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After everything he's done, how is Kharn not a demon prince? This applies to all the special characters tied to each god really. Lucisus, Typhus, why havent they been elevated to demon prince status after 10,000 years of service? Ahriman I understand because he is still fulfilling his mission from Magnus, but to me the others, especially Kharn, really should be demon princes at this point.

You're asking why a CHAOS god is being a bit unfair?

Like abaddon they don't want to be and have resisted it. Khârn is more useful to khorne as a mortal champion as I imagine Typhus, Lucious are also for their respective god

Because Kharne doesn't want to be one, and because he is at his most lethal in his current form

because as a space marine and empowered by the dark gods he reaps a tally unmatched and can strike far easier at the impirum as a beserker.

A demon can be banished to the warp for a long period of time. A mortal champion can be brought back time and time again right after death.

Also, when you roll Dark Apotheosis, your character loses all their wargear...what could Kharn be without Gorechild?

Because Becoming a Daemon Prince would make his power wane the further he travels from the Eye of Terror, and he can be banished for a LONG time

The same Reason why Abbadon isnt a Daemon Prince

I've had the same thought myself a few times, for many of the Chaos characters.

The one explanation I can give, is the 1st War of Armageddon, when the demon primarch Angron led an invasion of Armageddon long before the Orks thought to give the place a kicking.

In the various retellings I've read, the Khornate force is comprised of demons and the bulk of the remaining World Eater legion. Mid-way through the campaign, with the Imperium on the back-heel and retreating all over, the invading army stops and starts building monuments to Chaos and Khorne.

This is highly unusual activity, for frothy berserker types to undertake. But, it proves vital to the invasion, as without these monuments to focus the warp the bulk of the demonic forces will fade away form demonic instability. And, because of the delay, the Imperium has time to regroup, bring in the Gray Knight's and banish Angron back to where he came from.

So, based on this, we know that Angron needs the mortal World Eater Legion forces (and presumably cultists and mutants) in his army to perform the rituals and build the structures that allow his end, so that the demonic legion can participate. Thus, mortal followers are as valuable, and possibly even more valuable, than demonic warriors.

I feel this helps explain the "dino-bot" explosion in the 6th ed Chaos codex too - After that defeat, Angron set his forges to work building demon engines, so that the demon would be bound to something tangible in the real world world, and not be so easily banished. It certainly lends some logic to the chaos super heavy being so mono-Khorne in design.

Once you become a Daemon Prince you are bound to the warp.

Kharn isn't ready to fight it off in the next realm when there are so many skulls to collect in this one.

Same reason Abaddon keeps refusing.

There is a tradeoff when becoming a Daemon Prince. You give up your humanity and lose control of your actions.

Also, some things are easier to accomplish when you are not a 20 foot tall target.

 Nightlord1987 wrote:
Once you become a Daemon Prince you are bound to the warp.

Kharn isn't ready to fight it off in the next realm when there are so many skulls to collect in this one.

Same reason Abaddon keeps refusing.

Yep Abaddon also refuse due the fact he's being interested in keep mostly the favour of all 4 chaos gods, and the four gods giving him blessings and benefits in an attempt to sway him to his side grant him more power than sticking to a single one.

Kharn it's also quite a singular figure i think he simply refuses or not seek daemonhood due seeing himself and is mortal body capable enough to face any enemy and beat him, why seek more power when your body and abilities are still more than enough to beat any challenge or enemy in the way?

If by any chance Kharn it's beaten down in some epic struggle against some other character in the future and he realizes he's finally reach his peak and cannot best his enemies despite giving it all to the fight i can see that pivotal moment where he would ask Khorne for more strength , more power to beat this enemy or die trying.

The same reason why pikachu still a pickachu ...

