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I've made this mistake before which is prob the only reason I can catch it now, but you can only take one relic, your warboss has 3.
Tankbustas can be run at min unit sizes to save points while remaining effective. You generally need to knock off 3 HP to kill a vehicle. 5 bustas and 2 bomb squigs gives you that. Anything more is really just overkill. It's better to focus 2 units with the exact right amount of offensive output to delete a unit rather than letting one unit overkill and waste potential Ws.
Choppa boyz need a BP, either on a nob or boss.
One blitza bomma should do it. Ork fliers are pretty solidly overcosted across the board.
Deffkoptas work best solo. The tl rokkit is a bonus, not the main function of the kopta. Use them to eat overwatch, capture/contest objectives, grab linebreaker, and maybe snipe a MEQ or vehicle. You're prob gonna stick your warboss here, so I imagine that's why their together. Just one warboss and one deffkopta is actually a p effective unit. Majority T6 thanks to the boss means you are inv to s3 shooting almost s4 too. You can look out sir any wound that does get through on to the kopta. DLS does mean a boss can reroll his jink save iirc.
If you want a killkannon, maybe consider a gun wagon? An empty battlewagon is an expensive waste of survivability.
Lootas same as bustas, better off in min unit sizes of 5, and the meks generally aren't worth it. I hope the lootas aren't going in the wagon. Not very good synergy between the heavy rating of the deffgunz and the poor range of the killkannon/rokkits.
Traktor kannons are not great. Having one around to force flyers to jink is p cool, but fliers aren't really as a big a part of the game to justify 2 fliers of your own, tracktors, and quad gun. The quad is prob all the AA you'd need. Go lobbas, kannons, and maybe (seriously, don't go overboard.) a kmk or 2.
Love the ADL. Be sure to have a grot from the mek gunz nearby to give it bs3 over bs2 from say a loota. The Ammo Dump is a good upgrade too.
Does it stand a chance? Sure. I think you're perfectly specialized to wipe the floor with a static gunline like AM and balanced enough to dance with a non gladius codex SM list. You're gonna have trouble in ITC i think, with it's focus on MSU tactics and min/maxed unit spam.
Anyway, I do like your choices overall. Your slot selections are great. I don't know if it's as organized as it could be though. It seems like you're running a single CAD instead of a Double, which cuts your elite, fast, and heavy specialists selections in half.
Here's an example list, just to bring all these thoughts together in a more easily digestible manner.
Had 4 points to spare so gave one nob a shoota. That's my reorg or your list essentially, keeping it mostly intact. I'll throw out another hypothetical list I think you may like, based off of your two core tennants of Dakka and obsec.
Spoiler:
Double CAD
Zhardsnark Da Rippa 150
Painboy - WB 75
5x 3 Warbikers 270
5 Warbikers 90
6x 5 Tankbustas - 2x BS, Trukk, RR, Rokkit 660
6x Deffkoptas - TL Rokkit 180
6x Lootas 420
ADL- Ammo Dump 70
1850
This act is basically a slider between DAKKA and "oh hey objectives". The bikers are obsec, T5, 4+, 2/3/4++ jink depending on circumstances. It's low on PKs for an ork list, but check out these stats: 42 rokkit shots, 30 tank hunter ones, 6 TL fast ones. Should average 15 rokkit hits per turn, enough to destroy 5 rhinos by themselves. 66 TL S5 AP5 shots, you'll average 36 hits. Enough to significantly dent any infantry presence every turn. Finally, the lootas will average 60 shots with a max of 90. That's 20 average hits, 30 is average off the max shots of 90. S7 AP4 will destroy anything to big for the bikers to chew on and not big enough for the bustas. If you place them around the ammo dump, you'll average 24, or a max avg of 36. Considering you'd have to spend like 56 points in lootas for those extra hits, the 20 point ammo dump is a good deal. If you want, as long as you are rocking an ammo dump you can include a mek with a kmb, as you can reroll their gets hot rolls, but be aware of the range differential. Give that mek a gitfinda too and he has a 58% accuracy rate and only a 2.7% chance to melt himself. (It's almost 17% without.)
That went a little longer than intended. I hope you find it helpful, I don't want to overwhelm ya, so this is all here where ever you need it. The lists are only meant to help illustrate my points, you should def use them for inspiration but if you believe in a unit or tactic, just rock it and see what happens. All the best!
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, I had just done this up, but it's an analysis of the most efficent ork dakka depending on what your facing. Might come in handy for you at some point. I'll spoiler it so it doesn't take up too much space but basically the ork Dakka trifecta is lootas, bustas, and warbikers.
Spoiler:
WPT= Wounds per Turn, HPT = Hullpoints Per Turn PP = Per Point, ()=TL, <> = Tank Hunter
Well you seem like a guys who's played the game once or twice, Wouldn't want to make myself look bad with bad advice rite?
