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2016/08/08 00:07:44
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
Has anyone ever had experience in starting up a gaming club from scratch? (or in my case, almost from scratch). Could you give advice on how to advertise, where to advertise, who to approach. I find myself in the position of having joined a small local gaming club in my town thats been steadily declining in membership over the last year since before I joined to the point that its just myself and one other guy (R") that still attend regularly, and we're getting to the point where we're going to have to advertise really hard for new members or close.
Are the staff in Gamesworkshop stores amenable to letting you post club flyers in their stores? We aren't purely a Gamesworkshop club, we play anything from Card Games (Magic the Gathering) to board games (Star Wars Imperial Assault, Zombicide) to roleplaying games (Dungeons and Dragons) to miniature wargames (SAGA, Lord of the Rings, This is Not a Test). Some of us have old Warhammer or LOTR armies and would be happy to set up some games with local players of GW games. Theres a GW store in the next town about 20min away, anyone in my town that plays GW games will in all likelihood go there so it might be a good place to start. Hell, I would love to get a local Lord of the Rings scene going on.
What about Youth Centres? Schools? etc. I'm not DBS checked, but the other guy is. (We're both keyholders for the community centre and capable of running the club).
Full history of the club in the spoiler below:
Spoiler:
The club was originally ran by a popular and charismatic guy ("P") who had to leave to devote more time to his gaming store & cafe business in another town.
The guy who took over ("B") wasn't very enthusiastic about running the club, and wouldn't participate in games at all nevermind host games. People began to drift away after that. This was when I joined the club. Eventually a group of us offered to take over running the club for him which he accepted, and we haven't seen him since (nothing acrimonious AFAIK, it seems he just wanted to wash his hands of the club).
We formed an informal committee of sorts (basically 4 people with the right to vote on club decisions, plus two keyholders for the community centre we meet at). For a while things were OK, we had a small but regular core of 6 or 7 people who attended weekly. We played a lot of board games (Zombicide, Star Wars Imperial Assault etc), some wargames and I ran a Dungeons and Dragons campaign. People would occassionally bring their friends along, though none of those visitors returned.
But ever since the Summer, people again began drifting away due to exams, holidays, preparing for University etc and now its just myself and one other guy ("R") who still attends.
We recently found out that theres another club in town that we somehow hadn't heard of. They meet just once a month at most, whenever the guy organising it can find the time off work. One of them invited R and I over, and we went to introduce ourselves and reach out to them to tell them about our club. I was told (by the guy who invited me) that several of them were looking for a local club that meets more regularly (as in weekly, rather monthly or bi monthly.
We were worried that it might have come across as us trying to poach members, but we took pains to make it clear that we want to coordinate the clubs. When they run their monthly/bi-monthly meetup, we close our club and go over to visit them so that the club nights don't clash (we want to have fun anyway, so it makes sense for us to visit the larger club than be stubborn).
We were also worried that our high subs of £3.50 per person per session turned them off (we hire a room in a community centre and had a weekly cost of £15), but a couple months ago the owner waived the fixed cost and is only asking for £2 per person that attends, so we're getting the room almost for free (he doesn't want the centre to be empty on a weekend, and he's giving us the chance to rebuild).
We once again invited the people at the other club to come visit, but lowering the subs back down to £2 still hasn't enticed them to come visit. A first visit is free too, they only have to start paying £2 per session on their second visit. Several of them said they would come visit (one of whom is looking for Magic the Gathering opponents, of who there are several at our club) but none of them have showed up.
This other club is also very different in character to ours. They're all adults over the age of 20, and as they hire a function room at a sports centre (which they get for free if they spend more than £50 on food from the bar), they allow alcohol. Whereas we have (or had, I should say) several minors at our club, and want to keep it a welcoming place for minors (we don't want parents to ban their kids from coming because people are drinking alcohol), so R and I (the only two "committee" members remaining) won't allow alcohol here.
