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So I'm trying to come up with at least a Semi-Competitive Ork list (I know, it's wishful thinking..)
The gist of this list is pretty straight forward, the Meks attach to the Mek Gunz to increase the Ld of the Grots all parked behind the Aegis and Warboss and Painboy in with the Bikers.
Bikes, Trukks of Boyz and MegaNobz will be shooting up the table flatting out and turbo-boosting to get into position for second turn charge.
The Kommando formation with be in reserves, thanks to the special rules they can come in on any table edge without rolling, with shrouding, plus re-rolling saves if they don't fire (the two larger Mobs will just be hiding in prep for a charge the following turn).
Mek Gunz will be shooting anything that looks too dangerous while possibly squatting on an objective.
I've never tried the Red Skull Formation so open to suggestions / advice. If you can see something that would work better I'm all ears.
NO FORCE ORG
+ Mek
+ Mek
HQ Warboss - Da Lucky Stikk
- Power Klaw
- Attack Squig
- Warbike
The attack squig is redundant if you already have da lucky stikk, save points to equip a meganob with a pair of killsaws. I've tried Snikrot's formation and it's situational, because against close combat armies like wolves, daemons or tyranids is completely useless and also keeping in reserve 500ish points is tough for the orks. So you should have as many pressing units you can field, and three trukks plus bikes are not enough. If you go second you may be in trouble. I'd cut a unit of mek gunz, a single mek, kombi-skorchas, aegis, probably heavy armors and some bikes in order to add two other trukks at least. Or maybe just a couple of single deffkpotas to harass some opponent's shooty units, but you really need more targets in turn 1. I think you should keep the kommandos units as cheap as possible, with rokkit instead of burnas, 3 units of 5 and a larger max unit of 12-15, including the nob with BP and PK, joined by snikrot. 8 rokkits in total. The formation is a lot of fun to play, i love it, but it's hard to compete against good lists and needs some practise.
Yeah I was considering keeping the Squads in the formation smaller, I went the Burnas just for flushing out things like pathfinders and whatnot, plus rokkits suck due to our terrible BS.. I've already swapped a few things around, just so I could get a mob of 8 lootas for some form of anti-air and a bit longer range shooting. Have considered using three mobs of 5 kommandos and larger mob for Snikrot to hide in. I'd like some more targets on the board, it's just hard to drop away other portions to make room..
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/02 05:44:46
You call that a Waaagh? This.. Is a Waaagh!!
That's not a Waagh! That's a spoon..
Hmm.. I see you've played Waaaghy - Spoony before..
SpaceManBob wrote: Yeah I was considering keeping the Squads in the formation smaller, I went the Burnas just for flushing out things like pathfinders and whatnot, plus rokkits suck due to our terrible BS.. I've already swapped a few things around, just so I could get a mob of 8 lootas for some form of anti-air and a bit longer range shooting. Have considered using three mobs of 5 kommandos and larger mob for Snikrot to hide in. I'd like some more targets on the board, it's just hard to drop away other portions to make room..
You're right, rokkits are bs2 but they cost only 5 points and having 8 means that a couple of them can cause some damage. They're also there to scare the opponent and mess his choices because a min unit of kommandos with two rokkits can surprise the back of a vehicle, and if he shoots against them your approaching fast units would benefit from that. The point with snikrot's formation is to force the opponent to take decisions about what is scarier and worths to be shot at. So if everything has the same priority but it's also expendable then snikrot's formation is really a lot of fun to play. It's far from being top tier in tournaments but if you don't face super cheesy lists these orks can do well.
-I'd run all the kommando squads at 5 w/ rokkits. Snikrot is a 60 point nob essentially, and AP5 isn't scary in CC. It'll be at least turn 3 before he gets into combat anyway. Don't be dropping hundreds of points into him and a huge squad. They'll never make their points back and it violates both the MSU and min/max philosophies of competitive gaming. I'd seriously consider dropping the kommandos all together.
-The adl is kind of wasted on the mek gunz. When you deploy those, just deploy the gretchin behind the guns. Now they're T7, immune to most small arms fire. Maybe grab a couple squads of lootas to stick behind the adl, combined with an ammo dump upgrade, could be pretty nice. Oh, also, the ammo grots don't work with the kmk really as you can not reroll gets hot templates. It may be worthwhile to swap them for lobbas, especially if you grab tankbustas for anti armour.
-Trukk lists should have like 8 trukks min at 1850, you have 3. There is a very likely chance that you will have none after turn one, and if you go second, hoo boy. Dropping the/some kommanos will give you some breathing space, use it to grab a couple more trukk boyz. This will allow you to reorganize your list to be a double CAD, giving you 2x the HQ, Elite, FA, and HS slots.
-No tankbustas. A min unit in a trukk with a ram is 100 points and gives you 6 rokkit attacks. These are a staple of any ork army. Definitely cut the kommandos or kmks for some.
