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I personally play Grey Knights and Eldar so if you tips specific for them by all means post them.

In general though, what are good ways to deal with lists made from these factions? I am seeing more of them after Nova. My army semis to get rolled by a Biomancy/Invisibility spamming Cyclopia Cabal backed by 4-6 Earthshakers/Medusae and 6-9 Lascannons with zombie bubblewrap and a wyvern or two.

The only thing I can think of so far is to null deploy and hope for a major alpha strike via drop pod, Wulfen or Sanguinary Guard, but that's putting quite a few eggs in on basket I think.

Anyone have some advice for combating these factions? Post it here!

lmfao! you need help beating CSM?

play yo eldar with scat bikes and wraith knights and warp spyders and you insta win!

Wraith Knight can stomp invisible cabal. Scat bikes have so many shots to fish for 6s to hit invisible.

cant warp spyders deepstrike into his artillery?

Warps can deep strike if there's anywhere to land. The Earth shakers make a circle (4-6), which is then surrounded by plague zombies (I've seen lists with anywhere from 40-100) and the 6-9 lascannons sprinkled around the out edges. Trying to land too deep into this is basically promising a mishap in my experience.

The Wraithknight and Cabal just seems so luck based. Since all the Sorcs have Force weapons each wound is 1d3 wounds and blocks Feel No Pain. Surviving to the stomps is the trouble. The expendables traveling with the Sorcs eat the Wraiths own melee, then there's decent odds he gets drowned I'm Force wounds before Stomping.

The Earthshakers usually wipe the Scat bikes since they're AP 3 and have range the size of the table. Even jinking I still lose a lot to pie plates.

Force Swords can't hurt the Wriath Knight.

Force Staves can hurt on 6s, but allow armour saves.

Force Axes are the best-hurting on 6s, ignoring armour-but are Unwieldy.

In addition, that's a lot of Warp Charges going to Force. Not nearly as many for good buffs.

If he's running the Sorcerers in a single unit, Force buffs the entire unit. Chances are he's also using Hammerhand on the unit, and they're probably hiding in a discount unit of Spawn.

Nightspinners are tailor-made for killing Artillery due to monofilament, and Spiders can do the same once they get in range. The main challenge will be getting through the Plague Zombie bubblewrap. With Fortune, it may be in his favor to use Assault with Spiders, just to force the Plague Zombies to Pile in the wrong way and open up an avenue of attack with Hit&Run. Or you could always be cheeky and do Wraithguard/blades with a Shadowseer and break out Veil of Tears...

I don't think Force affects the whole unit, but I'm away from my book at the moment and can't check. (If I'm wrong... That doesn't really affect me. I rarely use Force as-is.)

Anyway, Hammerhand runs a big risk of periling if he uses more than one die (1/6 chance with 2 dice, 4/9 with 3 dice) and still only lets him wound on 6s (Swords), 5s (Axes), or 4s (Staves).

So, assuming he gets Force and Hammerhand active with 1) Axes or 2) Staves, he deals...

1) Hitting on 3s (2/3), wounding on 5s (2/9), possibly a 5+ Invuln (4/27) times 2 for d3 wounds apiece (4/9 or 8/27) requires (54/4=13.5, 162/8=20.25) 13.5 attacks, or 20.25 with a 5+ Invuln. That is, admittedly, only 4 Sorcerers on the charge (2 attacks base, +1 for Pistol and CCW, +1 for charge) but they're probably all 170 points apiece (ML 3, Spell Familiar, Bike) AND assumes they all survive, which is unlikely. (4 Attacks, hitting on 4s for 2 hits, wounding on 2s for 2 wounds (probably allowing an Invuln, which will increase the Sorcerer's cost EVEN MORE) for 1 or 2 dead, depending on Invulns.)

2) Is even worse. Hitting on 3s (2/3), wounding on 4s (1/3), 3+ armour (1/9) times 2 for d3 wounds apiece (2/9) requires (54/2=27) a whopping 27 attacks, or 7 Sorcerers charging.

Oh, and if they use Axes, they can't even avoid Stomps, since they both happen at I1.

So if they kill your ~300 point model with 850 points worth of Sorcerers... You're probably fine.

What is this? I cant even...

Eldar player is having trouble beating CSM with some RH artillery?

With eldar you literrally have 30wc to cancel out his 15wc.

Does his artillery have ignore cover? cuz you can still jink with the scat bikes to laugh at his ap3. Most barrage is not ap3 and is low str.

Isnt Draigo star better than Cabal Star?

 MagicJuggler wrote:
If he's running the Sorcerers in a single unit, Force buffs the entire unit. Chances are he's also using Hammerhand on the unit, and they're probably hiding in a discount unit of Spawn.

Nightspinners are tailor-made for killing Artillery due to monofilament, and Spiders can do the same once they get in range. The main challenge will be getting through the Plague Zombie bubblewrap. With Fortune, it may be in his favor to use Assault with Spiders, just to force the Plague Zombies to Pile in the wrong way and open up an avenue of attack with Hit&Run. Or you could always be cheeky and do Wraithguard/blades with a Shadowseer and break out Veil of Tears...

Force does buff the whole unit. I remember well from my Grey Knights.

Nightspinners are something I hadn't thought of! Thank you!

To address other comments in the thread, I usually see them rolling on Biomancy or Telepathy rather than risking Sanctic. Warp Speed and Iron Arm seem to do a lot to make a Sorc pack a punch. Endurance also keeps the Wraithknight from instant killing the Chaos Spawn soaking wounds for the Sorcs. We use unnerfed Invisibility too but you don't see that every game.

That said, the WK doesn't always lose. Not saying that, but it DOES seem really.chancy to throw him into that situation. Anyways to really up his odds better?

I never fought a Draigo star so I have no frame of reference for it.

These lists seem pretty good. R+H took a fair number of top spots at Nova this year and at least 1 ran a Cabal with it (the guy who got 2nd according to Blood of Kittens).

While the Sorcs are definitely more points than the WK, I'm not sure what can stand up to them to protect my own table edge if it goes down. On bikes with Spawn, the Sorc's have 12" move and majority Toughness 7 with Endurance. 3 wounds per spawn, Scats only wounding on 5's. And if I focus on them I'm eating Earthshaker fire and Wyverns, the latter at least of which have barrage, I think ES's may too.

Maybe more monofilament from the Nightspinners will help. Thanks for all the advice so far!

 CadianGateTroll wrote:
Most barrage is not ap3 and is low str.

Except for the 4-6 earthshakers which are S9 ap3 large blast barrage

 CrownAxe wrote:

 CadianGateTroll wrote:
Most barrage is not ap3 and is low str.

Except for the 4-6 earthshakers which are S9 ap3 large blast barrage

Just to add to this: drown anything in enough wounds and it will fail a save eventually. It's how my KDK was managing to close the gap on my friend's Necron army even with all the RP. I think that is one of the main issue the OP is facing.

I have nothing of real value else to add.

Doesn't new FAQ say that a buff that affects the psyker affects all psykers in the unit?

I will say that although eldar is probably the most easily broken army, people really really underestimate R&H all the time. They are the strongest army I have ever played personally (I have a large necron army too so its not like I havent played OP armies).
Are the lascannons actually rapier laser destroyers? Because they are so much more dangerous than the simple lascannon.