Basically they're turning their noses up at our club because they don't want to pay £2 per session (despite them having to spend £5 or more per person on food and drink at the sports centre to get the room for free) to help contribute and keep the club running...and possibly because they want alcohol...and possibly because they're a tight knit clique of friends. This is despite several of them telling me in person that they're looking for a more regular local club ...just not ours apparently. One guy even arranged a smaller meetup (during the off weeks between their main big meetups) at his house despite knowing that we were inviting people to come visit our club on that same night because "people don't want to pay £2 for a club night" (which is crap, because everybody's first visit to our club is FREE anyway, you only start paying subs on your 2nd visit).
Nothing acrimonious has occurred between the two clubs, they just won't keep their word and come to visit us. (And regardless, I will continue to attend their [i]very rare meet ups).[/i]
So we're now in the position of having to advertise more widely across our local area, schools, youth centres etc. We have a good thing here, we have decent premises in a community centre for a very cheap price (£2 per person, not a fixed cost) with our own storage and I want the club to survive. My only alternatives are another club in my town that barely meets once a month (last session was mid July, next session is mid September) or clubs in other towns (20 - 50 min away). Which wouldn't be the end of the world, but I would prefer a more local club.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/08/08 00:17:05
2016/08/08 00:30:11
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
Sounds more like there's an age disconnect. It's not uncommon for adult gamers to want an adult atmosphere. Going from a sports bar where they can get alcohol and have no minors about to a minor-friendly place is going to rub those people the wrong way.
2016/08/08 01:03:54
Subject: Re:Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
Right. There are no minors currently attending our club, there's just me and one other guy and we're both 24/25. Another couple of guys attend occasionally, like once a month and they're over 30. But we do want to keep the club open for minors, as its always been an all ages club.
Alcohol is permitted at our community centre, so we could allow it on specific events when we know there won't be any minors, but we don't want it to become the norm.
And they don't want to pay sub's towards the cost of hiring the room, despite complaining that they want a club that meets regularly instead of just every two months. (We meet every Saturday night 6pm-9pm).
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/08/08 01:08:34
2016/08/08 11:52:12
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
See club meets on a Saturday night is bad imho - that's prime time family/socialising time. Most clubs where I am tend to game week nights for that reason
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I think current GW policy is not to allow external clubs to promote in store
but it's certainly worth going in and talking to the manager (and staff if there are any) as they may be willing to tell people you exist in an unofficial way even if you can't put up posters (also any model shops as there's usually some cross over and again you may be able to put up posters etc)
A facebook page/group is probably a good idea (plus any other social media you know although you want to try and keep member interaction in one place and use the rest to point to there and post meets)
any local universities you can see if you can hook up with players ?
and you should be ok to approach schools as long as somebody is DBS checked (as long as they're going to be on site
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/08/08 12:21:03
2016/08/08 13:36:56
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
My old game club met 1 saturday a month, and it was mostly all order married guys.. their wives were OK with them devoting 1 saturday to the hobby and the rest to the family. And there were still pickup games here and there during the month that guys would arrange amongst themselves.
How often do you meet? If it's once a week that might be too often for some people, but once a month will be easier for people to schedule and look forward to.
2016/08/08 16:23:11
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
Reaver83 wrote: See club meets on a Saturday night is bad imho - that's prime time family/socialising time. Most clubs where I am tend to game week nights for that reason
Which happens to be school nights and work days. We switched from a Thursday night to a Saturday because too many people couldn't make it due to schoolwork or working back shifts.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
A facebook page/group is probably a good idea (plus any other social media you know although you want to try and keep member interaction in one place and use the rest to point to there and post meets
Yes, we have a facebook group, with a decent number of likes (57). People just don't bother turning up. We try to post photos each week of the games we play.
any local universities you can see if you can hook up with players ?
Not in the immediate area. The closest University (which I graduated from years ago) is a 40 min drive away. I suppose I could reach out to their gaming clubs but I don't expect more than 1 or 2 people in those clubs to be local to Aycliffe.
and you should be ok to approach schools as long as somebody is DBS checked (as long as they're going to be on site
I'm not DBS checked but the other guy is. Might be worth getting it myself.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/08/08 18:25:01
2016/08/09 10:55:15
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
I think you should look at scheduling again. Saturday evening is a bad time for a club night as people tend to have other social commitments. You should look at either being weekly on a weeknight, or alternatively go for all day on a saturday or sunday, perhaps dropping down to fortnightly or monthly.
