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I am well into the HH series, on book 21 (Fear to Tread) currently. It has been a while since I read 1000 Sons and don't remember Horus ever trying to sway Magnus to join him. I know Mortarion and Fulgrim thought they could get The Khan and Ferrus Manus to join their side, but did anyone ever take a good crack at Magnus, or was he just used as a pawn in order to further Horus's goals? It seems like he could have been of great benefit to the traitors if he joined them on his terms. He would have been an excellent ally and could have guaranteed the defeat of the Emperor

The Thousand Sons fought with Horus in the Siege of Terra.

So the answer to your question is yes, but it hasn't been covered in a novel yet.

Lorgar does frequently, but it only ends with Magnus pointing out that Lorgar knows very little about the warp.

as for the TS at Terra, that's technically a point of debate. as of HH book 7, ~20,000 TS weren't on Prospero and ~6,000 TS made it out of prospero alive. those 20,000 could have done as they wanted either way, as the 6,000 who left prospero with magnus were probably not all to willing to go out and fight anyone in their state. It's also good to note that Magnus goes out of his way to save Vulkan in one of the Salamander books post-Curze, so even if parts of his legion went full traitor, it's still debatable that he did.

Sending the Wolves to destroy Prospero was all Horus needed to do to sway Magnus, or at least his legion.

 Blackhair Duckshape wrote:
Sending the Wolves to destroy Prospero was all Horus needed to do to sway Magnus, or at least his legion.

Had Magnus and the 1000 Sons marched on Terra, the outcome would have been different. I just can't believe Horus would squander such a powerful ally. Damn! The Emperor censured him! Why send Space Wolves to destroy Prospero when you can get him to throw his lot in with you, since both you AND Magnus use the powers of the warp. What a gaping plot hole

The wolves weren't sent by the Emperor to raze Prospero and destroy the Thousand Sons, they were sent by Horus after he had contacted Leman Russ and changed the orders. Russ had no idea at the time that Horus was the architect of the heresy and had no reason not to trust him. Horus knew that Russ would be fairly eager to carry out his orders due to the animosity between the two.

 SolidOakie wrote:

 Blackhair Duckshape wrote:
Sending the Wolves to destroy Prospero was all Horus needed to do to sway Magnus, or at least his legion.

Had Magnus and the 1000 Sons marched on Terra, the outcome would have been different. I just can't believe Horus would squander such a powerful ally. Damn! The Emperor censured him! Why send Space Wolves to destroy Prospero when you can get him to throw his lot in with you, since both you AND Magnus use the powers of the warp. What a gaping plot hole

Because there's no proof a censoring would have actually been eneugh for Magnus to go traitor, partiuclarly had the original order not been dicked with by Horus and Magnus mearly been brought back to Terra. (my feeling is the emperor would have chewed magnus out and promptly repurposed him and the 1k sons for the webway way. Magnus is too powerful a Psyker to waste)

by restructuring the order Horus gets the 1k sons and wolves to neuter each other, he can then recruit magnus after the fact with a "well look what dad did to you!"

 SolidOakie wrote:

 Blackhair Duckshape wrote:
Sending the Wolves to destroy Prospero was all Horus needed to do to sway Magnus, or at least his legion.

Had Magnus and the 1000 Sons marched on Terra, the outcome would have been different. I just can't believe Horus would squander such a powerful ally. Damn! The Emperor censured him! Why send Space Wolves to destroy Prospero when you can get him to throw his lot in with you, since both you AND Magnus use the powers of the warp. What a gaping plot hole

Except Magnus&Co WERE on Terra.

BrianDavion wrote:

 SolidOakie wrote:

 Blackhair Duckshape wrote:
Sending the Wolves to destroy Prospero was all Horus needed to do to sway Magnus, or at least his legion.

Had Magnus and the 1000 Sons marched on Terra, the outcome would have been different. I just can't believe Horus would squander such a powerful ally. Damn! The Emperor censured him! Why send Space Wolves to destroy Prospero when you can get him to throw his lot in with you, since both you AND Magnus use the powers of the warp. What a gaping plot hole

by restructuring the order Horus gets the 1k sons and wolves to neuter each other, he can then recruit magnus after the fact with a "well look what dad did to you!"

