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My main question with all these marks of armour is their use through out 30k but more importantly 40k.

I understand cataphractii was the first and is very bulky and cumbersome.

It seems like the tartaros is the best of all?? I understand that indomitable is the most common now because of the pattern still being held by key forge worlds. However I am curious if chapters still have cataphractii or tartaros and if tartaros, as it seems to me it is, is better than the other 2?

any info or views are welcome!!!

Remember that this kind of fluff is always dictated/directed by figures/models/sales. If you can't produce something, it normally isn't mentioned (outside of a passing glance) in the fluff. Short of old artwork, older terminator armour was never produced in models (except the old RT fellas).

Could you magically now see some new Chaos plastics for 40K showing up in Tartaros suits etc? Sure. Because now it's something GW produces. Chaos would actually be far more likely to show up with these suits (honestly if I did a Chaos army for 40K I'd use solely 30K plastics because it's more fluffy in my mind).

Knowing the way 40K works I'd imagine that yes you can use any 30K stuff --- oh it was hidden in a vault on a forgotten world, blah blah blah.

Well they have given 40k rules for cataphractii so there must be some

Oldmike wrote:
Well they have given 40k rules for cataphractii so there must be some

There are, but they are very rare, for example, the only character in 40k, that i know of, that even has tartaros armor, is abadon, and even then he does not have rules for it.

Its like contemptor dreadnoughts, very VERY rare, and even the original legion chapters they are rare.

There are, but they are very rare, for example, the only character in 40k, that i know of, that even has tartaros armor, is abadon, and even then he does not have rules for it.

Do you have a source for that ? Because his 30k model is a Cataphractii and his 40k model clearly is an Indomitus pattern.

Engrenages wrote:

There are, but they are very rare, for example, the only character in 40k, that i know of, that even has tartaros armor, is abadon, and even then he does not have rules for it.

Do you have a source for that ? Because his 30k model is a Cataphractii and his 40k model clearly is an Indomitus pattern.

Unless changed later in the lore, during the fight between him and loken it mentioned that he was in the tartaros pattern, but loken was still faster then him.

It probably ended up being a wopesidasy

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-GB/Asterion-Moloc-and-Ivanus-Enkomi-of-the-Minotaurs

Aterion Moloc has custom Tartaros, and it's speculated (I cant remember exactly) that the Minotaurs themselves have easier access to full suits of it as well as MK8 Errant armor.

Well if you go by rules Tartaros is superior to Indomitus - it's identical other than having superior mobility.

Tartaros vs Cataphractii is apples vs oranges, the latter may be slow but it still has offers superior protection, making it argueably better in the iconic Terminator role of a stand-off shooty unit, whilst the former is better for assault Terminators.

Regarding availability:
"..Even so, in the armouries of many of the Adeptus Astartes ancient suits of Cataphractii armour still exist" ~ Cataphractii Terminator squad entry in Angels of Death.

"..they commonly field the bulk of their 1st company Veterans as Terminators in combat, again with widespread access to rarer patterns of wargear such as Tartaros and Arkonak Tactical Dreadnought Armour patterns, and wargear seldom found outside the hands of the honoured chapters of the 1st Founding such as squadrons of Storm Eagle gunships and ancient Spartan assault tanks." Minotaurs fluff section in Imperial Armour 12, salient point: Tartaros is *not* restricted to the first founding.

It all realy just depends on your head cannon. I've been building up tartars and cataphactii units for my ultramarines. using the excuse that a lot of the "40k" terminator armour was destroyed with the loss of the first company to the Nids forcing them to pull ancient relic suits out of the armoury, and letting me mix and match my terminators