If the people who couldn't come on weeknights aren't coming anyway then there's no reason to worry about them. Similarly, if there's no kids coming at the moment it seems like cutting off your nose to spite your face if you're putting off potential adult members on the off-chance that you might have kids there one day.
2016/08/09 11:31:59
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
Facebook group to announce new developments/campaigns/event days?
FLGS (not GW) that might have tables you could use for free?
Run escalation campaigns, starting with the most popular game (draw in people not currently attending) and moving through other games (drum up cross interest)
Disband as a group and become a network for arranging games in each others homes?
2016/08/09 11:40:56
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
My local club is Saturday afternoons. It is in a hired church hall.
I have not been able to make it along often recently, but it could have 6 tables out one week, and 2 people (including the keyholder) the next.
There was a point where new-but-regular clubbies wanted to help get more people along, but accidentally offended some of the super-secret (we didn't ask the right questions to get told) committee about it.
It's been pretty dead since.
Ideas from that included a policy of "we guarantee you a game" for new people, but that failed by the 3rd attempt.
We have a page on Facebook and a section of a forum, but people either cannot get on there to arrange games, or refuse to use them (for whatever reason).
And, it's the Summer. But, this Winter wasn't much better.
Anyway, good luck with it.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/08/09 11:46:36
I think you need to decide what kind of club you're running. That will inform your advertising strategy.
If it's for adults, weekday evenings someplace with alcohol is best. Online advertising is probably the way forward along with word of mouth.
If you're looking to accept minors, weekends, full DBS checks for the pair of you, and your current venue will suffice. You can then advertise in local schools/colleges, newsagents, and potentially your GW.
2016/08/09 17:27:22
Subject: Re:Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
We can't do weekdays, thats why we switched to Saturday nights in the first place.
The other guy works a three shift pattern, and in 2 out of 3 weeks he's either sleeping or he's working. I work late, and don't get home till about 5.30pm. Thats not enough time to get showered and changed and collect my stuff to open up at 6pm. The other members of the club (who are all AWOL over summer) also have/had school or work commitments on weekdays. We made a group decision to switch to a Saturday night because that was the most convenient day for the majority of people.
We do however have a great deal of flexibility on a weekend. Currently we meet 6pm-10pm on a Saturday, but there are no regular groups scheduled on Saturdays and Sundays (just the occasional one-off birthday party or other events which tend to use the main hall, not our conference room), so we could switch to an earlier time on a Saturday.
If it's for adults, weekday evenings someplace with alcohol is best. Online advertising is probably the way forward along with word of mouth.
All ages, but we can organise one-off events for adults only which is how the other club in my town operates - they're more of an ad hoc group of gaming friends meeting up when their calenders align, rather than the regular weekly club that we're trying to run.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/08/09 17:32:24
2016/08/09 23:02:02
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
Sorry to bang the Saturday drum again but Satuday Afternoon is just not a very good time to hold a club. Your competing against family and Saturday shifts but also many other organised activities That will have happened before the afternoon or at he same time never mind just watching mass audience sports like Prem. Footy and Rugby.
I like gaming allot but there just too much competition at that time.
Drinking is not a deal breaker for me but at our club (Wednesday evenings weekly) there usually a pint on most tables. Of course alcah ok does not preclude those under 18, they just aren't allowed to drink it. Tricky call.
Finally it seems like you cover a whole gambit of games which can be ironically counter productive. I'd take a leaf out of GWs book here; Organised games/leagues will draw people in and help you develop a core attendance. Other systems can break off from here as people get chatting over the course of a few months. We often have these sorts of events sometimes concurrently. It usually means that there is a core of a dozen or more people playing the same game with other games being played around the edges. So we have 40k/WM escalation leagues, Blood Bowl/Guildball/Deadzone leagues, MTG pack releases ( could tarnish ou as a card club though), Warmaster/Neco/Mordheim campaigns; anything that a core group will want to play for a few months at a time. Combined to this we also have a forum for organising games a tracking painting progress, banter/etc.
Making a group is all about creating connections between the members so try to encourage this.
