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Hi guys,

Reading the Deathmarks special rule, hunters from hyperspace, that allows wounding on 2+ once deep striked in from reserve, along with the shots being AP2, but only when they deep strike in. All subsequent shooing phases follow the usual sniper rifle 4+ wounding.

However, would I be able to use the Wargear item "The veil of darkness" to allow them an additional hunters from hyperspace use, as they are "removed from the table" and are RE deep striked in, essentially being brought in from reserve immediately rather than having to wait to get them?

Obviously if this is correct, a 10 model squad of Deathmarks with a lord with the veil of darkness would be trolltastic, as they essentially could wipe out whole TEQ squads, MC, and obliterate virtually anything if within 12" without having to worry about being locked in assault, and DO THE EXACT SAME THING IMMEDIATELY AGAIN.

ill get back to you on that


just gotta see if the faq and/or rulings would make this work


UPDATE

....looked at the FAQ, and then checked the units. Yes it does work

Q: Can a unit with an attached Independent Character with
the Veil of Darkness be deployed in Deep Strike Reserve?
A: No – unless the unit already has Deep Strike from
another source.

Deathmarks have deep strike, lord gets deep strike from veil of darkness.... yes it works

I hope the answer to this is yes.

mchammadad wrote:
ill get back to you on that


just gotta see if the faq and/or rulings would make this work


UPDATE

....looked at the FAQ, and then checked the units. Yes it does work

Q: Can a unit with an attached Independent Character with
the Veil of Darkness be deployed in Deep Strike Reserve?
A: No – unless the unit already has Deep Strike from
another source.

Deathmarks have deep strike, lord gets deep strike from veil of darkness.... yes it works

Yep.... it works. Luckily the Veil is a one use thing.......(Shudders)

Oh god. I thought "no, surely GW would see how this could be abused" but MOTHER OF GOD now that it's been confirmed as 'legal' this could be the *SINGLE* most trolltastic move the Necrons could use...

Luckily it's one use only. Can you imagine if it was MULTIPLE uses!? Still, the ability to essentially wipe out a Riptide battle suit with ten sniper rifles and doing it AGAIN next round to another is to tempting... Christ, even Storm surge battle suits could effectively be wiped out in a single shooting phase...

No, the Hunters from Hyperspace does not grant auto AP2, that is still only on to wounds rolls of 6, due to sniper rending.

Yes, an independent character with Deep strike can join in and Deep Strike in with the Deathmarks.

Yes, an independent character can join them when "Ethereal Interception" is triggered.

No, that independent character can not shoot as part of "Ethereal Interception".

No, When you use the Veil you do not go back into Reserves. The To Wound on 2+ is only when the "unit arrives from Deep Strike Reserve"

mchammadad wrote:
UPDATE

....looked at the FAQ, and then checked the units. Yes it does work

Q: Can a unit with an attached Independent Character with
the Veil of Darkness be deployed in Deep Strike Reserve?
A: No – unless the unit already has Deep Strike from
another source.

That's talking about deployment. It's not giving you permission to use the Veil to put the unit back into Reserves.

what about if you mishap when you deep strike again?

Depend on wording, do they put into reserves and immediately Deep Strike, or just placed "as per Deep Strike rules"?
Cos its the same with Nemesis Strike formation from Grey Knights + Gate of Infinity.

'Hunters from Hyperspace' says:

"During the player turn in which this unit arrives from Deep Strike Reserve..."

'Veil of Darkness' says:

"They then immediately arrive anywhere on the board using the rules for Deep Strike".

That seems straightforward. They certainly arrive, and they use the Deep Strike rules. But what about the 'Deep Strike Reserve bit?

'Arriving by Deep Strike' tells us:

"When placing the unit in Reserve, you must tell your opponent that it will be arriving by Deep Strike (sometimes called Deep Strike Reserve)."

This tells us arriving by Deep Strike is synonymous with Deep Strike Reserve.

Do they arrive by (or using the rules for) Deep Strike when using the Veil of Darkness? Yes, they do.

Therefore they arrive from Deep Strike Reserve.

 Mr. Shine wrote:
'

"When placing the unit in Reserve, you must tell your opponent that it will be arriving by Deep Strike (sometimes called Deep Strike Reserve)."

This tells us arriving by Deep Strike is synonymous with Deep Strike Reserve..

No, it doesn't. It tells us that declaring that the unit is going in Reserve and arriving by Deep Strike is synonymous with Deep Strike Reserve.

The only way you could do something along the lines of what OP wants.

