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Hey guys and gals thank you for taking the time and reading this.

I have a quick question, your opnion as well as any facts would be great. Who is the most defense based army in the game.


The guys who sit back hold the line never back down or fall back.

I got it narrowed down to imperal guard, imperal firsts or tau. I know they are toy soldiers but any loss always bugs me. I loved dwarfs for that reason. Also I tend to play less then I do set up scenery ect. So a army that can look good bunkered in for the long haul would be nice.

What you think?

I would say Necrons. You can stack quite a few bonuses to the RP. They can be a pain to kill off.

I’ll agree that necrons can take a stupid amount of fire.

Tau are fine, up until something actually reaches them. Now the odds of stuff living that long are low however. Their mechs/suits actually promote a more hit-and-move play style then pure gunline. I’d pass on them for “rugged defenders”

Guard do it well. Blobs of troops, with some commissars and officers to keep the men in line. They do well for a hold the line army. If they do get stuck in CC, they have a lot of men to toss into the fray while the rest keeps shooting. Probably the best for tossing fire downrange while dug in.

Fists are one of the classic siege experts from the fluff. The individual squads are going to be able to hold their own much better then the guard, not needing HQs to stiffen their resolve. But the SM codex does not excel at gunlines. Not that you can’t fake it pretty well, but it’s not our strength.

Yeah, on top of that Necrons have toughness 4 or 5 on everything and leadership 10 across the board. The only issue you might have is with the sitting back part. They have midrange weapons which means that while your troops are tough they don't always sit back.

Iron Warriors with the update are pretty good defenders!

 Fruzzle wrote:
Iron Warriors with the update are pretty good defenders!

yeah they have the benifit of being able to take a decurion with fortifications.

Any gunline based army really. Even orks can be defense based.

Tau are actually fairly aggro if you want to win at higher levels. The sit back style is for the newbies.

My first instinct was Guard. The others are smaller and more elite (compared to guard). Also, the sheer number of troops that you can put down (and the subsequent number of dice rolls) can be intimidating.

Honestly, maybe a GSF with Razorbacks and Rhinos coming out the ying-yang. You just put everything behind blown-up tanks and chill.

 Fruzzle wrote:
Iron Warriors with the update are pretty good defenders!

Not against Tau. 3+ and Cover saves do squat against a handful of Riptides and Pathfinders. They also don't have the firepower to whittle down the incoming firepower either. I'd honestly say Emperor's Children (4+ FnP and Fearless) or Death Guard (T5, 5+ FnP, and Fearless) is better than the Iron Warriors (6+ FnP, Fearless in Fortifications). Just go CAD with the two other Legions.

 oldzoggy wrote:
Any gunline based army really. Even orks can be defense based.

 Gamgee wrote:
Tau are actually fairly aggro if you want to win at higher levels. The sit back style is for the newbies.

Tremble in fear of the Tau herds commanded by veteran players, for their aggressive assaults are legendary...

Tau can kite you in circles around the board. It's not a static gun line at all.

 oldzoggy wrote:

 Gamgee wrote:
Tau are actually fairly aggro if you want to win at higher levels. The sit back style is for the newbies.

Tremble in fear of the Tau herds commanded by veteran players, for their aggressive assaults are legendary...

you're confusing agressive play with assault focus, one can be very agressive but still be "ranged shooty"

Honestly it would have to be Tau or necrons to me both just sit in a corner far away and shoot you to death. most boring gameplay there is but hey some like it.

Necrons could pull it off well, get the Decurion going so 4+ RP and the auxillary choices being a couple of annihilation nexus, 72" doomsday cannon can get the units that try and stay outside of your 24" range then throw a couple of triarch stalkers around your infantry blobs to give them the +1 BS so they're hitting on 2's...

Gotta say some of my most memorable games have been defensive guards. Generally I prefer mobile guards with chimeras but holding that gunline against whatever form of madness and death comming your way has an epic feel to it. Nothing quite like a hundred lasguns desperatly trying to hold the line. There's been times when a single combined squad streched from one end of the board to the other in order to deny deep strikes. Maybe not so helpfull to the overall thread though.

You're asking two seperate questions.
Necrons are the toughest, they take the most abuse and keep on kicking, but they're also kind of mid-ranged in their firepower which means a Necron player has to actively advance his/her pieces to win a lot of matches, even against melee hungry armies like the Space Wolves who deliver most of their forces to the Necron player.
Tau are the shootiest army but their tactic is shoot and run the hell away. For Tau to win they have to stay mobile and just out of short range shooting and charge ranges.
The most defensive army is Imperial Guard, they purchase fortifications and dig themselves in. They rely on cover and high AV metal boxes and being able to threaten at long range. Guard struggle against Tau something fierce and make a terrible tournament army but if you're willing to spend an entire day playing a game Imperial Guard can make a day of it.

My vote for most defensive army has to go to a Death Korps of Krieg siege regiment. Sit back and drum-roll, artillery barrage them Verdun-style with dirt cheap Earthshaker and Medusa carriages, heavy mortars, quad launchers, and Colossus bombards! I don't think any other army can pack so many pie plates! Plus, the DKoK SoV special rules are all about digging in, holding the line, and dishing the pain. Check'em out.