-Your biker star is waaay too big. You do this a couple times in your list. You have a 60 point snikrot, so you buy him a 185 point bodyguard. You have a 125 point warboss (ditch the squig) and you gave him like 405 points of bodyguards. Units those sizes don't need those characters lol. Competitive lists run min/max MSU, meaning most of the units you make it into combat with will be in sizes of 3-5 models. Any sort of deathstar you should worry more about out manuvering than outfighting. Plus the unit isn't synergized well. Bikes want to be shooting or turboboosting. They don't actually have an expectional CC output. T5, armour, and jink makes them survivable, but it's a 400 point tarpit unit with exceptional dakka output that's not using it because it's a combat delivery system / wound soaker. At 18 points a model it should not just be soaking wounds. Try 3x3 or even better, 6x3. Biker boss/painboy really only need 5-6 bikers for guards, they can just bail for another unit whenever they want. Take the nob but no PK. Your warboss should be ass kicky enough, you're looking for something to eat a challenge for him since he'll be hitting at I1 with a 4+ armour save.
-Swap all your trukk big shootas for rokkits. S8 AP3 is great, cheap as borscht, you get hits through volume. 6 rokkits may score an average of 2 hits, but has an excellent upper range with up to 6 hits. It's all about dat bass.
Here's a suggested list just to gather these thoughts into one place.
Spoiler:
Double CAD
HQ Warboss - Da Lucky Stikk - Power Klaw - Warbike
Hey, not bad for no book. I did use a ~ so i was expecting an inaccuracy.
Grab another unit of warbikers, more bomb squigs and extra mek gun grots. Or even a Weirdboy. MANz missile + warpath or Da Jump is pretty awesome, puke, beam, and krunch are solid witchfires. Good to go!
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/02/03 03:59:37
Good suggestions Slip but your list changes completely the original one. I think Snikrot's formation can be a lot of fun, it's not among our most competitive choices and requires some practise but it worths a try.
3 units of 5 kommandos with 2 rokkits each and a unit of 10 with 2 rokkits, nob with bp and pk and snikrot cost 390 points.
In a 1850 format that leaves you with a nice budget to field some fast MSU and 1-3 shooty units in the backfield. I'd go with a full unit of lobbas, min squads of lootas, min trukk boyz and mid sized or even min unit of bikes. Biker boss and maybe biker painboy. Something like that:
Warboss, bike, pk, bp, lucky stikk
3x6 bikes, 2 pk and 1 big choppa (the unit joined by the warboss)
5x10 boyz, nob, bp, pk, trukk + ram
3x5 lootas
3x5 kommandos, 2 rokkit
11 kommandos, 2 rokkit, nob, bp, pk, snikrot.
Alternatively you can cut some kommandos in the larger squad, a unit of lootas and field 5 lobbas, a min unit of tankbustas or a painboy on bike. But with snikrot's formation I'd go with a list that this one. Or ditch the lootas and a couple of kommandos and field 3 min units of tankbustas in trukks.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/02/03 08:22:28
It's true, I did change the feel of the list and I know we both try not to do that. It does seem like he wants a competitive list, and perhaps I may be biased, but I just don't think kommandos are that. Snikrot definitely isn't despite having the coolest model potentially ever. He also did say he was open to something else so I figured I'd toss that out there.
The other thing is, kommandos and trukks just don't really work, at least not in these ratios. He won't have any saturation turn one and potentially even turn two. Snikrot may not even make it into combat til the bottom of turn three after arriving two shooting phases too late to save the rest of the army.
But, if there's a commitment to running Red Skull, I see three ways of doing it.
-Blitz Brigade combo. Now you have five scouting battlewagons to join the ambush. I'd just go 5x standard min boyz loadout, nob with pk + Bp. Maybe just a couple painboy hqs. The last couple hundred points, go MSU grots so you go something on the board turn one to take some shots. Maybe an ADL or bunker or VSG lol. Mek Gunz would be good too. MSU lobbas maybe, just deploy them way the feth outta the way. Turn two wagons and kommandos roll in, blast anything with a 3+ or an AV to Nantucket, cue fat lady.
-All in kommandos. Take redskulls and a double CAD. take 6 more units of kommandos. 10 units showing up turn 2 should be a pretty panic inducing moment. Cap it off with six koptas outflanking, Zhad and some bikers, or a HQ with the Finkin Kap to infiltrate 3 more units for a potential total of 20 units coming in on their own table edge. A boatload of grots ADL and comms relay seems like a must here.
-All dakka. Grab buzzgob's stompa, gorkanaut, min/max msu lootas or units of 3 mek gunz. Grab an imperial stronghold with bastions and gak. A vortex missile silo maybe. Sit back, blast away, let the kommandos take out their heavy support while the rest of the army is trying to dislodge you.
Don't know if those will work as well as the list I made above, but they'd give the kommandoes their best shot imho.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I updated the posted list to be 1850. Threw in some more lootaas. With the ammo dump and adl, why not? That way if one has to go to ground for that sweet 2+ cover you still have a bunch of dakka output. oh and the third extra grot, for symmetry.
Ultimately it is just a suggested list. Take what you like, leave the rest.
This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at 2017/02/03 19:49:27