How do you promote your Hobby? - Legoburner "I run some crappy wargaming website "
2016/08/09 23:26:48
Subject: Re:Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
We have no choice in the matter, as both the keyholders (myself and "R") both work late on weekdays. I've repeated this several times now.
Making a group is all about creating connections between the members so try to encourage this.
Yes, there are at least a couple Magic the Gathering players at the other club in town (which meets once every 6 weeks or so) who have told us they're looking for regular opponents and a club that meets more often. We've repeatedly invited them to come visit and play MtG with us (I don't play it, but R does, and theres another 4 MtG players who are temporarily AWOL over Summer) but no look so far. It's been 2 months since we introduced ourselves, and invited them to come visit us and only one person has visited (once).
Maybe I'm just reading too much into the situation, and everyone at this other club are just busy with holidays and family too with it being the summer [school] holidays.
Regardless of their reasons for not coming, I'll still attend their bi-monthly sessions. Its not like I'm doing much anyway.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/08/09 23:30:30
2016/08/10 00:09:49
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
I'm largely responsible for a lot of the running of my local, despite constant protestations that I didn't want to be that heavily involved, and I've also got a background in management, just to qualify what I'm about to say.
Stop having it on Saturdays.
That is, if you actually want the club to grow.
What it appears you're actually after is a means to encourage other people to come at a time that is conveniamt for you, despite that time being incoveniant for a lot of people, which is a different, and much harder to resolve, situation.
If 6 is difficult, do 6.30, or 7. You seem to have got into a mindset that the club needs to be 6 - 10. Well, for many, 6 on any working day will be too early. People will want to get home, change clothes, and perhaps eat before they come out, so a later start that suits you a little better will likely suit everyone else as well.
As for R and his shift pattern, well, maybe you can still set up for games at weekends, but frankly by trying to accommodate one person with awkward availability is torpedoing the whole enterprise before you get going. Maybe you can do two nights a week, and perhaps get more attendees on the weekend by getting them enthusiastic during weekday evenings?
Being in charge means making decisions for the best of the whole, even if that means inconveniencing small parts of it, but FWIW you have my sympathy, being in charge in a workplace is much easier, when you have express authority over people. Managing a group like a games club is much tougher, as people can let you down repeatedly, fail to follow through on stuff or just not come anyone, and there's not a damn thing you can do apart from accept it and move on.
We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark
The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.
The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox
It sucks that you guys can't get there on weekdays, but as half the posts in this topic have been saying that's a better time for the majority of people.. You're bailing with a sieve here, fella.
School kids are allowed to go to after school clubs by parents if they're scheduled. They freaking love having somewhere to send them once a week to get a quiet evening.
If neither of you can do this, find a third person who can, and then turn up an hour later.
Skinnereal wrote: My local club is Saturday afternoons. It is in a hired church hall.
I have not been able to make it along often recently, but it could have 6 tables out one week, and 2 people (including the keyholder) the next.
There was a point where new-but-regular clubbies wanted to help get more people along, but accidentally offended some of the super-secret (we didn't ask the right questions to get told) committee about it.
It's been pretty dead since.
Ideas from that included a policy of "we guarantee you a game" for new people, but that failed by the 3rd attempt.
We have a page on Facebook and a section of a forum, but people either cannot get on there to arrange games, or refuse to use them (for whatever reason).
And, it's the Summer. But, this Winter wasn't much better.
Anyway, good luck with it.
Is that the dream dealers club?
2016/08/10 09:35:56
Subject: Re:Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: We have no choice in the matter, as both the keyholders (myself and "R") both work late on weekdays. I've repeated this several times now.
Sunday afternoon/early evening is better than Saturday.
Something is obviously putting of the other group from attending. I presume that your premises are at least reasonably decent and fairly easy to get to?
I take it that you are Tabletop Newton Aycliffe? if so then its easy to google you at least.
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: We have no choice in the matter, as both the keyholders (myself and "R") both work late on weekdays. I've repeated this several times now.
Sunday afternoon/early evening is better than Saturday.
Something is obviously putting of the other group from attending. I presume that your premises are at least reasonably decent and fairly easy to get to?
I take it that you are Tabletop Newton Aycliffe? if so then its easy to google you at least.
Yes that's the one.
