Switch Theme:

Strength 5 is the new black!  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





UK

I have been thinking about the new to-wound chart and it seems that S5 occupies a sweet spot in many ways.

Against T4 infantry (which seem to make up about 75% of the models on the table), it wounds on a 3+. You have to go up to S8 now to wound MEQs on a 2+. Also S5 is the lowest strength that will wound T8 (the toughest we have seen in the game so far) on a 5+.

This means that things like power axes (+1S, -2AP) seem to be the ideal choice for combat units although if they have access to other Strength boosting modifiers (Blood Angel's Grail for example), then power weapons are better. By comparison, the jump from S5 to S6 brings far fewer benefits.

I stand between the darkness and the light. Between the candle and the star. 
   
Made in us
Potent Possessed Daemonvessel





Depends S6 is better against T3 which makes up a lot of base infantry in the game (Tau, Guard, Nids, Sisters, Eldar). I think in reality there are far fewer sweet spots than there used to be I think there are just a few weak spots (S7 is fairly weak in comparison to S6 or 8 as T6 is not super common compared to lower T models, and T7 is as common or more.) T8 is also fairly rare, so that S5 buff is not huge of S4 on the high end. The biggest advantage is against wounding T4. (which is not realistically 75% of the models as unless you are in a marine heavy meta, T4 is not common across most races.)

Majority T4 armies - Marines, CSM*, Orks, Necrons
Majority T3 armies - Eldar, DE, IG/AM, Imperial Agents (including sisters), Adeptus Mechanicus, Tau** , Nids***, GSC, Daemons (most troops t3.)


* CSM could have lots of T3 cultists/poxwalkers

**Tau can go either way, their chaff and base infantry is T3, but a suit heavy army would be T5*

***Nids can go either way, a Genestealer/warrior heavy army can be mostly T4, a MC heavy build obviously more, but the little bugs are all T3.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





S6 is definitely the magic number, not S5.

There are more than a few T5 & T6 tanks which would be sweet(ish) spots for S6

Being able to completely wreck T3 is pretty significant too.
Not to mention a ton of T5 Elite units across nearly every army.

I would say S5 is a significant upgrade to S4,
but S6 is an even bigger upgrade to S5.

S7 is only a mediocre upgrade to S6,
while S8 is another significant upgrade to S7.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/16 21:35:11



6+ = 6/36 | Reroll 1s = 7/36 | Reroll Misses = 11/36 ||||||| 5+ = 12/36 | Reroll 1s 14/36 | Reroll Misses = 20/36 ||||||| 4+ = 18/36 | Reroll 1s 21/36 | Reroll Misses = 27/36
3+ = 24/36 | Reroll 1s 28/36 | Reroll Misses = 32/36 ||||||| 2+ = 30/36 | Reroll 1s 35/36 ||||||| Highest of 2d6 = 4.47
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




S5-6 is definitely good, but you also have to take AP and enemy saves into account when you are thinking about what is good, more-so with the power weapons than shooting weapons.

For example, power swords are better vs Rhinos, and just as good vs terminators and guardsmen, as power axes are. They are also only .018 wounds per attack worse vs marines than axes because they have AP3 vs the Axe's AP2, making them actually better on a wounds caused per point basis (although this isn't something you can always use to determine what is better, i think it is good to know).
   
Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut




I'd point out that you rarely actually want to be shooting S6 guns at T3 units. You tend to pay much more for the S6 than the extra 25% chance to wound over S4 is worth. My impression so far has been that, actually, S5-7 are not that valuable.

You want lots of S4 because it deals really well with T3 and T4, and then it's actually just as good against T7 as S5 and S6 and just as good against T6 as S5. S4's in this sweet spot where it's cheap and common but still wounds almost everything on at least a 5+. And then you want some S8+ mostly for the rare T8 things you'll run into. Ultimately S8 is still only twice as effective as S4 against T7.

That said, obviously AP and damage are really important considerations too. But I'd definitely take a 1 point AP boost over an S4->S5 upgrade, and probably even over an S4->S6 upgrade. My perspective on this might be a bit skewed because I play Eldar, though, and the shuriken rule means that my S4 guns are surprisingly good against high toughness relative to my S6 guns. I'm definitely happier with the shuriken rule than I'd be with the Tau's extra point of strength.
   
Made in gb
Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan



UK

So basically, what we're all saying is....

Str 5-6 + 8 + 10 is the new black.

So having a plethora of str 5-6 + str 10 weapons and you are sorted.

(Yes Str 5 vs T3 is only 3+ but you might assume Str 5 is available in greater quantities, lets say the difference between 67% and 84% ? )

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Friend of mine just sent me this:

"The Tyranid Codex, where I learned the truth about despair, as will you. There's a reason why this codex is the worst hell on earth... Hope. ."
Too be fair.. it's all worked out quite well!

Heh.  
   
 
Forum Index » 40K General Discussion
Go to: