Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I'm hardly an experienced player. Yet it looks to me that the Conqueror tank in the new FW AM Index seems to be a really attractive tank option.

You get a Leman Russ hull, a battle cannon (albeit with 2/3 the range), a free coaxial storm Bolter that buffs the ability to hit with said cannon, all for a rather measly price.

I could see an AM force spamming these--decent firepower and good survivability at a good price. Again, though, I'm not all that experienced!

How would you use these:

- Barebones with just a hull HB? Spam in large numbers?

- HB sponsons and storm Bolter and maybe HK missile for max cheap weapons? Still a pretty good price though you couldn't spam quite as many.

- A cheap "base configuration" for a more expensive sponson/hull weapon loadout, like las cannons or plasma?

- Other?

Real Guard need nothing more than regular stock Leman Russ to get the job done! Well, back in my day all we had was a tin can, shoestring, and a lascannon jurryrigged to a mirror...

I can't comment but I see Leman Russes of all types more as "distraction carnifexs" then actual damage dealers. Is it significantly more points then a typical cheap full sponson lr(over 200ish)??

The Conqueror seems better than the LRBT in every way other than range. I think it will become my standard TAC Russ. I would run with a Lascannon and 2 HBs, classic and versatile. HKM is now not a bad option at all. They are what, 6 pts each? Seems like a pretty good way to increase the power of your alpha strike, if you have enough vehicles to mount them on.

For those of us who didn't buy the books of the filthy 'God' Emperor *spits*, what makes the conqueror better than the basic battle tank?

 mrhappyface wrote:
For those of us who didn't buy the books of the filthy 'God' Emperor *spits*, what makes the conqueror better than the basic battle tank?

The Conqueror's battle cannon is range 48" D6 shots, Str 8, AP-2, D3 damage (same as a regular battle cannon, other than the shorter range) and it gets a built in coaxial storm bolter which, if the storm bolter hits, allows the BC to re-roll it's hits against the same target. Other than that it is the same as a LRBT except cheaper by, I believe, 19 points!

If you wanted to spam the basic Conqueror, with just the heavy Bolter in the hull, you could fit 12 of them, plus two Tank Commanders each with only a heavy Bolter in the hull and either an Executioner or Punisher cannon, in a 2000 point list.

Maybe run it as two Spearhead detachments, each with 1 Tank Commander and three Conqueror squadrons of two tanks each.

You'd still have 14 points left over, actually. Put a storm Bolter on 7 of the tanks for fun.

That's 14 tanks. 168 Toughness 8 wounds with 3+ saves all around. Tough to kill, anyway!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh, and RAW, I don't even think the coaxial storm Bolter has to hit. You simply need to select the same target for the Conqueror cannon as the coax. "If during the same Shooting Phase this model fires its Conqueror battle cannon at the same target as its co-axial storm Bolter, it may re-roll any hit rolls with its Conqueror battle Cannon."

Same for the Vanquisher coax too, I think...

I don't have the rules in front of me but that is a great point, and makes it even better.

Run them with 3 flamers and an extra stormbolter. Laugh as you grind the enemy under your tracks. You don't even need tank commanders as you have mostly flamers so don't benefit from the orders much anyway. 188 is pretty cheap for a battlecannon, 3 flamers and 2 stormbolters. Basically use them as linebreakers, backed up by infantry or mechanised infantry following behind.

The funny thing is most of the good units are no longer for sale while most of the stuff they still sell has substandard rules. Think FW missed a trick there.

Is it faster than the regular LRBT like it used to be?

 mtcwalker wrote:
Is it faster than the regular LRBT like it used to be?

Nope. It does get grinding advance though. The old conqueror didn't get lumbering behemoth.

Honestly, I wonder if the Conqueror cost is an error.

The Conqueror hull, before wargear is added, is 22 points less than the stock Leman Russ hull before wargear. Yet it's precisely the same--toughness, wounds, movement, damage chart. Why the difference? Not sure--but it's very odd that the difference just so happens to be the cost of a regular Leman Russ battlecannon.

It's as if FW subtracted the battlecannon cost to get down the the "real" cost of the hull, forgetting at that moment that the battlecannon is no longer included in the Leman Russ hull. Why would they forget that? Well, some of their other vehicles' main ordnance is built into the cost of the hull (Stygies Vanquisher, for instance). That makes me think that partway through design and play testing the Leman Russ had its ordnance "baked in" to the cost, but that was then changed, causing confusion at FW.

Anyway, I hope they don't errata this...

Can you take a Mars Pattern conqueror? That would be tasty

 mtcwalker wrote:
Can you take a Mars Pattern conqueror? That would be tasty

Yes. But the Grinding Advance rule does not apply for the Conqueror Battle Cannon nor the Twin Lascannon in this case, because they couldn't be arsed to proofread it. It also cost 132 (same as normal Leman Russ or Mars-Alpha ones) without weapon, so 22 more for the body than the normal Conqueror. So they're probably going to update the Conqueror body, if they ever get around to fixing the book.

 shelldrake wrote:
Honestly, I wonder if the Conqueror cost is an error.

Sounds about right. They seem to have made the opposite error with the thunderer. 170 points base but then you add the 40 point demolisher. A leman russ demolisher is like 172 all before you add the hull weapon. The only difference is orders swapping for 1 extra wound.

 Aenarian wrote:

 mtcwalker wrote:
Can you take a Mars Pattern conqueror? That would be tasty

Yes. But the Grinding Advance rule does not apply for the Conqueror Battle Cannon nor the Twin Lascannon in this case, because they couldn't be arsed to proof read it.

Even worse, you have to take the Conqueror Battle Cannon and coax at full price on top of the regular Mars Alpha starting hull cost--there's no discounted Conqueror stock hull available to the DKoK, Mars Alpha or otherwise. So no cost saving and you lose Grinding advance.

Trickstick wrote:

 shelldrake wrote:
Honestly, I wonder if the Conqueror cost is an error.

Sounds about right. They seem to have made the opposite error with the thunderer. 170 points base but then you add the 40 point demolisher. A leman russ demolisher is like 172 all before you add the hull weapon. The only difference is orders swapping for 1 extra wound.

You know that one wound is worth the sacrifice of orders and 38 points extra. It's not as if every other Leman Russ pays about 10-11 points per wound (for the base body without weapons)

shelldrake wrote:

 Aenarian wrote:

 mtcwalker wrote:
Can you take a Mars Pattern conqueror? That would be tasty

Yes. But the Grinding Advance rule does not apply for the Conqueror Battle Cannon nor the Twin Lascannon in this case, because they couldn't be arsed to proof read it.

Even worse, you have to take the Conqueror Battle Cannon and coax at full price on top of the regular Mars Alpha starting hull cost--there's no discounted Conqueror stock hull available to the DKoK, Mars Alpha or otherwise. So no cost saving and you lose Grinding advance.

Yes, I edited the post. Honestly, the Conqueror price is a mistake and will most likely be rectified. There's no reason to take most other Russes when you compare the prices, apart from maybe the Punisher, if you get a chassi costing 17% less.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Loopstah wrote:
The funny thing is most of the good units are no longer for sale while most of the stuff they still sell has substandard rules. Think FW missed a trick there.

You could pretty easily convert the Stygies Vanquisher turret if you really wanted a special one. Or one of the plastic ones.

But mars patterns get that sweet +1 to armor save vs bolters and anything weaker!