Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Heavily looking at getting into 30k and the Death Guard are catching my eye (also I want to do Nurgle in AOS and, when it's revamped, 40k so Nurgle body and soul across games). Are they decent? I have no experience with 30k at all and only a single game within recent memory of 40k.

What would be a good way to begin for collecting the XIVth? I'm going to get either Calth or Prospero (not quite sure which yet) and Death Guard helmets/shoulderpads (probably skip the chestplates) from Forgeworld for certain, maybe a unit of Grave Warden Terminators because they look cool (not sure what I'll do with the regular Terminators in either box), but I have no idea what to do from there. Other than eventually getting Mortarion (and maybe Typhon) I'd rather avoid any special characters so I can make my own and create my own story.

What else should I look at getting first to have a decent, if small, army to start to play? From what I recall of their fluff they are mainly footslogging so I'm not going to worry too much about vehicles (might add a tank or something for support later down the road)

If going by fluff mk3 Prospero vest for geberal armour of mk4 bac

General guidelines for Death Guard, from a fluff perspective -

-Mortarion was VERY big on the strategy of being a generalist - troops prepared for every scenario, seamlessly changing function to perform tasks that are required of them; Death Guard were not big on transports, rather favoring a scorched earth/slow march tactic, often fighting wars of attrition
----In game relevance: tactical squads should nearly always be large (15-20 man, with apothecary), foot slogging, and with extra close combat weapons
-Mortarion loved terminators and dreadnoughts, as they represent the pinnacle of an individual warrior's strengths on the battlefield
----In game relevance: terminators and dreadnoughts are a fluffy choice for death guard; it's pretty hard to go wrong with any pattern; castaferrum dreads (boxnoughts) are even worthwhile, though I'd stick to taking this in zone mortalis games because they die very easily on the open field; contemptor, leviathan, and deredeo dreads are always good choices
-Death guard make frequent use of vindicators
----In game relevance: take a vindicator squadron; I personally prefer the laser destroyer array for a good/fluffy tank buster, but its hard to go wrong with a S10 AP2 large blast
-Mortarion favored the use of chemical and biological weapons (met with disdain from many other primarchs because of this)
----In game relevance: PHOSPHEX IS YOUR FRIEND. It's a big cheesy to spam, so be tasteful - take a few quad launchers with phosphex cannisters, or a medusa or two with phosphex shells (you'll need a siege breaker consul to unlock the phosphex rounds); also consider a primaris with phosphex bombs (I personally love these because you can take kraken missiles also, which absolutely wreck anything with an AV); destroyer squads were also used frequently - their rad missile launcher is a great choice, the sarge can take phosphex bombs, and they have a lot of good options...currently a little overcosted IMO, but you can make them work; to my knowledge, you probably shouldn't take them with jump packs, for fluff accuracy; taking chem munitions (shred) on all of your flamers is a great idea - they get hot, but with apothecaries or 2+ saves, you're usually fine, and they generate a metric crap ton of wounds

You definitely need death shroud terminators; striking at S5 AP2 at I3 is nearly impossible to beat (note: firedrakes are terrifying, and will eat your death shroud frequently); if you take rad grenades (with the reaping ROW),you're wounding on 2's, and they can swing ALOT. For that matter, most of your special characters should favor a scythe over a power fist, IMO. Death shroud can actually be used as an HQ squad themselves, as a retinue for an HQ, or as an elite choice. They're incredibly flexible, and are really gnarly. They also have inbuilt hand flamers (with chem munitions), which makes them a real bitch to charge. In their tartaros pattern armor, they can sweeping advance, which is great.

Grave wardens are also really great; assault 2 blast weapons @ poison 3+ or assault 2 S6 shooting lets you chew through infantry and light armor very effectively; they're also the only cataphractii that can overwatch due to their special pattern of armor with a built-in poison 3+ template shooting attack. You can also use this when you're close up on people and firing your other weapons as well. This gives them a lot of resilience and makes them a terrifying prospect to charge. March them up the field, or throw them in a Spartan with your character and watch them splat people across the board.

I could go on and on, but that's a good starting point.

what zoidberg said.

20-man tactical squads w/ apothecary and extra CCWs are the single most fluffy DG unit you can bring.
dreads and terminators everywhere
LOTS of MK III (DG were attrition fighters, as such we used lots of the more 'heavily armoured" MK III instead of MK IV.

Deathshroud are absolutely amazing, and arguably one of the better beatstick squads in the game.
grave Wardens are arguably one of the best terminator squads in the game (can overwatch, can basically hurt everything, can mulch tarpits in shooting and can wound most primarchs and MCs like nothing)

Hmm so definitely need to think of the armor, I'm seeing different things from different people (some say MkIII is preferred because it was more heavily armored, some say MkIV because Horus made sure the legions going rogue were equipped with the best, one person at my GW said MkV because of the studded plates, which also seems to come on MkIV). However, the FW kit will largely make them look Death Guard regardless.

