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Made in us
Been Around the Block




If i scratch build IG vehicles, will they be tournament legal for GW events and ITC?
   
Made in us
Prescient Cryptek of Eternity





New Bedford, MA USA

I honestly would assume the quality of the scratch build matters.

If it's the Right size, easily distinguished, and looks cool, why not ?

   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




You mean, not easily distinguished?
   
Made in se
Swift Swooping Hawk





dbecer01 wrote:
You mean, not easily distinguished?

It needs to be easily distinguished as the tank it's supposed to be. If it's supposed to be a Chimera, it needs to look like a Chimera more than anything else.

In the end, it's really up to the TO whether to allow these things, and your odds of acceptance probably increase dramatically with the quality of the scratch build.

Craftworld Sciatháin 4180 pts  
   
Made in nl
Regular Dakkanaut





like cream tea said, discuss it with the to. It doesn't realy matter what the rest of us think about it. I for one wouldn't have a problem with a scratch build as long as you can see what its supposed to be and when you field multiple different kind of scratch builds that you can clearly see the difference between the two. So if you field both a chimera and lemman russ, then they need to look different

 
   
Made in us
Powerful Pegasus Knight






As long as the majority of bits are GW that you have tacked on - and look like the original vehicle. The Leman Russ below would be fine



 
   
Made in us
Krazed Killa Kan






State of Jefferson

Yes. "Rule of cool" applies everywhere but games workshop. Using green plastic army men Shermans would likely be unacceptable. Card board box.... legos.... etc... no.

Otherwise Measure in opponents favor and no MFA. Youre golden. That Leman Russ above is ridiculously good. Not the community standard.
   
Made in us
Storm Trooper with Maglight





Georgia

 doktor_g wrote:
Yes. "Rule of cool" applies everywhere but games workshop. Using green plastic army men Shermans would likely be unacceptable. Card board box.... legos.... etc... no.

Otherwise Measure in opponents favor and no MFA. Youre golden. That Leman Russ above is ridiculously good. Not the community standard.


Not even Lego?!

Spoiler:

Vorradis 75th "Crimson Cavaliers" 8.7k

The enemies of Mankind may employ dark sciences or alien weapons beyond Humanity's ken, but such deviance comes to naught in the face of honest human intolerance back by a sufficient number of guns. 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Thanks guys. I'll speak with the TO. I also like the scratch built LR and the lego LR


The only thing is that I will probably not have too many GW pieces on it. I was trying to go for this (not sure if I have the skill, but I was going to give it a shot): https://creativetwilight.com/scratch-built-devil-dog-painted/


The only thing holding me back, is the fact that I can't cut in straight lines :X

That, and that I suck at modeling in general, and my painting is still mediocre.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/10/18 03:48:03


 
   
Made in au
[MOD]
Cutting stuff up and bunging it back together in new and interesting ways.






Under the couch

 Cream Tea wrote:

It needs to be easily distinguished as the tank it's supposed to be. If it's supposed to be a Chimera, it needs to look like a Chimera more than anything else.

This isn't necessarily accurate.

It's not specifically that it needs to look like a Chimera, but it should have more or less the same profile (for LOS reasons) and it should be easy for your opponent to tell what your vehicles are supposed to be. If your scratch-built not-Russ looks more or less the same as your scratch-built not-Chimera, or all of your scratch-built not-Chimeras and variants look different, that's where you run into problems.

   
Made in gr
Longtime Dakkanaut




Halandri

When Nick Bayton ran the Warhammer World events the rule was if there is an official kit you must use that.

For a while, at least, if you made a conversion you had to send pix first for green flagging.

I'm not sure if any of that still stands anymore.
   
Made in in
[MOD]
Illuminati






New Delhi, India

Some tournaments have had trouble with rep armies.

IE I want to play Eldar Exodites so this dinosaur is a Wraithlord and that Dinosaur is a Falcon etc.

Always best to check and be as friendly as possible with your opponents. If you're doing something really out there handouts can help a lot.

 
   
Made in us
[MOD]
Friendly Peat Beast






The Great Marsh

nareik wrote:
When Nick Bayton ran the Warhammer World events

There's a big difference in playing at a GW store (there to sell you only their models) and elsewhere. At every major tourney I've been to I've seen (and sometimes run) sweet counts-as models. Rule of cool, as previously stated, is the main factor. Others include being able to easily know what it is, and getting permission ahead of time. I always did this, and never had problems!