I guess this sounds feasible, although a very convoluted way to get Magnus to side with him. And to the comment directly over this one, I had no idea Magnus participated in the Seige of Terra. Knowing that I guess Horus's plan worked out

 SolidOakie wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:

 SolidOakie wrote:

 Blackhair Duckshape wrote:
Sending the Wolves to destroy Prospero was all Horus needed to do to sway Magnus, or at least his legion.

Had Magnus and the 1000 Sons marched on Terra, the outcome would have been different. I just can't believe Horus would squander such a powerful ally. Damn! The Emperor censured him! Why send Space Wolves to destroy Prospero when you can get him to throw his lot in with you, since both you AND Magnus use the powers of the warp. What a gaping plot hole

by restructuring the order Horus gets the 1k sons and wolves to neuter each other, he can then recruit magnus after the fact with a "well look what dad did to you!"

I guess this sounds feasible, although a very convoluted way to get Magnus to side with him. And to the comment directly over this one, I had no idea Magnus participated in the Seige of Terra. Knowing that I guess Horus's plan worked out

I don't think Horus nesscarily intended for Magnus to join him, that was a plus, but by siccing the wolves on the 1k sons, the hope was simply that both would be too savaged to be of any use during the heresy.

BrianDavion wrote:
I don't think Horus nesscarily intended for Magnus to join him, that was a plus, but by siccing the wolves on the 1k sons, the hope was simply that both would be too savaged to be of any use during the heresy.

Maybe Horus figured Magnus would be unlikely to join by just talking so odds were better by having the two legions take out each other. Magnus joining later might have been unintended bonus.

Considering Magnus was there trying to stop Erebus from corrupting Horus as hey lay comatose on Davin, I think it's safe to say Horus knew Magnus wouldn't join him unless his hand was forced. Magnus shared the Emperor's vision for an enlightened humanity (if some of the details altered). By having Russ destroy Prospero, Horus gets the Wolves and Thousand Sons to break themselves on each other (like a small scale Istvaan almost), and in the event Magnus survives (like he did) he now resents the Emperor and his plans because (from his point of view) he just ordered the destruction of one of the greatest repositories of knowledge and enlightenment in the galaxy.
Some of it might be lucky coincidence but given Davin, and Magnus's rejection of Lorgar's crusade, Horus and Lorgar both knew Magnus would never join them willingly. Even after Prospero, he spends half the war making his mind up.

 Brennonjw wrote:
It's also good to note that Magnus goes out of his way to save Vulkan in one of the Salamander books post-Curze, so even if parts of his legion went full traitor, it's still debatable that he did.

The Rubric caused Magnus' psyche to shatter into many shards with different agendas, and the one who saved Vulkan may not have had the same agenda as the original Magnus.

 Ashenwyte wrote:

 Brennonjw wrote:
It's also good to note that Magnus goes out of his way to save Vulkan in one of the Salamander books post-Curze, so even if parts of his legion went full traitor, it's still debatable that he did.

The Rubric caused Magnus' psyche to shatter into many shards with different agendas, and the one who saved Vulkan may not have had the same agenda as the original Magnus.

I thought the rubric just changed the marines.

 Ashenwyte wrote:

 Brennonjw wrote:
It's also good to note that Magnus goes out of his way to save Vulkan in one of the Salamander books post-Curze, so even if parts of his legion went full traitor, it's still debatable that he did.

The Rubric caused Magnus' psyche to shatter into many shards with different agendas, and the one who saved Vulkan may not have had the same agenda as the original Magnus.

Yeah, the Rubric affected the Marines, not Magnus himself. And not even all of them, the more powerful sorcerors survived.


With regards to the original question, there's no way Magnus would have joined Horus otherwise. He had too much in common with dear old dad, and frankly, was far too arrogant to ever listen to such talk.I mean, can you imagine Lorgar or Fulgrim coming to tell him about the wonders of the Chaos powers? He'd have laughed them off as rank amateurs in warpcraft, and weak in the head to boot.

