause snap shotting dudes thing was confirmed. My CCW scouts usually do work - a 55 point unit of scouts murdered a eleven man unit plus herald of horrors, then ran over and killed some cultists, and took an objective.

Reread the jink rule. The dudes don't snapshot(or get the cover save); them counting as having jinked has no actual effect.

*looks at FAQ*

*arcs eyebrow*

No, I'm pretty sure Bolter scouts are garbage now, and I'm tempted to buy a new box just to get more CCW scouts, rather than worse tactical marines.

 Crazyterran wrote:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:

 Crazyterran wrote:
Bolters in storms are kind of meh now that the Jinking vehicles cause snap shotting dudes thing was confirmed. My CCW scouts usually do work - a 55 point unit of scouts murdered a eleven man unit plus herald of horrors, then ran over and killed some cultists, and took an objective.

Reread the jink rule. The dudes don't snapshot(or get the cover save); them counting as having jinked has no actual effect.

*looks at FAQ*

*arcs eyebrow*

No, I'm pretty sure Bolter scouts are garbage now, and I'm tempted to buy a new box just to get more CCW scouts, rather than worse tactical marines.

Perhaps you should explain rather than being snarky.