Transport shouldn't be too much of an issue for the other (all adult) group as they all car share, and I can give people lifts.
The community centre is on a major bus route that links to our town centre, and two other nearby towns/cities (Durham and Darlington).
2016/08/10 17:13:59
Subject: Re:Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
The other guy works a three shift pattern, and in 2 out of 3 weeks he's either sleeping or he's working. I work late, and don't get home till about 5.30pm. Thats not enough time to get showered and changed and collect my stuff to open up at 6pm. The other members of the club (who are all AWOL over summer) also have/had school or work commitments on weekdays. We made a group decision to switch to a Saturday night because that was the most convenient day for the majority of people.
We do however have a great deal of flexibility on a weekend. Currently we meet 6pm-10pm on a Saturday, but there are no regular groups scheduled on Saturdays and Sundays (just the occasional one-off birthday party or other events which tend to use the main hall, not our conference room), so we could switch to an earlier time on a Saturday.
Then you've answered your own problem. You're not going to be able to pull in many (if any) adults at the time and venue that you want to use. You might want to, but they're just going to keep going to the other one instead.
So the next thing to decide is whether or not you want to run a gaming club catering primarily to teenagers or not. It has the advantage that after two to three years, you'll probably have some fresh local blood that will continue to attend as adults. But to get it off the ground, you need to focus on getting word out at local sixth forms/colleges, adverts in local shops, and posters in spots where nerdy teenagers tend to accumulate.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/08/10 17:14:12
2016/08/10 19:44:24
Subject: Re:Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
That's been my conclusion, yes. We do have a club poster / flyer, but its pretty bland and uninspiring, so I've been meaning to get round to updating it somehow.
Does anyone have examples of their own club's flyers, posters, adverts etc that we could use for inspiration? One of our members is an artist and might do up a logo of sorts for us.
2016/08/10 20:00:01
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
Maybe it's because I don't have any sort of social or personal life outside of 40k, but I think you guys are crazy for saying Saturday is a bad time to game. I think that's the best time.
I mean, weeknights are busy because everyone's got work / skool in the morning, and sundays are the day everyone gets ready for the upcoming week, but Saturday is typically the day everyone, everywhere has off.
Maybe Friday night instead, if people feel that strongly against Saturday, but again, to call Saturday a 'bad' day to game sounds crazy.
Anyways. I and a couple other guys started up a 40k club around October of last year, and to be honest, for the first 6 months or so it was really slow. It was basically the same 3 or 4 people.
In the last couple of months, though, it's exploded like crazy. We have like 4 new players, in addition to several returning players, and we actually are in need of more tables at this point because we're usually hitting capacity.
I honestly don't know what to attribute that to. We have a FB page, and whenever I'd game at other places I'd mention that we're trying to get in Saturday night games, but tbh most of the people I recall mentioning it to haven't showed up.
So........I guess the takeaway is to give your club some time. Again, I have no idea exactly precipitated our odd explosion in players, but it definitely didn't happen overnight.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/08/10 20:00:46
"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment." Words to live by.
2016/08/10 20:09:04
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
Friday nights I can do, because I finish work at 12pm, 2.30pm or 4.30pm every Friday on a rota (as opposed to 5pm on every other day). But that still doesn't help the other keyholder, who works a 3 shift pattern.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/08/10 20:09:20
2016/08/10 22:50:16
Subject: Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
We were once so close to heaven, St. Peter came out and gave us medals; declaring us "The nicest of the damned".
“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”
2016/08/14 03:55:32
Subject: Re:Advice on generating interest and attendance in a gaming club?
LOL, funny reading this, just as I was about to buy more plastic crack I told my wife, getting a hooker would be a cheaper hobby lol.
Agies Grimm:The "Learn to play, bro" mentality is mostly just a way for someone to try to shame you by implying that their metaphorical nerd-wiener is bigger than yours. Which, ironically, I think nerds do even more vehemently than jocks.
Everything is made up and the points don't matter. 40K or Who's Line is it Anyway?
Auticus wrote: Or in summation: its ok to exploit shoddy points because those are rules and gamers exist to find rules loopholes (they are still "legal"), but if the same force can be composed without structure, it emotionally feels "wrong".
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