Because it fits the writers thats why

Eh. In the specific cases of Khârn and Lucius, is because they died. In Lucius's case, a whole bunch.
One you're dead, your soul merges with the warp, effectively becoming a teeny tiny daemon that most likely promptly gets gobbled up by one of the gods at which point it ceases to be an independent entity.
Occasionally, if they're paying attention, one of the gods will force your soul back into your body, creating a sort of possession which looks like life but isn't. It's also a lot more sustainable because you're a. not fighting the original inhabitant and b. are already an exact match, power and shape/form wise, with the host.
It's the same reason Valkia the Bloody isn't a daemon princess either.

Either way though, you're still a warp entity living in a meat puppet, rather than a living soul with the potential to grow beyond itself.

All you have to do is read betrayer to understand why Kharn doesn't want to be a Daemon Prince.

I feel like he followed his father into damnation and insantiy knowing it wouldn't end well but out of complete loyalty to Angron, he was the first Legionary to volunteer to get the butchers nails installed too. He was always speaking for angron to others, calming him down, making him see reason. I almost see them as an inverted father/son thing. Where the father is too old and broken to take care of himself anymore, and the son has to take over as the caregiver, but still suffers from many of the problems that his father does.

Eventually Angron becomes a Daemon Prince, and he's basically chained up in the basement of the World Eaters Flagship. And I think that Kharn saw this and drew a line, understanding that he was maybe the one last thing holding their entire legion together, and if he ascended too then everything would devolve into madness. Which it did anyway, but maybe he was just trying to prove a point at the time. He just had a short term goal of making it to the gates of terra, and after that it didn't matter anymore.

That and he's an eternal. He just keeps dying and coming back.

Tack on all the other stuff that everyone else said about being more effective by not tying yourself to the warp. All the same reasons Abaddon keeps refusing daemonhood. He still wants to make his own decisions, and you can't do that once you've ascended.

I don't know about Kharn, but in Abaddons case, it's the same reason why I dig the black legion. Succumbing to daemonhood means becoming a pawn, a powerful pawn, but a pawn nonetheless. Essentially you're a weak willed fool for giving in to daemonhood.
Abaddon couldn't achieve what he wants by ascending. He just can't do it without some daemonic help. He sees the gods as tools to further his goals and it seems to be working for him.
Both the emperor and horus achieved their godlike status without ascending either. And the empereror somehow even managed to flip the gods the bird big time while keeping all his might. In other words, if you have the willpower and drive to use warpfueled powers without giving in, the sky's the limit.
Abaddon sems to realize that too and it serves the gods just fine for the moment. They need him to lead both their mortal and daemonic forces into realspace.

Because Kharn does not want to be a daemon. His business is in the mortal realm, not in the warp. Warp creatures do not have skulls to take, after all.
That also goes for Abbadon, Typhus and other mortal followers of Chaos who arguably have performed greater deeds than most daemon princes out there (in the physical universe at least. We don't hear much about what deeds they perform in the constant wars in the Warp of course).

Because he is Kharn. Thats why.

Same reason why Abaddon is on his 13th black crusade; the Writers did a booboo because they didn't think through the implications of their choices.

This is also a case of a Voodoo Shark in that any further attempts at rationalizing it would just raise far more questions than it answers. If the writers thought it through, there would be no mortal special characters from any of the Traitor Legions; they'd all have ascended by now.

The Warhammer Fantasy characters work because they're all relatively new in terms of canon; they haven't been involved in the single greatest conflict to The Empire in the past and aren't ancient beyond all belief, so it's plausable that they're all still mortals (and Festus actually does ascend during the End Times) and simply haven't reach the point where they ascend. For the members of the original Traitor Legions, this is less believable and more of something we should just accept as a break from the reality.

He is immortal anyway, so what's the point? At least he experiences the slaughter as a man, with all of his senses. That's something probably.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
Same reason why Abaddon is on his 13th black crusade; the Writers did a booboo because they didn't think through the implications of their choices.

This is also a case of a Voodoo Shark in that any further attempts at rationalizing it would just raise far more questions than it answers. If the writers thought it through, there would be no mortal special characters from any of the Traitor Legions; they'd all have ascended by now.