1) arrive via normal Deep Strike from Deep Strike reseves
2) invoke Hunters from Hyperspace rule
3) on a subsequent turn, use the Veil of Darkness to intentionally mishap and then roll a 4-6 to go back into Deep Strike reserves
4) next turn, arrive again via normal Deep Strike from Deep Strike reseves
5) invoke Hunters from Hyperspace rule a second time

N.B. An IC with a Veil of Darkness attached to the unit of Deathmarks prevents the unit from arriving via Ethereal Interception.

 insaniak wrote:
No, it doesn't. It tells us that declaring that the unit is going in Reserve and arriving by Deep Strike is synonymous with Deep Strike Reserve.

That's quite likely what they intended, but I respectfully disagree that that's what they clearly said.

EDIT:

Having read the rulebook FAQ I think it's plain how it should be played, and retract my above post.

"Q: Does a unit always enter the game from Reserves when
Deep Striking? The rules for Deep Striking seem to imply that
being the case, even when a unit is already on the table. As
an example, does a unit of Warp Talons that is using Gate
of Infinity trigger its Warpflame Strike each time they use the
psychic power?
A: Not unless explicitly stated – in the example you use,
WARHAMMER 40,000: THE RULES 13
Gate of Infinity has the unit arrive anywhere on the board
using the rules for Deep Strike. This doesn’t mean that it
goes into Deep Strike Reserve, or that you have to make
a Reserve Roll for the unit and so on, and it means that
you don’t get to use the Warpflame Strike each time you
do this."

Although the wording for Warpflame Strike is somewhat different:

"Immediately after a unit of Warp Talons has arrived from reserve by Deep Strike..."

I think the intention is clear with the FAQ.

Oh, so the veil of darkness only grants a deep strike redeploy, not an actual deep strike from reserve style move, which means it won't trigger hunters from hyperspace....
Oh well, it was worth finding out if it was worth tying!

Q: If the Veil of Darkness is used while with a group of
warriors and you go into Ongoing Reserves due to a Deep Strike
Mishap, can you come in by Deep Striking?
A: Only if all of the models involved have the Deep
Strike rule.

However.... if you intentionally mishap and get a 5-6 you could actually do it again

mchammadad wrote:
Q: If the Veil of Darkness is used while with a group of
warriors and you go into Ongoing Reserves due to a Deep Strike
Mishap, can you come in by Deep Striking?
A: Only if all of the models involved have the Deep
Strike rule.

However.... if you intentionally mishap and get a 5-6 you could actually do it again

Trouble is, you are not back in Deep Strike Reserves. The unit is now in Ongoing Reserves. RAW could be used to say it does not work a second time.

Draco765 wrote:

mchammadad wrote:
Q: If the Veil of Darkness is used while with a group of
warriors and you go into Ongoing Reserves due to a Deep Strike
Mishap, can you come in by Deep Striking?
A: Only if all of the models involved have the Deep
Strike rule.

However.... if you intentionally mishap and get a 5-6 you could actually do it again

Trouble is, you are not back in Deep Strike Reserves. The unit is now in Ongoing Reserves. RAW could be used to say it does not work a second time.

Yes he is, same thing as Swooping Hawks when they Skyleap away from the table.

Most of people it's confused with Deep strike *maneuver* wich is the action to resolve it (select point, roll for scatter check for misshaps... ) wich it's mostly used to resolve a special kind of Reserve arrival. And Deep Strike Reserve wich is the specific arrival from reserves performing such maneuver.

Everytime the game tell you resolve as Deep strike it's just telling *how to put the unit back* on the table, when you do it and the unit was in Reserve or Ongoing Reserve it's then a Deep Strike reserve and rules apply.

Draco765 wrote:

mchammadad wrote:
Q: If the Veil of Darkness is used while with a group of
warriors and you go into Ongoing Reserves due to a Deep Strike
Mishap, can you come in by Deep Striking?
A: Only if all of the models involved have the Deep
Strike rule.

However.... if you intentionally mishap and get a 5-6 you could actually do it again

Trouble is, you are not back in Deep Strike Reserves. The unit is now in Ongoing Reserves. RAW could be used to say it does not work a second time.

If the Deathmarks start the game in Deep Strike Reserves they can use the Veil to again enter Deep Strike Reserves when the mishap and roll a 4-6. This works because Ongoing Reserves follows the rules for Reserves which Deep Strike replaces with Deep Strike Reserves and you are able to satisfy all rules involved no problem. The FAQ further clarifies that this is unequivocally the case.