That said, it doesn't sound like you've done scratch builds before, and the reason might be that you just don't want to get the kit. In the end that probably won't meet the above criteria, imo. But you can always give it a shot and see how it turns out!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/18 11:47:34


 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




nareik wrote:
When Nick Bayton ran the Warhammer World events the rule was if there is an official kit you must use that.


Those that do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it...

I remember when they were running some of their first GTs for 4th ed (?) IIRC and there was a clause in the tournament pack that said all armies MUST consist of current models, so anything in your army which had been replaced by a newer sculpt (this was also around the time of the infamous Striking Bunny Rabbit models) was now no longer allowed.

People kicked up a fething stink about it, (and rightly so) and GW backed down.


I find that ruling slightly funny seeing as this is the same Nick Bayton which saw me and my friend playing Epic Armageddon up there and was in awe of my friend's =][= Witch hunter superheavy (which I'd made for him) using a scale model of St Paul's cathedral as a base (for reference it was about 70-80mm long), granted there were no official models, but it's just something that amused me seeing as where we were using it was Warhammer World.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/18 17:31:23


 
   
Made in ie
Dominating Dominatrix






Dublin, Ireland

I would SO play with or against that Lego LR!

Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be

By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.

"Feelin' goods, good enough". 
   
Made in fi
Fixture of Dakka





nareik wrote:
When Nick Bayton ran the Warhammer World events the rule was if there is an official kit you must use that.

For a while, at least, if you made a conversion you had to send pix first for green flagging.

I'm not sure if any of that still stands anymore.


Not in Finland at least. GW rules applies only in GW run tournaments of which there are none here and I think there's like 1 official GW store whose gaming activity I have no idea.

Elsewhere I have seen anime mecha's used as either riptides or wraithknights(don't recall which one). So at least here it's generally fairly loose. But that's up to tournament. Most strict are going to be officially GW run ones 'cause they want people to buy their models(surprise surprise). Non-GW tournaments have no advertisement angle to drive so it's more of what's enjoyable for tournament which means rule of cool and how easy it is to tell what it represents and does user gain in game advantage over fielding official models.

“Nothing has a definite nature, so people cannot be purely evil. Even so-called evil people will aspire to follow a moral path when they feel a sense of community.” – Kukai

6700 pts
5150 pts  
   
Made in gr
Longtime Dakkanaut




Halandri

Hey guys, note those rules were ONLY for official events at WHW.

In practice they were good rules; They seemed pretty open to allowing cool and understandable conversions/proxies.

I think the rule was as much there to stop silly proxies being used as it was to appease GW's Sales-houds!

Nick is a great guy and upstanding individual based on my own limited interactions with him.

I have played TONNES of games at WHW over a span of years and I have never had anyone shame or ban any of my unofficial models.

The closest I had was when a couple of the old guard designers laughed at Rogue Trader era rhinos, saying they were laughably small, then when they got closer they were like "ey-up, these are a little big actually!" because they were scratbuilt RH1n0s I had upscaled to match the more modern model range.

They then spent about 20 minutes eyeing them over, looking at how I had fabricated the details, if I managed to balance the tracks well, etc. It was pretty entertaining.

Oh then I got regaled with nostalgic anecdotes about how they had to design a tank that only required a single sprue frame, they had taken all day and got no where, but in the pub after work they realised they could just include 2 copies of the same sprue if they made the components highly symmetrical.

In the end they did a rough sketch on the back of a beer coaster / napkin (they disagreed on this detail) and that became the infamous plastic rogue trader rhino!

They both refused to take credit for the phone-in job because in retrospect they thought it was a pretty crappy model .
   
Made in gb
Junior Officer with Laspistol






I reckon I could plonk my scratch builds on the table in a game against a FW designer and they'd not spot the difference!

I scratch-built a Macharius Vulcan, Thunderbolt and Spartan! Have a peek at the build and my painting progress here: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/90/513429.page

My all-plastic Praetorian build log: http://bit.ly/1K7gn7J

People who say "special snowflake" a lot tend to be unpleasant people.

 
   
Made in us
Prescient Cryptek of Eternity





New Bedford, MA USA

The only time I ever refused to play against a "scratch built" model was back during the VDR days and someone showed up with a 5" tall Terminator Action figure, with plasma guns hot glued to his shoulders, on a 6" base, that was supposed to be a Necron Titan

   
Made in gb
Legendary Dogfighter



London

GW is not against scratch builds and conversions. The thing they really hate is third party models. Or even bits of them being used in scratch builds and conversions. Oh and anything unpainted.

