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After half-a-dozen games in 8th, I've come to the conclusion that my Tau infantry mean well, but I don't have enough of them to really make a difference on the battlefield. Last night, for example, my Firewarriors survived a charge by Chaos Cultists, but proceeded to just take potshots at Plague Marines the entire game with little effect. With that in mind, I've re-tooled my list to fully embrace the one thing I really like ... having all my eggs in one basket and watching the heck out of those baskets.

HQ (42)
1) Cadre Fireblade
- Markerlight, Pulse Rifle, Photon Grenades

ELITE (708)
1) XV95 Ghostkeel Suit
- Fusion Collider, 2x Fusion Blaster, Target Lock, Shield Generator
- 2x MV5 Stealth Drones

2) 6x Stealthsuits:
- 4x Burst Cannons with Advanced Targeting Systems
- 2x Fusion Blasters

3) 6x Stealthsuits:
- 4x Burst Cannons with Advanced Targeting Systems
- 2x Fusion Blasters

HEAVY SUPPORT (250)
1) 1x XV88 Broadside
- Advanced Targeting System, High-Yield Missile Pod, Smart Missile Systems
- 2x Missile Drones

The main difference between this list and my old list is that I've cut out all of my infantry units and replaced them with a Broadside to offer some long-range fire support. At the moment, I don't actually have a Broadside model so I was wondering what Dakka's thoughts were before I went out to grab one.

For reference, my old list was something like this ...
- Cadre Fireblade
- Full squad of Firewarriors
- 2x Minimum squads of Pathfinders with 2 Drones each
- Ghostkeel
- 2x Full Units of Stealth Suits as above, but also with 2 Gun Drones and a Drone Controller

Looks interesting, but a few questions. I'm at work and don't have my index in front of me, but i hadn't looked at the stealth suits yet this edition much. Can they take dual weapons? they may not have been able to in 7th unless i'm just that silly. And, do you not mind having 0 command points? 3rd, why the cadre fireblade? for a suit based small point list like this, wouldn't an ethereal be better? he can make the suits re-roll ones too. But about the broadsides, Missle fists have worked really well for me so far. Silly amounts of damage output, they rip through infantry like butter and can put the hurt on some mid range armour as well.

Stealth Suits can not take dual weapons. They can take a Fusion Blaster or Burst Cannon with a Systems Upgrade.

Vakruz wrote:Looks interesting, but a few questions. I'm at work and don't have my index in front of me, but i hadn't looked at the stealth suits yet this edition much. Can they take dual weapons? they may not have been able to in 7th unless i'm just that silly. And, do you not mind having 0 command points? 3rd, why the cadre fireblade? for a suit based small point list like this, wouldn't an ethereal be better? he can make the suits re-roll ones too. But about the broadsides, Missle fists have worked really well for me so far. Silly amounts of damage output, they rip through infantry like butter and can put the hurt on some mid range armour as well.

The Greater Good Templar wrote:Stealth Suits can not take dual weapons. They can take a Fusion Blaster or Burst Cannon with a Systems Upgrade.

1) Yup, The Greater Good Templar is correct, Stealth Suits can only take one weapon, but regardless of which weapon they can still take a support system.

2) I believe I still get 4 Command Points through having a battle forged army using the Vanguard detachment.

3) The Cadre Fireblade was the only HQ I had on hand and I literally cannot find the extra 3 points for an Ethereal. Plus I like how he at least gives me the one Markerlight. My Stealthy suits will be out of range of any potential Ethereal anyway.

Thanks for the heads up about the Broadsides!

I always forget about the vanguard and the other detachments, my local area's events always req a battalion my bad on that one. But yea i see the point now of at least having 1 markerlight. I still need to buy me a ghostkheel though, always wanted to try one out, and i love the model

Yea the Ghostkeel is also my second favorite Tau Suit but I have mine geared with cyclic ion raker, fusion, target lock, and shield generator. I do really like Stealth Suits but from what I hear from more experienced tau players that they are basically road blocks for Melee armies. They always recommend burst cannons with no upgrades

Vakruz wrote:I always forget about the vanguard and the other detachments, my local area's events always req a battalion my bad on that one. But yea i see the point now of at least having 1 markerlight. I still need to buy me a ghostkheel though, always wanted to try one out, and i love the model

The Greater Good Templar wrote:Yea the Ghostkeel is also my second favorite Tau Suit but I have mine geared with cyclic ion raker, fusion, target lock, and shield generator. I do really like Stealth Suits but from what I hear from more experienced tau players that they are basically road blocks for Melee armies. They always recommend burst cannons with no upgrades

@Vakruz: The Ghostkeel is pretty darn amazing. The only downside is that it hits on a 4+ so you have to support it with markerlights or use a command point for a re-roll to increase the number of hits. However, its stealth ability and the stealth drones makes it a fething annoying distraction carnifex for your opponent and, with the shield generator, it becomes ridiculously difficult to take down without your opponent literally firing everything they have on it.