The Warhammer Fantasy characters work because they're all relatively new in terms of canon; they haven't been involved in the single greatest conflict to The Empire in the past and aren't ancient beyond all belief, so it's plausable that they're all still mortals (and Festus actually does ascend during the End Times) and simply haven't reach the point where they ascend. For the members of the original Traitor Legions, this is less believable and more of something we should just accept as a break from the reality.

Good point about the legions, but it is possible to resist ascension. Staying mortal has it's benefits, so it's feasible that does with business in the real world would want to delay ascension as much as possible.
Most of the their exploits would also probably have taken place in the eye and I'm not certain those carry quite as much weight in the eye of the gods. Still the vast majority would probably have ascended, at least those that actually lived out most of those infamous 10000 years.

I know some space marines become daemons, but space marines are desirable followers to the chaos gods exactly because they are not daemons.

 Brutus_Apex wrote:
All you have to do is read betrayer to understand why Kharn doesn't want to be a Daemon Prince.

I feel like he followed his father into damnation and insantiy knowing it wouldn't end well but out of complete loyalty to Angron, he was the first Legionary to volunteer to get the butchers nails installed too. He was always speaking for angron to others, calming him down, making him see reason. I almost see them as an inverted father/son thing. Where the father is too old and broken to take care of himself anymore, and the son has to take over as the caregiver, but still suffers from many of the problems that his father does.

That's exactly the main point. Khârn is always described as a "Good guy" [all the good guy you can be in the heretic section] and his legion has been condemned to chaos not because their behavior, but his Father and the admiration/hate they feel against him. The World Eaters are aware that his primarch is broken even before his ascension (I strongly suggest you to read Betrayer for more info) and Khârn has doubted seriously about following Angron. The point is, when your father is corrupt, your "cousins" are corrupt (they're used to fight alongside the Word Bearers, for example) and your troops depend on you; because Khârn is probably the perfect example of a warrior that tries to put his duty before the Nail's whispers, he chooses to continue the Red Path not only because of the temptation of chaos, but his will to, even with this corruption, make a good legion out of the World Eaters.

...its just things not always work as you intend to. And being affected by Khorne + the Nails dont give you a "real" choice in battle. But Khârn is not happy of being in the "bad" side. He doesnt like to be "lost to the nails" (in fact, he has always fought against them) so if he doesn't embrace this way of life, not with his sentient part, he just can't be ascended as a daemon prince.

There is many tools needed in a tool belt. Kharn is a tool of khorne and fits his role perfectly there is no need to change it.

Dont fix things that arnt broke.

 WE Drake Man wrote:
Ahriman I understand because he is still fulfilling his mission from Magnus

What's the source for that?

Mellow wrote:

 WE Drake Man wrote:
Ahriman I understand because he is still fulfilling his mission from Magnus

What's the source for that?

I'm sure you can find it on Lex or 40k wiki but basically after The Rubric of Ahriman, Magnus was annoyed and banished Ahriman with the task of "learning the true nature of Tzeentch (which is basically impossible). So Ahriman probably wouldn't be eligible for deamon hood until he has fulfilled this mission.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
Same reason why Abaddon is on his 13th black crusade; the Writers did a booboo because they didn't think through the implications of their choices.

This is also a case of a Voodoo Shark in that any further attempts at rationalizing it would just raise far more questions than it answers. If the writers thought it through, there would be no mortal special characters from any of the Traitor Legions; they'd all have ascended by now.

Remember that times does not flow normally in the warp. It has been stated in the fluff many times and places (at work so can't pull up quotes) that while it has been 10,000 years in normal space, it may have only been a few decades for may of the leagios. Black Crusades could feel like every couple of years for them. Every time they vanishes into the warp, it could only be a few days of repair/recuperation before they is back and ready to fight again where in "normal" space it has been centuries.