Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hi everyone,

I'm looking for advices to build an army (1850pts) around Imperial Knights, probably 2-3 Cerastus Atrapos (favorite model!).
(I currently play a 150-man strong army of Renegades, but sometimes it's tedious to play..., but maybe I should just play a Greater Brass scorpion.)

So can the Imperial Knights be competitive, especially Cerastus Knights? What should I take to make good combos?

Thank you for your help!

Remember that, because of their rules regarding interaction with Codex: Imperial Knights, you will be limited to no more than 2 Atrapos in a Household Detachment, or 1 in an Oathsworn Detachment.

To fit two into a Household Detachment, you'll also be fielding (with max five Knights) 3 Gallants, which will leave you 5 points for upgrades; or two other Knights with between 130 and 330 points for upgrades.

Have you tried proxy imperial knights? They are highly competitive, though they need the little men for taking objectives.

You could do worse than ally in some eldar jetbikes, or SM scouts and TFC.

At 1850, fitting one Atropos in is a funny proposition, since it is ten points to expensive to allow a gallant to fit in nicely to make 750 points, and sacrificing an entire knight just to stuff an Atrapos in is no good.

I suppose you could do a pair of gallants, an Atrapos, and two wardens, but downgrading a knight to a gallant is a big hit on the firepower front.

In my gaming group, we interpret the restriction concerning Cerastus Knights («you may not have more Cerastus Knight-Atrapos in your army than you have Knights of other kinds») like in the ITC FAQ. So I can have 3 Atrapos and it's okay. But I see how one could read the rule as meaning : «Cerastus Knight-Atrapos may not constitute more than 50% of your Imperial Knights». In this case, I would take 3 different Cerastus I guess, which would cost about 1300 pts.

Has someone played a Cerastus before? Are they good or too expansive compared with a naked D-Knight?
Which formation or detachment is the best between the four available? The Household I guess?
Or should I use 2-3 Cerastus in 2-3 Iron hand CAD to have It will not die?

Is there a warlord trait from a special character somewhere in the Imperium that could combo well with Imperial Knights?

The reason why I'm not sure about Imperial Knights, is because D weapon can kill them easily on a 6. It's the same problem with any expensive target. And I'm not sure 3 knights can withstand two Tau or Eldar shooting phases either. And they will struggle against MSU army.

It can, but the odds are very low.

You're gambling, but a wraithknight's guns has about a 20% chance of a deathblow result per shooting phase. If it doesn't get one, the odds are you'll lose an average of one hull point - no big deal. The real problem is massed scatter lasers getting on your flanks (because your frontal armour AV13 can tank scatter laser fire indefinitely).

Is there a warlord trait from a special character somewhere in the Imperium that could combo well with Imperial Knights?

Not really, but (unsurprisngly) the Household Detachment's Knight Warlord warlord traits are good!

The Cerastus are very good, but specialised. The Knight-Castigator is the best crowd control unit and does a nice line in second-tier AA and probably the first one I'd look at. It's an upgrade to the Warden, more expensive but worth it.

The Acheron's potential for ranged destroyer hits is impressive....but ultimately is, again, relatively unlikely to deliver the Deathblow! result you're probably hoping for when buying it.

The Lancer......depends. If you expect to face wraithknights, kytans, or other knights, a Lancer is good. If you don't, it's probably not worth the (extreme) expense.

The Acheron's potential for ranged destroyer hits

What do you mean? I don't see ranged D attacks.

Sorry. Got it mixed up with the Atropos.

Acheron's a weird animal - a helstorm flamer combined with an anti-vehicle chainfist.

locarno24 wrote:
Sorry. Got it mixed up with the Atropos.

Acheron's a weird animal - a helstorm flamer combined with an anti-vehicle chainfist.

AP3 Helstorm Flamer, which makes it an anti-MEQ Knight.

SJ

A 5 knight list made it to the top 12 in a very competitive tournament in the UK and a 4 knight list with DE allies (4 x 3 units of Reavers) got to the top 10 at the ETC. They work because they're a good counter to riptide wing, daemons and kennel star (which themselves are good counters to Eldar).

But saying that, it really does depend on your local meta and match-ups, asking if a list is competitive isn't as straight forward as it used to be. I mean in 1 tournament you could face 5 Tau lists and come first, in another you could face 3 falcons and 3 units of fire dragons every match and come dead last.

I've been utilising an unusual knight list which is a tripartite lance formation + ultramarines libraries with tiggy then an inquisitorial detachment with some bodies to guard the conclave a servo skull inquisitor to counter scout and infiltrating culexus and coteaz for extra mastery levels and re-roll seize or force my opponent to re-roll his and a couple of henchmen units with pyskers. The big thing is the tripartite lance which makes them a unit meaning pysker buffs affect all 3 (invis phase form etc etc)

Thank you all for the good suggestions.
I don't know yet what I'll do.

P.S.
I contacted FW on their Facebook page about the Cerastus number restriction, and it is not like ITC has ruled. They said for example that I cannot take an Imperial Knight detachment consisting of only just one Cerastus.

3 Imperial Knights in 1 unit (Specific Detachment/Formation)

Tiggy and 2 Friends (Libby Conclave)

3 Heralds (Space Wolf Formation)
-Iron Priest, Rune Priest, Wolf Priest joined as 1 unit, loss of IC)

Heralds protect Libbies. Libbies roll for Phase Form.

Heralds provide a reroll to see who deploys first and seizes on a 5+. If the Knights buff up and go first, you win. If not, the game gets slightly harder but there aren't much lists out there that can hurt 13/13/13 4++ from across the table.

This was a "popular" list at Nova. There were 2 of them floating in the top50. 1 in the 2nd Bracket (17-32th place) and 1 in the 3rd Bracket (33-48th). Out of 140+ participants.

 RenegadeKorps wrote:
Thank you all for the good suggestions.
I don't know yet what I'll do.

P.S.
I contacted FW on their Facebook page about the Cerastus number restriction, and it is not like ITC has ruled. They said for example that I cannot take an Imperial Knight detachment consisting of only just one Cerastus.

That's probably because ITC is neither FW nor GW, with crowd sourced rulings based on balancing the game play for tournaments.

SJ

 RenegadeKorps wrote:
Thank you all for the good suggestions.
I don't know yet what I'll do.

P.S.
I contacted FW on their Facebook page about the Cerastus number restriction, and it is not like ITC has ruled. They said for example that I cannot take an Imperial Knight detachment consisting of only just one Cerastus.

You should post that email. I;m sure a lot of people would want to see it.