@Greater Good Templar: I like having the ATS on my burst cannons as it gives it just a little bit more punch (so now I'm essentially packing Assault 4 Heavy Bolters on each suit). However, each ATS is worth one Gun Drone, so I'd be curious if someone ran the numbers for a squad of six stealth suits with burst cannons and ATS vs. a squad of six stealth suits with burst cannons and an accompanying unit of six gun drones. In typing that out, my money is actually on the suits with the gun drones now ...

I have been doing a bunch of mathhammer for my friend who plays Tau to crunch numbers on crisis suits, drones, commanders, etc.
He has been using his 2 stealth teams with homing beacons and stim injectors to allow crisis suits and commanders pop in close to enemy characters to pop them. Crisis stuff might be too expensive for 1000 points though.

Against most infantry taking more burst cannons gives you more damage than an ats. I think the exception is 2+ save stuff, reducing them to a 3+ double the damage that should get through (goes from ~83% saved to ~66% saved, ~17% more damage). Of course if they are in cover and not marked to 4 lights they would ignore the ats anyway. I feel like 3 man stealth teams with 1 drone controller and a bunch of gun drones might hurt more. Keep the fusions on the stealth suits for tank popping, maybe give them velocity tracker if you think you will be dealing with fly stuff. How does the list do with the single markerlight?

StrikerTommy wrote:
I have been doing a bunch of mathhammer for my friend who plays Tau to crunch numbers on crisis suits, drones, commanders, etc.
He has been using his 2 stealth teams with homing beacons and stim injectors to allow crisis suits and commanders pop in close to enemy characters to pop them. Crisis stuff might be too expensive for 1000 points though.

Against most infantry taking more burst cannons gives you more damage than an ats. I think the exception is 2+ save stuff, reducing them to a 3+ double the damage that should get through (goes from ~83% saved to ~66% saved, ~17% more damage). Of course if they are in cover and not marked to 4 lights they would ignore the ats anyway. I feel like 3 man stealth teams with 1 drone controller and a bunch of gun drones might hurt more. Keep the fusions on the stealth suits for tank popping, maybe give them velocity tracker if you think you will be dealing with fly stuff. How does the list do with the single markerlight?

Mmhmm, I love the old school feel of Crisis Suits, but they are a little too expensive for a 1000 point list at the moment. The stats about the gun drones are interesting, I probably have to invest in some more now. I'm not quite sure how the list will do with a single markerlight, which is one of my main worries of fielding this list. In my old version, I had two minimum sized teams of Pathfinders, and even then I found markerlight support lacking at times.

The stuff you're using in this list is more or less where I've ended up at the moment. T'au was my first army, and I started playing them because I liked the stealthsuit models so much. Likewise, I was stoked as hell when ghostkeels were released. In 8th, I've been experimenting with lots of different stuff, but I finally wound up right where I started. Our stealth options are really, really good right now. I ran the following list against raven guard primaris in a campaign last night, and won. Granted, the mission felt stacked in my favour in terms of objective-holding, but I was well out-killing my opponent too. The list is for 1783 points. It was a 1750 point game, but the ground I hold in the campaign gave me an extra 33 points.