But I do like the idea of big blobs of 20 guys with extras, implacably advancing across the battlefield. That's a pretty cool image.

Have to say I was kinda on the fence of Death Guard originally; it was either going to be Iron Warriors or Sons of Horus but painting Iron Warriors was the most boring thing ever, and SoH while I love the colors something about they seemed "off", like they came off too much like uncouth barbarians (which they kind of are haha) and then with the Nurgle temptation I felt elsewhere... but the more I read about the Death Guard style and fluff, the more they seem really damn cool.

Wayniac wrote:
Hmm so definitely need to think of the armor, I'm seeing different things from different people (some say MkIII is preferred because it was more heavily armored, some say MkIV because Horus made sure the legions going rogue were equipped with the best, one person at my GW said MkV because of the studded plates, which also seems to come on MkIV).

But I do like the idea of big blobs of 20 guys with extras, implacably advancing across the battlefield. That's a pretty cool image.

Have to say I was kinda on the fence of Death Guard originally; it was either going to be Iron Warriors or Sons of Horus but painting Iron Warriors was the most boring thing ever, and SoH while I love the colors something about they seemed "off", like they came off too much like uncouth barbarians (which they kind of are haha) and then with the Nurgle temptation I felt elsewhere... but the more I read about the Death Guard style and fluff, the more they seem really damn cool.

the thing with the armour is this:

Horus made sure that his traitor legions had first dibs, but that doesn't mean that they always used them. Iron Warriors and DG both had access to and used (like all legions) MK IV, however they did not prefer it because MK III was more heavily armored in the front and was MUCH easier to build and maintain, which is why it was the favorite for legions like DG, Iron warriors, Iron Hands, etc.
the studs on MK IV look cool, but are just a testament to the fact that it was not as well armored as legions like DG and IW would prefer.

True. Have to give it thought as money is also going to be something I need to think of, as I'm not rich enough to go full bore with stuff

Go with what you like or mix and match. I personally prefer Mk IV armor, but will pick up a lot of Mk III with the new Prospero set. I'll have mixed III and IV in my army.

 Ifurita wrote:
Go with what you like or mix and match. I personally prefer Mk IV armor, but will pick up a lot of Mk III with the new Prospero set. I'll have mixed III and IV in my army.

Mixed is what I'm thinking, with the FW upgrade kits. Like half and half of a squad with each mark. I can't find anything saying that one mark would be favored over another (e.g. like a veteran would prefer MkIII over MkIV).

My poor wallet after this

Go with BaC (30 x Mk IV marines) and Burning of Prospero (30 x Mk III marines). Great kits with 5 x termies in both + characters + extras. Cheaper than FW kits, unless you want to buy lots of shoulder pads.

With the prospero set, I'm going to use the MK3 to flesh out the rest of my tacticals (would like 3 x20 squads) and use the rest for vets. I have a cool idea for some of them - probably 10 or 15 will be painted as vets with the green and white chipping away to reveal grey and maroon to represent former Dusk Raiders. That way I can use them as loyalists when I take Rask (or for a shattered legions list), or just as a cool vet unit in regular games.

Brennon - any experience using breachers with DG? I really want some, so I can take graviton (though, not very fluffy, I know, but I figured one squad wouldn't be pushing it), but not sure how well they'd function with the rest of my DG

Chapter Master Zoidberg wrote:
With the prospero set, I'm going to use the MK3 to flesh out the rest of my tacticals (would like 3 x20 squads) and use the rest for vets. I have a cool idea for some of them - probably 10 or 15 will be painted as vets with the green and white chipping away to reveal grey and maroon to represent former Dusk Raiders. That way I can use them as loyalists when I take Rask (or for a shattered legions list), or just as a cool vet unit in regular games.

Brennon - any experience using breachers with DG? I really want some, so I can take graviton (though, not very fluffy, I know, but I figured one squad wouldn't be pushing it), but not sure how well they'd function with the rest of my DG

I like 'em! Since they got cheaper with the new book (stop at 15 breachers for best value). Durrable, shoot like tacticals, and take away charge bonuses!

This a great thread, I'm starting up some Death Guard, and I really appreciate the tips. I'm new to 30k so it's great to get a good start.

Just to jump on, I am also thinking about starting DG for a 30k army. The scythes are just too awesome to resist.

So... I guess I have a few questions. Mind you, I do not have any books for it yet, so I have no idea what I'm doing. I'm still trying to make the decision of if this is actually something I want to do or not.

How many points is a typical pick-up game list? Is 2000 or 2500 more common?

I only really intend to have one list of however many points a typical pick-up is. What sorts of lists do you guys run?

I like the foot-slogging army idea with lots of tacs, apothecaries, termies, and dreads. How viable is that? Does it have any major weaknesses other than being super slow? What kind of army list would be the best for that? (I am kicking around the idea of picking up the Prospero box for the 30 MkIII tacs as a starting point.) Other than dreadnoughts and *maybe* droppods, I kind of want to avoid tanks.

