Is the Baal Strike Force still viable?

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**Krusha**

In the new Angel's Blade book, you've obviously got two "Decurion" style lists - Angel's Blade and Lost Brotherhood.

Lost Brotherhood looks effective but spammy. I want a more balanced army with a mix of units, but Angel's Blade forces you to take a lot of "tax" stuff with no obsec.

Is a Baal Strike Force, or even a CAD (perhaps with one of the new formations alongside) still a viable build, or am I destined for a krumping?

**Slayer-Fan123**

Was Baal Strike Force even viable in the first place? Nope.

CAD with supporting formations will be the way to run the army more...competitively.

**Krusha**

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Was Baal Strike Force even viable in the first place? Nope.

CAD with supporting formations will be the way to run the army more...competitively.

My understanding (prior to Angel'e Blade) was that, while BA were low tier in any event, if you had to choose, red thirst > obsec.

**diepotato47**

Baal Strike Force is great, just make sure you make the most of that 1+ Initative. I always use BSF over the CAD

**Martel732**

Obj sec is still much better than red thirst. That +1 init is not nearly as good as it was in 5th.

**koooaei**

It's not an obvious choice. +1 ini can mean a lot - especially if you face something like ravenwing with their i4 rending hammers. Even vs eldar, you could now hope to finish off the wraithknight in melee before those i5 s10 strikes thin your ranks. You also get 4 elite slots in bsf. So, you could run 2 dreads, 2 dc. On the other hand, an obsec pod is very frustrating to deal with and can win a game on it's own.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Regarding Death Company, they got their own formation. 4 Elite Slots isn't much of a plus when you realize that. Plus there's the Stern/Vanguard formation. Yeah, not much of a bonus.

Also remember Black Knights will likely be charging you first because that's how they roll (and then when you charge you lost a bunch of dudes because TL BS2 Plasma Guns everywhere).

Also what guy is killing a Wraithknight before it strikes in that situation?

**koooaei**

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Also what guy is killing a Wraithknight before it strikes in that situation?

Anything in the ba codex has a chance of stripping that last wound down.

**Martel732**

Black knights always get a visit from Mr. Fragnought, though. I can't think of many cases where +1 init would have meant a thing compared to obj sec.

**Slayer-Fan123**

koooaei wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Also what guy is killing a Wraithknight before it strikes in that situation?

Anything in the ba codex has a chance of stripping that last wound down.

That's still not answering my question. Anything wounding him with a decent chance is going to be I1 without rolling literally everything on Biomancy, at which point you're better off with the new powers to strip wounds or support dudes.

**Dantes_Baals**

Libby dreadnought with force javelin.

In answer to the OPs, question, I don't think the BSF was ever viable. Especially in a competitive situation. The only reason I ever took it was for the extra elites slot, but now that we have AA Sanguine wing (1st coy armory) and the DC formation it's a moot point. Initiative was never a BA problem. Hitting on 4s, and wounding on 4s or higher all day long was (i. And that is IF you make it to CC. To top it all off, if you run MSU, BSF will probably hurt as much, if not more than it helps.

**peirceg**

Grav weapons force the hard things down to ini 1 anyways.

**Remtek**

Another good advantage with CAD is 4 rolls on strategic with veritas.

**th3maninblak**

If you're not running the Archangels demi company (which I feel may be a sleeper hit for the ability to get all the drop pods in your army turn 1) or the Lost Brotherhood, a CAD is the way to go. It lets you take characters that give you army manipulation like Karlean or anyone with the Veritas Vitae, and has the bonus of ObSec. If you want the +1 init, go for the LBSF instead.