VANGUARD DETACHMENT
Commander w/ 4 fusion blasters
2 MV4 Shield Drones

XV95 Ghostkeel Battlesuit w/ cyclic ion raker, 2 burst cannons, advanced targeting system, and early warning override
2 MV5 Stealth Drones
XV95 Ghostkeel Battlesuit w/ cyclic ion raker, 2 burst cannons, advanced targeting system, and early warning override
2 MV5 Stealth Drones
XV95 Ghostkeel Battlesuit w/ cyclic ion raker, 2 burst cannons, advanced targeting system, and early warning override
2 MV5 Stealth Drones
5 XV25 Stealth Battlesuits w/ 5 burst cannons and 5 advanced targeting systems
5 XV25 Stealth Battlesuits w/ 5 burst cannons and 5 advanced targeting systems

12 Tactical Drones consisting of
9 MV7 Marker Drones
3 MV4 Shield Drones
12 Tactical Drones consisting of
9 MV7 Marker Drones
3 MV4 Shield Drones

XV88 Broadside Battlesuit w/ heavy rail rifle, 2 smart missile systems, seeker missile, and drone controller
2 MV8 Missile Drones
XV88 Broadside Battlesuit w/ heavy rail rifle, 2 smart missile systems, seeker missile, and drone controller
2 MV8 Missile Drones

Vakruz wrote:
I always forget about the vanguard and the other detachments, my local area's events always req a battalion

They REQUIRE a battalion?!
The rules specifically say that you can be battle forged and do not require anything other than battle forged for matched play.
I'm curious. Are brigades okay instead of battalions?

Every list I make pretty much forgoes the command points. There are some good stratagems, but typically my armies give me points back for free (AM + SM) so I don't stress about taking units I don't really want for more CP.

Benn Roe wrote:
The stuff you're using in this list is more or less where I've ended up at the moment.

How have you been finding the Marker Drones? I had a handful in an original variation of this list, but I found them to be too unreliable, especially with their poor BS. Though, it looks like you went for quantity of markerlights in your list to overcome that seeing as how you don't have any Drone Controllers.

I'd drop the fireblade and the broadside in favour of 2 commanders with 4x plasma and 4 fusion blasters. You could also add 2x gun drones (1 for each commander) for a total of 296 points.

These commanders would be far more mobile and accurate than your broadside.

Also for your ghost keel you labelled the drones as suits:

"- 2x MV5 Stealth Suits"

 gossipmeng wrote:
I'd drop the fireblade and the broadside in favour of 2 commanders with 4x plasma and 4 fusion blasters. You could also add 2x gun drones (1 for each commander) for a total of 296 points.

These commanders would be far more mobile and accurate than your broadside.

I keep hearing about how amazing Commander suits are, but my only concern is having to chase down enough bits to mount all the guns (I believe each Commander kit only comes with one of each weapon). Way back when, I had a small army of crisis suits, but I've since sold them off so I currently have nothing in my bitz box that would help me.

Are any of the other weapons worth it on the Commander? I can see Burst Cannons as being a little underwhelming, but the Missile Pod and CIB look intriguing ...

 orchewer wrote:

Benn Roe wrote:
The stuff you're using in this list is more or less where I've ended up at the moment.

How have you been finding the Marker Drones? I had a handful in an original variation of this list, but I found them to be too unreliable, especially with their poor BS. Though, it looks like you went for quantity of markerlights in your list to overcome that seeing as how you don't have any Drone Controllers.

I actually am running drone controllers; they're on my broadsides. The marker/shield drone blobs camp out with the broadsides. In the early turns they're reliable marker tokens because of their quantity. In later turns they become broadside insurance when necessary. I'm definitely happy with them. Pathfinders are definitely more flexible and don't need a drone controller, but they're also slightly squishier and don't do much to protect my big guns. The strength of this style list is how difficult everything is to profitably shoot. I can do a lot of damage before I start taking any casualties.

 orchewer wrote:

 gossipmeng wrote:
I'd drop the fireblade and the broadside in favour of 2 commanders with 4x plasma and 4 fusion blasters. You could also add 2x gun drones (1 for each commander) for a total of 296 points.

These commanders would be far more mobile and accurate than your broadside.

I keep hearing about how amazing Commander suits are, but my only concern is having to chase down enough bits to mount all the guns (I believe each Commander kit only comes with one of each weapon). Way back when, I had a small army of crisis suits, but I've since sold them off so I currently have nothing in my bitz box that would help me.

Are any of the other weapons worth it on the Commander? I can see Burst Cannons as being a little underwhelming, but the Missile Pod and CIB look intriguing ...

Burst cannons are a waste on your commander, but the missile pods/CIB are good as well. You can run 4 of those weapons or 3 and an ATS for the better AP value.

Yeah, burst cannons and flamers are a bit wasted on commanders, but everything else is worth considering. I like fusion blasters and cyclic ion blasters best.