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I was looking at things in GW I could use as reasonable variants for bloodthirsters (not that I dont like the model, I was just curious) and the Balrog model from The Hobbit really looks gnarly. Issue is, I know Hobbit is a fairly smaller scale. Is it Bloodthirster size, or more in line with a DP?

Smaller. Definitely more DP sized than BT.

If it's at least the size of the older BT I'd allow it as a BT. Otherwise I'd say DP.

It use to work when the BT had the old 3rd edition model, but now that thing is tiiiiny compared to the current Bloodthirster so I would say no.

Would still look great as a Be'lakor stand-in though.

I know a guy who has a couple of Balrog-Bloodthirsters. I think he converted them when the old metal Thirster was still the only one. The model works, but it is indeed way smaller than the current awesome Bloodthirster model.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
It use to work when the BT had the old 3rd edition model, but now that thing is tiiiiny compared to the current Bloodthirster so I would say no.

Would still look great as a Be'lakor stand-in though.

So, if I had an actual BT older(finecast) model would you not allow it as a BT because it's not as big as the newer one?

I 'd say its fine. It's bigger than the old bloodthirster, and I'd say the old bloodthirster is fine, too. It's clear what the model is, and the wings are large enough to make them difficult to hide anyways.

The new greater daemons are crazy sized anyways. Cool, but crazy sized.

 chimeara wrote:
So, if I had an actual BT older(finecast) model would you not allow it as a BT because it's not as big as the newer one?

I believe this is a different situation - the model you have is, and always was a Bloodthirster. Yes the new model is larger, but that doesn't invalidate your old model. If someone was to go out and buy the older model today on eBay because they wanted the retro look (like I've done with the old Daemonettes), then you can't tell someone they can't use it because it's not the latest model.

I would allow it simply because it's hard for a unit that sized to take advantage of cover. The size difference won't really make a difference.

 Raichase wrote:

 chimeara wrote:
So, if I had an actual BT older(finecast) model would you not allow it as a BT because it's not as big as the newer one?

I believe this is a different situation - the model you have is, and always was a Bloodthirster. Yes the new model is larger, but that doesn't invalidate your old model. If someone was to go out and buy the older model today on eBay because they wanted the retro look (like I've done with the old Daemonettes), then you can't tell someone they can't use it because it's not the latest model.

I see, that makes sense. I sorta had a moment of panic that for some reason there were people (not necessarily you) that would disallow the old model just because of it's size.

Any conversion of a model that is at least as big as the previous version of that model should ALWAYS be acceptable.
In this case, the Balrog is BIGGER that the old metal/finecast 'Thirster (which IS an acceptable model), so anyone saying that is cannot be used as a 'Thirster just because the current version to too darn big is not a player worth your time.

If you are truly worried about not "modeling for advantage", than simply get the oval base a place a large rock on it for the Balrog to be on. That way you get the base size and height to be the same as the current model, yet get the satisfaction of converting a really cool model that is probably a better size representation of the 'Thirster's rules.

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I have the original Great Unclean One, too small these days so I use it as a Daemon Prince, would be tournament legal however as the GUO.
I'd not have a problem playing a Balrog used a Bloodthirster but it's not technically allowed so double check with your opponent first

 chimeara wrote:

 Raichase wrote:

 chimeara wrote:
So, if I had an actual BT older(finecast) model would you not allow it as a BT because it's not as big as the newer one?

I believe this is a different situation - the model you have is, and always was a Bloodthirster. Yes the new model is larger, but that doesn't invalidate your old model. If someone was to go out and buy the older model today on eBay because they wanted the retro look (like I've done with the old Daemonettes), then you can't tell someone they can't use it because it's not the latest model.

I see, that makes sense. I sorta had a moment of panic that for some reason there were people (not necessarily you) that would disallow the old model just because of it's size.

My train of thought is that: Was it an official model of the thing?

If yes, then it's allowed regardless of size.

If no, then be prepared to make accommodations.

GW models have grown considerably over time, and, even without intention, a lot of models would not be suitable for what they were originally converted for. For an extreme example, if going strictly by "bigger than an older official model", I can use an unmodified Tyranid Warrior as a Hive Tyrant, since the 2nd edition version of that thing really was that small (I actually use my old hive tyrant as a Prime). Most people won't have a problem if you explain, but they're not being unreasonable for not accepting either.

Tangentially, I should also mention that GW use to have a contract with Warner Bros that they don't like people mixing their licensed models with warhammer. This is not an issue in LFGS but they use to ban models that were converted with parts from both ranges in GW stores. Not sure if they're still doing it but it should be noted in case you do play at GW stores.

 Galef wrote:
Any conversion of a model that is at least as big as the previous version of that model should ALWAYS be acceptable.
In this case, the Balrog is BIGGER that the old metal/finecast 'Thirster (which IS an acceptable model), so anyone saying that is cannot be used as a 'Thirster just because the current version to too darn big is not a player worth your time.

If you are truly worried about not "modeling for advantage", than simply get the oval base a place a large rock on it for the Balrog to be on. That way you get the base size and height to be the same as the current model, yet get the satisfaction of converting a really cool model that is probably a better size representation of the 'Thirster's rules.

-

This is probably the best way to approach it that I've seen.

Not to mention I forgot the "rule of cool". If a Balrogthirster looks damned badass, then I'm onboard for sure! I love playing games against gorgeous armies.