 Ketara wrote:

 Ashenwyte wrote:

 Brennonjw wrote:
It's also good to note that Magnus goes out of his way to save Vulkan in one of the Salamander books post-Curze, so even if parts of his legion went full traitor, it's still debatable that he did.

The Rubric caused Magnus' psyche to shatter into many shards with different agendas, and the one who saved Vulkan may not have had the same agenda as the original Magnus.

Yeah, the Rubric affected the Marines, not Magnus himself. And not even all of them, the more powerful sorcerors survived.


With regards to the original question, there's no way Magnus would have joined Horus otherwise. He had too much in common with dear old dad, and frankly, was far too arrogant to ever listen to such talk.I mean, can you imagine Lorgar or Fulgrim coming to tell him about the wonders of the Chaos powers? He'd have laughed them off as rank amateurs in warpcraft, and weak in the head to boot.

Newer fluff actually has the rubric also affecting Magnus.

Tacohunter wrote:

 Ketara wrote:

 Ashenwyte wrote:

 Brennonjw wrote:
It's also good to note that Magnus goes out of his way to save Vulkan in one of the Salamander books post-Curze, so even if parts of his legion went full traitor, it's still debatable that he did.

The Rubric caused Magnus' psyche to shatter into many shards with different agendas, and the one who saved Vulkan may not have had the same agenda as the original Magnus.

Yeah, the Rubric affected the Marines, not Magnus himself. And not even all of them, the more powerful sorcerors survived.


With regards to the original question, there's no way Magnus would have joined Horus otherwise. He had too much in common with dear old dad, and frankly, was far too arrogant to ever listen to such talk.I mean, can you imagine Lorgar or Fulgrim coming to tell him about the wonders of the Chaos powers? He'd have laughed them off as rank amateurs in warpcraft, and weak in the head to boot.

Newer fluff actually has the rubric also affecting Magnus.

Even if it does, the timeline doesn't match. The Rubric wasn't performed until after Magnus saved Vulkan.

 Ketara wrote:

Tacohunter wrote:

 Ketara wrote:

 Ashenwyte wrote:

 Brennonjw wrote:
It's also good to note that Magnus goes out of his way to save Vulkan in one of the Salamander books post-Curze, so even if parts of his legion went full traitor, it's still debatable that he did.

The Rubric caused Magnus' psyche to shatter into many shards with different agendas, and the one who saved Vulkan may not have had the same agenda as the original Magnus.

Yeah, the Rubric affected the Marines, not Magnus himself. And not even all of them, the more powerful sorcerors survived.


With regards to the original question, there's no way Magnus would have joined Horus otherwise. He had too much in common with dear old dad, and frankly, was far too arrogant to ever listen to such talk.I mean, can you imagine Lorgar or Fulgrim coming to tell him about the wonders of the Chaos powers? He'd have laughed them off as rank amateurs in warpcraft, and weak in the head to boot.

Newer fluff actually has the rubric also affecting Magnus.

Even if it does, the timeline doesn't match. The Rubric wasn't performed until after Magnus saved Vulkan.

Oh I fully agree with you, I was only pointing out that Magnus was affected by the Rubric.

Can someone explain this whole fragments of Magnus thing ? I've seen more and more references to that part of fluff recently on different forums, but I don't really get it.

The way I understood it was that the damage done to Magnus during the Burning of Prospero (which saw his physical body destroyed and him become a purely psychic being) also caused him to fracture into different personalities which each represented the same psyche and were connected to one and other. Whether these personalities existed independent from one and other, or fought for dominance against each other I'm not sure. Its the reason Magnus took so long to choose a side and kept switching between different courses of action for so long. Take this with a pinch of salt though because I'm taking a break from the series just now and am a bit behind as well (Pharos is the next book I need to read)

IIRC magnus's mind wasn't wholly "shattered" by the rubric, just the fact that it was what really tossed him over the edge of dispair.

As for the timing: we know he was split and a part of him was left on prospero, but Khan (being the best buddy and great guy he was) let that split go. I might be out of the loop, but that was the only real splintering during the heresy, no?