I've been trying to give some badass reviews lately. I know Orks can be competitive. The math is there. I'll keep going till Ork players start rolling the competition haha.
Biker lists are solid if you want to go for dakka. Ork warbikers are just as good as any other bike in the game when you crunch the numbers, and biker spam is highly competitive. Zhad esp, gives them skilled rider which is huge for terrain and jinking since it gives +1. Turboboosting gives another +1 to jink for a total of 2++, with feel no pain and T5, 6 for zhad? They are extremely tough to shift. Now throw obsec on top of that! They do have scout too, so remember to outflank them if you ever play another shooty army, like Tau.
Someone posted an army in the ork tactics thread that was just Zhad and 16x warbikers +nob with pk that's worth checking out too. The other hot thing in Ork tactics these days goes something like 4x CAD - 2x MAWB 2x 10 Boyz w/ trukk+ram. (Check out the batreps for deets there.) Those are more CC tho.
Dakka Guns for GEQ, CEQ, MEQ and AV10? Deff Guns or TEQ and AV11 Rokkits for WraithKnights and AV12+
You got it! It's not so rigid though. The first value is basically total offensive output and can be used in game to determine unit targets and priority. The second value tells you how cost effective they are, which you should be considering when creating your army list.
Here's some more depth whenever you have time.
Spoiler:
So Dakkagunz would be an effective choice vs AV10, sure. But it's most efficient values are vs the GEQs/CEQS etc. Meanwhile the rokkit is mostly wasted against infantry.(Except for being very good vs MEQs.) I'd rather use the rokkits to pop an AV10 transport for example, then let the bikers gun down the survivors. Conversely, maybe you are facing a mechanized list. Now you need the dakkagunz on that AV10, because the lootas are busy vs AV11-13 because you have to dump all your rokkits into two WKs. See what I mean?
When it comes to infantry, the most cruicial thing is AP. Check out the [] values for dakkguns vs GEQs, Deffgunz vs CEQs, and Rokkits vs MEQs. t3 5+, t3 4+, T4 3+ respectively vs AP5, AP4, AP3. See the drop off at output and efficiency as soon as armour becomes a factor? The deffgun ends up being the best anti TEQ weapon, despite fewer shots than the dakkagun, and the dakkagun being TL? From that we can derive S vs T as the next most important stat.
Also look at how the units with rerolls are more effective outside of their comfort zones. Dakkagunz stay relatively static through the entire list, they're the only ones who get to reroll to hit. The rokkits have no reroll vs infantry and it's PP isn't great, but vs vehicles of all armour types it stays relatively consistent. The Deffgun's PP drops off at a rate twice as fast as the rokkit vs an AV.
There were a couple other categories I wanted to do but I'll give you the cliffnotes. Vs Necrons the rokkits ID and AP3 carry the day, use them on infantry and deff/daakagunz vs ghost arcs, wraiths, and such. Vs bikers, forget rokkits, they can jink so volume and accuracy are important. (Deff vs bikes (0.19)[0.014], dakkagun vs bikes (0.28)[0.016])
So I'd say it's more
Dakka vs GEQ, CEQ, MEQ, Bikers, AV10 Deff vs GEQ, CEQ, TEQ, Bikers, AV10-12 Rokkit vs MEQ, Necrons, AV10-14, WK
Happy huntin'!
This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2017/03/01 13:12:59
I'll keep it a bit brief since you already got a lengthy detailed explanation.
I went on a mean mean win streak with Orks last year. I won like 20 games and lost maybe twice.
Things I noticed worked across the board...
Lootas. Get lootas, I have 30 and lootas are always useful can't think of an instance that they weren't useful. They can target anything short of AV14 and do damage. They are also the best anti-flyer defense you will get from our codex even more effective than bringing our own flyer.
Vehicle spam. If you won't commit to bringing several then just don't. Never bring just 1 battlewagon go with 2 or 3. Trukks are easily spammable makes sure you do so. Our vehicles don't last very long so you want to push with several of them because all anti vehicle weaponry WILL make sure that the one you want getting there doesn't.
Always stay in their face, be relentless gun them down and run them down. Orks are great at keeping the pressure on.
Deffkoptas + buzzsaw are awesome! Best used as single models or in units of 2. This allow you to be able to regroup easily but mostly you want small units because they can zip around, hide easily, take objectives (I crushed a maelstrom game by fielding 12 deffkoptas in small units lol I easily took over every objective on the table)
Burna Boyz + Trukks = Trolling. Not the most competitive but when you catch the opponent off guard with it, it is soooo satisfying to hit with 10 flamers and say 'Ok I got 80 hits let me roll to wound now...oh that's 40 wounds' lol
