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I’m seeing an interesting trend in my local meta. In the past we’ve had lots of tough death stars, and now I’m seeing people run a large, durable tarpit unit(s) to soak up the comparatively low volume of attacks – think large groups of 4+ Ork Boyz with a few select force-multipler HQs.

To to get ahead of the curve I’m trying to develop a list to fight both styles, the death star and the tarpit mob. Playing C:SM, this is what I’ve come up with so far.

Chaos Space Marines (1850 points)
Black Crusade Detachment

Core – The Lost and the Damned
9x Chaos Cultists, 1x Chaos Cultist Champion
9x Chaos Cultists, 1x Chaos Cultist Champion
9x Chaos Cultists, 1x Chaos Cultist Champion
9x Chaos Cultists, 1x Chaos Cultist Champion
1x Dark Apostle – Mark of Khorne, Sigil of Corruption, VotLW, The Black Mace

Auxiliary – Cult of Destruction
1x Obliterator – Mark of Nurgle
1x Obliterator – Mark of Nurgle
1x Obliterator – Mark of Nurgle
1x Warpsmith

Auxiliary – Fist of the Gods
1x Chaos Land Raider – Dozer Blade
1x Chaos Predator – Lascannon Sponsons, Twin-Linked Lascannon
3x Chaos Vindicators – Combi-bolter, Seige Shield, Daemonic Possession, Linebreaker Bombardment
1x Warpsmith – Mark of Khorne, Aura of Dark Glory, Axe of Blind Fury, Warlord

Auxiliary – Veterans of the Legions
4x Khorne Berserkers, 1x Khorne Berserker Champion – Chainaxes, Icon of Wrath, VotLW, Power Fist (Champion)


So here’s my thinking – the Vindicators work as a squadron to hit things that will threaten my primary death star. They’ll have the linebreaker bombardment to wreckjinking bikes. I’m hoping to really do some damage here and I’ll be relying on their AV13 and 6++ to protect them long enough to get their shots off.

The bare-bones warpsmith is just there to stand next to obliterators and improve their shooting, and to act as a backfield defender. I’ll group him with a cultist unit. The other three cultists units will be on the backfield and may attempt to move up into mid for objective grabbing. I’m relying on their ability to come back on a 4+ to hold my backfield along with the oblits and predator.

I’ll set up my deathstar with the 5 berserkers, 1 warpsmith, and the dark apostle. The offense they’ll be able to put out is really crazy. The unit gets zealot from the apostle and furious charge from the icon.

While his WS is awful and won’t be able to stand up against WS5+, the warpsmith with the daemon weapon on the charge will be throwing out 9 to 13 (w/ zealot) S7 AP2 attacks with a 1/6 chance of whiffing everything. This warpsmith is also from the fist of the gods formation, so he will be repairing the land raider on the way to assaulting enemies and provides the 6++ bubble for the vindicators.

The apostle will be similarly powerful, dishing out 7 to 11 (w/ zealot) fleshbane AP4 attacks that have a chance to remove additional models from the cursed rule. His WS5 makes him second in line to take challenges.

The four berserkers with chainaxes will get 16 attacks total (w/ zealot) on the charge, all at WS5 S5 AP4.

The berserker champion (first in line to eat challenges) brings a powerfist as a failsafe to hurt things that aren’t ideal for this unit to be in combat with. The powerfist’s 25 points may be better spent elsewhere.

I was considering swapping out the berserkers for mutilators. If so, then the backfield warpsmith would go in the land raider as well to boost their attacks, leaving the obliterators on their own. My knee-jerk reaction to the mutilators is to say they’re terrible, but doubling their attacks may mean they’re worth taking in this specific situation. Thoughts?

..Are you calling 5 bezerkers a death star?

Also is CSM, C:SM is a different thing.

The list looks decent enough for the new detachment, but I can't see anything particularly competitive about it,

Captyn_Bob wrote:
..Are you calling 5 bezerkers a death star?

Also is CSM, C:SM is a different thing.

The list looks decent enough for the new detachment, but I can't see anything particularly competitive about it,

Whoops, C:SM fixed in title now.

I'll agree with Bob-that's not a Death Star. That's barely a min-star.

 JNAProductions wrote:
I'll agree with Bob-that's not a Death Star. That's barely a min-star.

Hey, if you guys think renaming it to "expensive group of units dedicated to wiping out large blobs of infantry that are themselves designed to slow down deathstars" will cut down on the obvious confusion, I'll change it.

I like to think of them as hammers. It'll kill one unit, (if it gets there) but then
..
It will be destroyed. A lot of points invested in something with no durability

The Lost and the Damned is sunk cost. Putting upgrades on the Dark Apostle is not a good idea, you want him helping them hold the line, not actually getting him into combat.

If you're going to Anti-Deathstar, you need some sort of Psychic Ability. With no Psychic defense, you're gonna get roasted by lists with multiple psykers spamming overlapping resiliency. In this list the only way you have a chance to get through their resiliency is if you go first, and even then, you've got one shot, don't miss.

Berserkers are trash, jettison them. Pick up Spawn, they will basically be the same cost with double the resiliency and they'll actually make it into combat.

The Predator will be working hard and not gaining it's points back -- psykers will help it reach the value required.

There is nothing in your list that is even remotely threatening to Deathstars, let along Anti Deathstars.

200pts or more wasted on Warpsmiths -- that's almost 10% on a unit that will do almost nothing all game.

rusty4tw wrote:
200pts or more wasted on Warpsmiths -- that's almost 10% on a unit that will do almost nothing all game.

Through playtesting the Cult of Destruction I can attest that this formation looks cool as hell, but in all practicality sucks. The special rule only allows you to fire one unit of Obliterator's weapons twice. So if you're min squadding them, you get 1 extra shot per shooting phase. If you try and do 3 in one unit and two units of 1 you're sinking a lot of points into firing 3 extra shots.

Even as a fluffy list, this is a bad list. If you're bringing cultists, bring in some artillery and armor. 5 berzerkers are not going to do anything at all. They will never make it to their target, even if it is just a squad of guardsmen. There's nothing in this list that is a threat to anything but another fluffy list. Not trying to sound mean, but it seems like you are trying to make something work with just the models that you have. And that's fine, but don't call it an anti deathstar