If you're going to Warhammer World the event pack will set out their policy and give you an email address for questions. If going to a shop, ask the manager.

   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




 adamsouza wrote:
The only time I ever refused to play against a "scratch built" model was back during the VDR days and someone showed up with a 5" tall Terminator Action figure, with plasma guns hot glued to his shoulders, on a 6" base, that was supposed to be a Necron Titan


But why? Aside from the shoddy build which maybe put you off, that was literally what the VDR was for. All of the weapons were presumably represented on the model (which was the only proviso of the VDR). Just because it wasn't to your tastes is no reason to deny it when the guy followed the rules given in the VDR
   
Made in us
Deranged Necron Destroyer





Back in 6th I played against a guy at the Nova Open who replaced his entire Chaos Daemon army with pet shop aquarium items. It was very cool looking but I couldn't for the life of me remember what each item translated to in the chaos army
   
Made in us
Prescient Cryptek of Eternity





New Bedford, MA USA

Ruin wrote:

But why? .......Just because it wasn't to your tastes is no reason to deny it when the guy followed the rules given in the VDR


If I was going to sit through being target practice for someone's home brewed titan, it needs to at least titan sized.

This thing was puny compared to a modern Imperial Knight Model, but had stats better than a Warhound Titan.

Scratch builds need to be comparable to existing models in at least scale.

   
Made in es
Furious Fire Dragon





 RiTides wrote:
nareik wrote:
When Nick Bayton ran the Warhammer World events

There's a big difference in playing at a GW store (there to sell you only their models) and elsewhere. At every major tourney I've been to I've seen (and sometimes run) sweet counts-as models. Rule of cool, as previously stated, is the main factor. Others include being able to easily know what it is, and getting permission ahead of time. I always did this, and never had problems!

That said, it doesn't sound like you've done scratch builds before, and the reason might be that you just don't want to get the kit. In the end that probably won't meet the above criteria, imo. But you can always give it a shot and see how it turns out!



Worth to notice in the latest set of rules for tournaments, they added that if you bring some cool conversion that can cast doubt about what unit it is you may try to bring a sheet with pics of the models stating wich units represent for quick reference for your oponents.
   
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[MOD]
Friendly Peat Beast






The Great Marsh

That's a good rule - and is exactly what I would do when running a large converted army (making an army list with pics incorporated into it).

What rules packet are you referring to, though - the one for events at Warhammer World, or something else?
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




 necron99 wrote:
Back in 6th I played against a guy at the Nova Open who replaced his entire Chaos Daemon army with pet shop aquarium items. It was very cool looking but I couldn't for the life of me remember what each item translated to in the chaos army



Hahahaha! Are you serious?! You should've taken a pic! I think I might complain about that one...
   
Made in fi
Fixture of Dakka





dbecer01 wrote:
 necron99 wrote:
Back in 6th I played against a guy at the Nova Open who replaced his entire Chaos Daemon army with pet shop aquarium items. It was very cool looking but I couldn't for the life of me remember what each item translated to in the chaos army



Hahahaha! Are you serious?! You should've taken a pic! I think I might complain about that one...


Well whatabout tzeentch daemon army out of play-doh. True story. And people complain GW games are too expensive

“Nothing has a definite nature, so people cannot be purely evil. Even so-called evil people will aspire to follow a moral path when they feel a sense of community.” – Kukai

6700 pts
5150 pts  
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Well, at least they put some work into it, hehehe.
   
Made in us
Prescient Cryptek of Eternity





New Bedford, MA USA

Back in 7th Edition, when you could summon Daemons for no points, I built a Daemon army using no GW models. I used 100 daemons converted from Mage Knight, ALL of the same nonhuman species as Pink Horrors, and much larger models in a Grey color scheme as Greater Deamons of Slaanesh.

I had one opponent constantly complain they weren't GW models, so how could be expected to tell them apart.

"Well the short pink ones are Pink horrors, the giant gray ones are Greater Deamons of Slaanesh, and the huge blue bird guy with 2 heads is Fateweaver"
Spoiler:




This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/23 14:15:12


   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Sounds like that guy was showing a lot of brand loyalty.
   
 
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