I would say astra militarum as other shooty armies are much more mobile. The little humans tipically stay stationary and fire.

Guard with some sort of fortification and spamming artillery. Works for me, and that 4+ cover save (3+ with camo net) will toughen up your vehicles, and 2+ gtg save for your blob. But you're kinda screwed when your opponent brings lots of cover ignoring gimmicks

Necrons. No need to hide them in cover or behind an aegis.
Overlords with CCB are very durable vs shooting.

I love the IG, specifically with my Fortress of Redemption. For me they are the perfect 'defence' army. They might not be the toughest or the deadliest but they're the most awesome in my opinion.

With a Void Shield on each section and manned by 42+ troops, protected by Tarantula sentry guns in front and Sabre Defence batteries behind - it's truly a statement of "Come at me bro".

Death guard in the new traitor legions book
Their durability is actually quite impressive

Tau, Crons and TL DG

Ig with a bane blade is pretty damn scary.

 Ubl1k wrote:
Honestly it would have to be Tau or necrons to me both just sit in a corner far away and shoot you to death. most boring gameplay there is but hey some like it.

I take it you've never gone up against a triple Canoptek harvest list.

For sheer defensive traits Imperial Guard. Though it does require some game and strategy know how.

You can take 50 guardsmen for 250. That is absurd, plus conscript for dirt cheap.

I hate gunlines but I love guard. So I often take allies, GSC or Marines to compensate for their lack of CC and super mobility.

Take an imperial Strongpoint. I recommend at least 1 Bastion, though two is more fun. Put the quad cannon on them. Put both infantry platoon squads in there. Take at least 2 Ageis lines, ideally 3. If youre feeling sassy, take the Skyway landing pad as well and give it an ammo dump.

Spread out these fortifications as you please. Take at least 1 full infantry platoon. 1PCS, 4 IP (2@20), and a mortor team or two, plus a special weapons squad or two for good measure. Take conscripts and put a commisar with them.

Take at least 2 command squads, 3 is good for redundancy. Kit them out with Laz cannons or autocannons, or give them Master of Ordience.

Take a punisher or exterminator for extra firepower. and Bubble wrap your tank squad with the conscirpts.

Setup a caste with your Bastions, and form the Ageis defense lines around them to give you the best cover and cross fire befnits possible with the terrain. Place your guardsmen in gunlines behind the Ageis and have your heavy weapons teams scattered about. Place your specialist weapon teams inebtween or whereever they might need to be (flamer squad to give wall of death if something gets too close). And just pour laz gun volly, mortor fire (or autocannons; i prefer autocannons) from your firebase.

Your Command squad should be throwing out orders to ignore cover, or tank hunter all over the place. As soon as anything is about to shoot your gunlines (which they will, 20 squads draw attention) goto ground. As soon as your turn comes back up, issue your get back in the fight orders and pretend like nothing happened.

The restrcitions for castleguard is nearly nothing and its always fun to play. Placing tanks or huge squads of infantry on the skyway landing pad is a good way of pissing off your oppoent or making his shots disapear or wasted.

Ageis defense lines, grant your normally paper thin guardsmen armor a 2+cover save.

Bastions are hardy with 4 HP and AV14 and can take a host of extra weapons (faced anywhere due to faq: [4hvy bolters on one side if you please]) and building upgrades with lots of fire points.

Your command squads get back in the fight are your lynchpin, so makes ure you have at least two, ideally three.

READ ALL OF THE STRONGHOLD ASSAULT BOOK. It may not seem great to you, but as soon as you realize, you can place 50 guardsmen ontop of a skyway landing pad, take an ammo store and a medicae kit and grant every model ontop rerolls of 1 to hit and feel no pain 5+ with a 4++ save or a 3+ save if they goto ground. You will not regret it.

 Tsol wrote:
READ ALL OF THE STRONGHOLD ASSAULT BOOK. It may not seem great to you, but as soon as you realize, you can place 50 guardsmen ontop of a skyway landing pad, take an ammo store and a medicae kit and grant every model ontop rerolls of 1 to hit and feel no pain 5+ with a 4++ save or a 3+ save if they goto ground. You will not regret it.

This.
Buildings are the epitome of defensiveness.
For a troop-based army, look at the Wall of Martyrs. It is trenches and bunkers, and you can spread your army out while staying in cover.
For more specialised armies, the Strongpoint has less coverage, but more defensiveness. It is rooms and walls in place of trenches and bunkers, so allows for better firing points for the units, and more cover for vehicles.

Guard are the best defenders IMO because of the sheer number of infantry and long range firepower they have. In a 1500 pt game you can literally cover your entire deployment zone with fearless bodies (using priests), denying deepstrikers and outflankers any access to your side of the board, while STILL having the points left over to use artillery and tanks. When you add in allies or fortifications... the shenanigans become ludicrous.

A full unit of guardsmen behind an adl with the two shot order is a pain in the ass no matter how tough you are. Those flashlights are bright.