Is it considered not ok to run a Primarch regularly? Because I love Mortarion's model and want to base my list around him.

Sorry for so many questions.

 Red_Ink_Cat wrote:
Just to jump on, I am also thinking about starting DG for a 30k army. The scythes are just too awesome to resist.

So... I guess I have a few questions. Mind you, I do not have any books for it yet, so I have no idea what I'm doing. I'm still trying to make the decision of if this is actually something I want to do or not.

How many points is a typical pick-up game list? Is 2000 or 2500 more common?

I only really intend to have one list of however many points a typical pick-up is. What sorts of lists do you guys run?

I like the foot-slogging army idea with lots of tacs, apothecaries, termies, and dreads. How viable is that? Does it have any major weaknesses other than being super slow? What kind of army list would be the best for that? (I am kicking around the idea of picking up the Prospero box for the 30 MkIII tacs as a starting point.) Other than dreadnoughts and *maybe* droppods, I kind of want to avoid tanks.

Is it considered not ok to run a Primarch regularly? Because I love Mortarion's model and want to base my list around him.

Sorry for so many questions.

1) 2,500
2) My lists range from: terminator spam, to phosphex spam, to well balanced infantry lists. My only real common factor is lots of foot sloggers
3) Very viable. The single most fluffy unit for DG is 20 tac marines w/ extra CCWs and an apothecary. 21 bodies with a 3+ /5+++ is nothing to sneeze at. And terminators are amazing, and work better then more you end up bringing
4) Yes it is fine to regularly run a primach, so long as you're playing over 2,000 points and/or are using the primarch's chosen right of war.

The way 30k is priced, 2,500 seems closer to 1850 in 40k (also IIRC it lets you take a Lord of War > 2k, which is typically around 400+ points themselves).

So for me, what I think I'm going to do is get at least one and maybe two boxes (Prospero is pre-ordered and I'll pick it up tomorrow; I might get Calth so I have an armor mix, since no single legion had all of one mark).

Not sure what I want to go from after that; special/heavy weapons seems likely.

Rough ideas are:

Typhon or generic Praetor
Siege Breaker Consul

2x 15 or 20-man Tactical Squad w/CCWs and Apothecary
Tactical Support Squad (5 or 10) with Flamers (Chem)
Tactical Support Squad (5 or 10) with Meltas

3x Quad Mortars w/Phosphex

1-2 Vindicators (Probably laser)

Really I have to wait for my red books to arrive so I can really plan it out, but I know I want the "core" to be large units of troops, and then support them with flamers and meltas along with some artillery and a tank or two to act as tank destroyers.

Everything brennon said.

I'm gonna go ahead and also advocate for more dreadnoughts. Very DG fluffy and very effective. Leviathan dreadnoughts are insanely useful and eat anything they get close to (can also take phsophex...!). Deredeos are also awesome. I've been wanting to run one with the invuln booster next to a 10 strong squad of grave wardens and laugh as the bullets bounce off of me; though, just the anvillus pattern autocannon is a very solid choice to have parked in back. TL S8 sunder is extremely effective for breaking armor/shaving off HPs and the ability to intercept/skyfire against nuisance flyers makes it a really good unit. Contemptor mortis with kheres also very good for this purpose.

I have only played Zone Mortalis missions thus far with my Death Guard (though, I have about 5000 points modeled and ready to go at this point) and they've been insanely effective. Granted, DG shine in ZM, but still..! All of the list building I find myself doing tries to balance vehicles and infantry. I think I'm just still resistant to the idea of footslogging SO MANY bodies up the board with all of the insane gak that gets lobbed around in 30k. I think the fluff will win, however, and i'll be mostly infantry, with some vehicle support a la laser vindicators/land raiders/medusa/Spartan.

I HIGHLY recommend investing in 1-3 quad launchers. Phosphex cannisters and shatter shells (I think - those are the S8 sunder ones, yeah?) are an insanely good combination to be able to choose between turn by turn.

I'll also say that I got a primaris lightning strike fighter and absolutely plan to use it. Dropping phosphex and haywire cargo prior to firing some of those kraken missiles (i.e. melta missiles) just gets my jimmies all kinds of rustled.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I'd honestly nix the melta squad for a heavy support squad with missile launchers, though. Melta is easily countered in 30k (lots of armoured ceramite floating around) and foot slogging meltas is a very quick way to be focus-fired down. If you have a squad of missile launchers posted up in cover, you can stick your siege breaker with them to give them tank hunter/wrecker.

So I got my Prospero set yesterday and in a bout of amazing luck someone at the shop offered to trade me Typhon and 4 Deathshroud Terminators for the Sisters of Silence, so I'm going to get a commander and bodyguard next week

Grave Wardens are very good in ZM

Doubt we'll ever play Zone Mortalis, the GW doesn't have the board and I don't think any of us are going to drop like 700 on buying it.